Reptile & Amphibian Forums

My fiance and I are thinking about getting 1:1 veiled chams. A pet store we get our crickets from just got in about 30 little babies - maybe 1.5-2" tops. Tony has ALWAYS wanted to get chams for his help collection... Any suggestions? What should we look for in the babies? How in the world do you make sure they eat the crickets? and do you use 1/4" or pinheads? I'm finding conflicting info online, and am looking for advice. Thanks a ton! the little guys are SOOOOOO CUTE!!!!

~Buggzter
2:1 collered lizards
1:0 fiance
0:1 toddler

First off, don't buy a male and female from this same batch of babies. Most likely they are all related and you don't want to encourage any further inbreeding with this species. Its already rampant, has been since the mid 90's.
I would buy a male now (they have little spurs on their back feet) and then in a few months after you're sure you are ready for the continued committment, try to find an unrelated female.
You'll need to house them seperately as this species does not typicaly to well when housed together. So be prepared for two cages, two sets of lighting and watering supplies, ect..
You really should only introduce them when they are old enough to breed but you have plenty of time to read up before then.
In regards to feeding them, the size of the prey depends on the size of the chameleon. I would think that these baby veiled could handle 1/4" crickets.
Feed out of a cup placed up high in their enclosure to make sure they are getting the desired amount of food. Remove what they don't eat before lights out.
Vary the diet between crickets, waxworms, mealworms, flies, ect.. Dust with repcal and a good quality multi vitamin twice to three times per week but no more. Gut feed your crickets with fresh greens and vegetables, the morning before feeding as well.
There are many good books out there now and check out this site for more experienced hobbyists as well. There are many veiled keepers here: http://www.chameleonforums.com/
Good luck and think about all that is needed before you impulse buy!

I just reread your post and see that these babies are only 1.5 to 2 inches. They should not be fed 1/4" crickets as they could choke. I would feed 1/8" or week old crickets at the biggest or pinheads to be safe.
Also at this size, I don't think there are mealworms small enough for them, so try to find small curly winged house flies, large flightless fruitflies, small waxworms, ect..
Good luck.

hey,i would not suggest you buying from a pet store,they tend to not have the healthest chams..also at reptile shows,they don't usually have the healthest of chams..last reptile show i went to they had about 30 sub-adult/adults in one cage and 3/4 of them had their eyes closed the whole time i was watching them..if i were you i'd go to www.chameleonsonly.com and buy one from them,you'll definitly get your moneys worth there..in my opinion they are the #1 breeder out there right now,not just because i got my cham from them,but because they care more about the chams health more then they'd care about the sale in my opinion..soo id suggest checking that site out,they have plenty of veileds,panthers,parsons,fischers,and flapneck chams for sale right now..and plenty of each type..hope that helps..have fun checking out all the different chams
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Jonny Blaze
1.0 Nosy Be Panther
s136.photobucket.com/albums/q173/jonnyblaze_04/?sc=3

You said...."My fiance and I are thinking about getting 1:1 veiled chams. A pet store we get our crickets from just got in about 30 little babies - maybe 1.5-2" tops" ...IMHO,if you are planning to breed them then it would be a good idea to buy them from different parents so you aren't inbreeding.

You said..."Any suggestions?"...chameleons are not one of the easiest lizards to keep...so I would suggest that you learn as much about them as you can before you get them. Here are some sites to start with...
http://adcham.com/
http://www.chameleonnews.com/
http://www.uvguide.co.uk/skintests.htm

You said..."What should we look for in the babies?"...first of all I wouldn't recommend that you buy one that is under 3 or 4 months of age since you are new to chameleons. There is a natural mortality rate in young chameleons, and hopefully that will help you to avoid it. Look for ones that are active...eyes not shut...straight arms (no signs of MBD)...look at how they are cared for in the store, etc.

You asked..."How in the world do you make sure they eat the crickets? and do you use 1/4" or pinheads?"...the size of the cricket should be about the width of the space between the eyes of the chameleon....so it depends on the size of your chameleon. Young chameleons are always hungry so there should be no problem getting them to eat crickets. You can also offer other small insects that are usually available to buy these days.

