Reptile & Amphibian Forums

do you stick your probes on the basking spot or just let them hang over it?

like this i am seeing a BIG differance in temps
so whats the measurement air temp on rock temp ?
seems like lisa may be right about these temp furthor testing is coming

like this i get 108.3
the other way i get 93.0

which one to go with i think probably this way cause that rock is about 115

I am runningmy own test.... will post a picture in 10 mins or so

>>like this i get 108.3
>>the other way i get 93.0
>>
>>which one to go with i think probably this way cause that rock is about 115
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Lisa
www.beginnersbasics.com

the closer i get to the rock the closer the temp gets to the gun. like it sits in the second picture i have 109.9 the gun gives me 111

Ok here we go,

I let it sit 10 minutes to gain temp. Here is what I found....

I would tend to belive the probe hanging about 3" above the rock is the correct temp. If you notice, the two on the back wall are only 2 or 3 degrees lower. However, the huge one on the rock shot over 125 almost instantly.

I go with the probe hanging temp. This set up has been this way for 6 months and I have never had a issue with this particular Beardie.

>>the closer i get to the rock the closer the temp gets to the gun. like it sits in the second picture i have 109.9 the gun gives me 111

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Lisa
www.beginnersbasics.com

In addition I am going to add, that I don't like the temp guns... I believe they read the closest surface temp in the direction you point it, which in this case would be the rock. We all know that rocks tend to gather and hold heat VERY well.

Just my opinion

>>Ok here we go,
>>
>>
>>I let it sit 10 minutes to gain temp. Here is what I found....
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>I would tend to belive the probe hanging about 3" above the rock is the correct temp. If you notice, the two on the back wall are only 2 or 3 degrees lower. However, the huge one on the rock shot over 125 almost instantly.
>>
>>I go with the probe hanging temp. This set up has been this way for 6 months and I have never had a issue with this particular Beardie.
>>
>>
>>>>the closer i get to the rock the closer the temp gets to the gun. like it sits in the second picture i have 109.9 the gun gives me 111
>>
>>
>>-----
>>Lisa
>>www.beginnersbasics.com
>>
>>
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Lisa
www.beginnersbasics.com

the rocks also transfer the heat to dragonpretty good so if your talking a rock with a temp of a 130 and and air temp of 110 what temp do you use

ok hanging 3 inches above we are talking 20° differance this could be leathal

about 2 weeks ago a started using the temp gun to measure my temp since than i have had
1 baby dragon die and one get sick and throw up undigested food. and i never had the problems before. even though my dragon that got sick doesn;t spend much time directly under the basking light i think it is possably because it isn;t much warmer than wear he sits most of the time they are always near it. i put the whole unit in there and it is only up to 96 so far

mat
lisai am starting to agree with you that these guns are not accurate

i put the unti in side the ank like this and i barly get 99.1 i tend to go with this temp

i am fixing to up my wattage to a 150 watt bulb and see what happens see if i can;t get the extra 10 degrees i need

I tell you what I have done to change things though..... I am getting rid of rocks for basking sites and switching to grapevine or a half log, etc. That rock was an "unknown" temp since it maxed out way over the thermometer's reading capacity. Having that rock there could have been as bad as having a plug in heat rock!!

>>i put the unti in side the ank like this and i barly get 99.1 i tend to go with this temp
>>
>>i am fixing to up my wattage to a 150 watt bulb and see what happens see if i can;t get the extra 10 degrees i need
>>
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Lisa
www.beginnersbasics.com

well the temp reads 101.8 already and it's only been about 4 min and belive it or not my sick male has already perked up standing nice and tall and for the first time in a long time doing hand waves,
lisa the slat i have right now is 150 °F via my temp gun it may not be very good for measuring ambient temp but it will slap read a surafce temp (which by the way what they where made for) i just felt that they could get pretty close to the ambient temp i was wrong