Its important to have a UVB light or to provide exposure to direct sunlight. Neither should pass through glass or plastic. Exposure to UVB/sunlight allows the chameleon to produce vitamin D3 which allows it to use the calcium supplied in its diet.

Appropriate basking temperatures are important so that the chameleons can warm up so that they can digest their food properly, thus absorb nutrients.

Most insects have a poor ratio of calcium to phosphorous...so dusting the insects before feeding them to the chameleon with a phosphorous-free calcium powder helps to compensate for this.

Its important to gutload the insects with a nutritious diet too before feeding them to your chameleons.

I dust lightly with a vitamin powder twice a month too. I use one with a beta carotene source of vitamin A because it can't build up in the system. Preformed vitamin A can. There is some controversy over whether chameleons can convert beta carotene or if they need preformed...so some people give them a very little bit of preformed once in a while.

When chameleons are kept under artificial light, they may need a little bit of D3/calcium powder a couple of times a month on their insects too. D3 from supplements can build up in the system so its important not to over-do it.

Hydration is important too...water can be provided by misting the cage several times a day and using a dripper. There are all kinds of foggers and misters that can be set up to run automatically too.

You are right when you say "the little guys are SOOOOOO CUTE!!!!'"...but they are delicate too.

Hope this helps!

Oops! Forgot to say that calcium, phosphorous, vitamins A and D3 play a big part in bone health and need to be in balance.

Once the chameleons are 4 or 5 months old, they should not be housed together. Its very stressful and you will force the female to reproduce before she is full grown. They should be visually separtated too. They may even have to be separated before that age if there are any signs of aggression.

If you get a female, once the female is sexually mature she can lay eggs even when not mated...so its important to provide her with a suitable place to dig.

Thanks you guys! Tony and I have been looking up the info on various chams for awhile, but I never really thought about a BABY baby... There are various adults we've seen, but none in top health, and none we can verify are CB so far. That's why these little guys are such a find: CBB and just come from the breeder Wednesday, so the store has NOT had a chance to corrupt them yet. Tony had a coupel chams before (4 years ago I think), but not veileds, and I've had various lizards in the past.

I looked carefully for health and no signs of MBD. We are just starting our cricket colonies, so we'll have the ability to gut-load them from the start and we have vitamin and calcium powders all set for them. And I'm looking for a good hibiscus plant for the cage.

Tony isn't too sure about two cages, and I wouldn't put two in one (don't want to stress them more than is normal), so we might just get one for now until we get things together (like getting married...).

As for male vs. female, what are the benefits of having just a male first compared to a female first?

At the same pet store, there are a 1:1 set who are in the SAME cage and the girl is so dark and stressed, and the male is all bright and meanish... I only went there b/c the collareds were hungry and that store opens first, and there were the cutest little chams - some are BRIGHT blue! So pretty... I can hardly wait until they grow up... But on the other hand, that female is SOOOO friendly - she just wanted to climb around me and lipped my PURPLE shirt (?) and explored... The male just hissed and threatened to bite... But they are $140 each, and I don't want to spend that for animals that I don't know where they came from...

Does coloring come more from the mom or dad? any diff? They are so pretty that I want to make sure we can get some equally pretty babies in the future. Anyhoo, Thanks again so much! ttyl!

~Buggzter

Just a reminder...most chams are not really "friendly". They are not social creatures by nature. What you may interpret as friendly may be simple attempts to get out of a too small cage or to get to the highest (safest in the cham world) point. As many chams get older and their hormones kick in, that tolerant juvenile may turn into a hissing beast. Granted, most chams just bluff and even if they do bite it's not serious. Nothing you can really do to predict or change this. The amount of handling they get as juveniles doesn't always guarrantee a nice adult. Little hatchlings this age are delicate, tricky, can die for no obvious reason, are super hard to medicate if they do get sick, and need an amazing amount of tiny food that's hard to keep in the cage. Coloration is really variable in cbb veileds so it is hard to predict unless you know the parents' bloodlines.

You asked..."As for male vs. female, what are the benefits of having just a male first compared to a female first?"...males live longer and females can produce eggs even if not mated.