Mat

Ok I will throw my two cents in here. Being a Mechanical Engineer that loves heat transfer makes me think I understand this pretty well. Ok Temp guns definately do Read surface temperature. No questions asked. It doesn't measure air temperature. Thermometers tend to measure an air temperature. Now how heat lights work. They emit light, probably some infrared, and probably some UV (most a some b). This light isn't absorbed by the air all that much, some is the rest isn't. This light hits a surface. The surface reflects some light away, and some of the light is absorbed. Absorbed light = heat. This heat causes the temperature of the substance absorbing light to rise. The darker the color the more light it absorbs usually. The air doesn't heat up that much because it doesn't absorb the light, it gains its heat from surronding surfaces that absorb heat via radiation. Air is actually one of the better insulators. If you use your light to make the air temperature 3" above a surface 110F the surface itself will probably be about 200F. Think of it like this. Air 3" above pavement is 110F, would you want to stand on that pavement? I wouldn't because it would probably give me a pretty good burn. So your dragon wants to warm up, it climbs up onto its basking site. The air around the basking site is not warming your dragon up, the light is. The light is absorbed by the dragons skin and is converted into heat, which leads to the dragons body temperature going up. If the air is 120F the dragon will be absorbing heat from the 120F air and from the light. Not a good thing, cooked dragons, also the dragon would pobably be burned by the surface near the 110F air. For this reason I use a surface temp of 110F. That means the dragon will be able to absorb enough light that it will be able to raise its body temperature to 110F if it so desires. If the air temp is 110F 3" away the dragon will be able to overheat alot. Also dragons I believe can control blood flow to the skin surface, blood absorbs almost all light, allowing the dragon to easily warm its blood when desired by increasing blood flow to the skin's surface. For the reason that heat lights cause heating by absorption of radiation black faced thermometers will overread what the temperature you dragon will be able to maitain as it absorbs more light (because it is black) than your dragon does. I believe the IR temp guns are accurate to within /- 2F or /-2% which at the temps we use is basically the same. Hope this little rant helps. A side note if your dragon becomes too hot, because it can't escape high temps or heats up to too high a temp too quickly, its bodies proteins and enzymes will not function properly. These proteins and enzymes also will not be manufactured properly. Both of these things can lead to health issues and/or death. This is why if you have a fever that goes over 104F (i think that is the number) you better get to the ER because at 108 (again a guess) you are pretty much going to die for the above reason. Too hot for a dragon is just as bad as too cold.
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Derek Affonce
DeKeAff Exotics
dekeaffexotics.com

That was my whole point at first is that it only reads a surface temp and couldn't be trusted to give you a reading on the basking site air temp. He had bought one, used it and thought the air temp was too high and reduced it.

>>Ok I will throw my two cents in here. Being a Mechanical Engineer that loves heat transfer makes me think I understand this pretty well. Ok Temp guns definately do Read surface temperature. No questions asked. It doesn't measure air temperature. Thermometers tend to measure an air temperature. Now how heat lights work. They emit light, probably some infrared, and probably some UV (most a some b). This light isn't absorbed by the air all that much, some is the rest isn't. This light hits a surface. The surface reflects some light away, and some of the light is absorbed. Absorbed light = heat. This heat causes the temperature of the substance absorbing light to rise. The darker the color the more light it absorbs usually. The air doesn't heat up that much because it doesn't absorb the light, it gains its heat from surronding surfaces that absorb heat via radiation. Air is actually one of the better insulators. If you use your light to make the air temperature 3" above a surface 110F the surface itself will probably be about 200F. Think of it like this. Air 3" above pavement is 110F, would you want to stand on that pavement? I wouldn't because it would probably give me a pretty good burn. So your dragon wants to warm up, it climbs up onto its basking site. The air around the basking site is not warming your dragon up, the light is. The light is absorbed by the dragons skin and is converted into heat, which leads to the dragons body temperature going up. If the air is 120F the dragon will be absorbing heat from the 120F air and from the light. Not a good thing, cooked dragons, also the dragon would pobably be burned by the surface near the 110F air. For this reason I use a surface temp of 110F. That means the dragon will be able to absorb enough light that it will be able to raise its body temperature to 110F if it so desires. If the air temp is 110F 3" away the dragon will be able to overheat alot. Also dragons I believe can control blood flow to the skin surface, blood absorbs almost all light, allowing the dragon to easily warm its blood when desired by increasing blood flow to the skin's surface. For the reason that heat lights cause heating by absorption of radiation black faced thermometers will overread what the temperature you dragon will be able to maitain as it absorbs more light (because it is black) than your dragon does. I believe the IR temp guns are accurate to within /- 2F or /-2% which at the temps we use is basically the same. Hope this little rant helps. A side note if your dragon becomes too hot, because it can't escape high temps or heats up to too high a temp too quickly, its bodies proteins and enzymes will not function properly. These proteins and enzymes also will not be manufactured properly. Both of these things can lead to health issues and/or death. This is why if you have a fever that goes over 104F (i think that is the number) you better get to the ER because at 108 (again a guess) you are pretty much going to die for the above reason. Too hot for a dragon is just as bad as too cold.
>>-----
>>Derek Affonce
>>DeKeAff Exotics
>>dekeaffexotics.com
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Lisa
www.beginnersbasics.com

Your explanation makes perfect sense. I always believed it was the surface temp one should measure but could not adequately explain why. I now use temp guns verses digital themometers and feel they give a relatively accurate surface temp reading. On my gun, when you move it over the surface the temp changes giving you an idea where the hottest spot is and where the cooler spot is located.
Thanks for a good explanation.
Karen

after chewing on this for a while i realized what my mistake was after grim and i spoke about this.
i droped my surface temps down to 110 thus greatly reducing the amount of radiant heat.

however know that i understand if you are using over ehad light and a temp gun you should have surface temps of 115-120 with an air temp of 110 3 inches over the basking site the surface was almost 160 degrees just like grim said that is way to hot. i don;t think the drop in heat killed my baby but i am sure it didn't help her none.

all my guys are back up and doing great again now that thier heat is back where it should be.

after thining about it all day and the conversation that grim and i had i don;t think there is any better way to measure temp than with this temp gun as long as you are aware that surface needs to be around 115-120 but liek i said be warned a temp of 110 3 inch above the basking site yeilded surface temps of 160

Mat