Reptile & Amphibian Forums

These are my leopard geckos Aruba and Bambi. Aruba is about 6.5" and Bambi is almost 4". Please go to the link at the bottom to see their photos. I purchased both of these geckos for their laid back personalities and beautiful looks. I am new to geckos so please help me find the right words to describe their coloring. I am pretty sure Aruba is normal, however she has very bold and few spots compared to others I've seen at her age. She also is turning a brighter yellow as she ages and is not fading like the others I've seen. Bambi's spots are obviously different. Her bands are very light in color and always have been, but she is still a very bright yellow. I am pretty sure she isn't jungle because of the normal, relatively unbroken banded tail (although the underside is broken) I would like to know if either of them are high yellow or if there is anything else I should know about them. So many terms out there! Thank you!
Aruba and Bambi Photo Album

they're very cute little geckos, but I hope you don't mind if I make a few suggestions on how to improve their housing...

1. They really shouldn't be housed together. Even if they are both females, they can fight. Fighting leos can severely injure and even kill each other. Trust me, I've seen two females go at each other like they were aiming for the kill, and it is horrifying.

2. SAND!!! It might look 'cool' but it's not natural to them, and they WILL ingest it. They will get a mouthful of it every time they lunge after a bug, and they pick up particles of it on their tongues as they 'taste' the air. Babies are particularly susceptible to impaction, and by the time you see signs of impaction, it's often too late. View this link to see what 'digestible' calci-sand did to this gecko:
homepage.mac.com/exoticdvm/reptile/PhotoAlbum181.html

They are both female. They were housed together in a large tank with many other geckos and were both temp sexed, and the larger is confirmed female. I work at a pet store and am pet care specialist in reptiles and avians and know the basics. We always house our leopard geckos on sand. I am very aware of ingestion problems and watch carefully for symptoms. Leopard geckos come from Pakistan and are desert reptiles, which I am quite sure you know, so it is actually quite natural for them. However I am quite aware of problems with hachlings under 5" ingesting the sand. This is actually thicker grained playground type sand and not the ingestable kind. The fine calci-sand always caused problems at our store before switching. We have not had a compaction case for over 2 years on it. Besides the meal worms, I also always feed crickets and waxworms in a separate tank. Thank you for your suggestions and concerns though I was planning on moving the younger girl as soon as I set up a new tank.

ingest |in?jest| verb [ trans. ] take (food, drink, or another substance) into the body by swallowing or absorbing it.

Explain to me please what type of sand is not capable of being ingested? Leos can and will eat anything that they can fit in their mouths. Having seen one get impacted from sand, I can tell you that it's not pretty, and that they do suffer for it. Please get either paper towels, slate, or cage carpet. My personal preference is for paper towels - cheap, easy to clean, doesn't look too bad, etc...

It's natural for them to have predators too...would you recommend keeping a bunch of cats and having no top on the leo's terrarium? Just because something is natural doesn't mean it's the healthiest possible situation for them.
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0.1 Albino Leopard Gecko - Tigger
0.1 Crested Gecko - Pooh-Bear

hmmm always quite a debate with this...calci sand isnt the worst thing, or the best either. many herp breeders tend not to use it as it is a potential killer, although most substrates are. my vet said its all up to the owner. i thought my leo was impacted from sand, but after a check up it wasnt, thankfully. i have to disagree with towel's being easy to clean however, as you have to move the cage around to replace the towels, which should be every time the leo excretes, which can be a pain. especially if you mist the cage everyday. they stick together and become disfigured from the water and heat. even my vet said to put my leo on bark chip's, as they will be too big for it to eat, although the sharp edges seemed to point me in the opposite direction. if you want to keep using sand, keep checkin on your leo to make sure he isnt eating it. if it starts to eat it, remove the sand straight away and get it to your vet. having a dish of calci dust will help water down the risk of impaction, but like i said, it does depend on the owner. i myself have put my leo back on calci sand for easy cleaning, and havent noticed my leo eat sand once. it gets a little (or used to) when it goes to grab crix, but other than that i never saw it eat sand, and its only 2 feet away from my comp desk. you can get a special turf that works as a great substrate. doesnt look as good as sand, but is just as effective. (i'll get shouted at for saying this) but dont listen to everythign you hear, but take notice of it.

Mine is in the middle of the living room and I am there almost all day. Like I said the only thing I do feed in the cage are meal worms and my leos usually eat them in the feeding bowl. I have never seen them eat the sand when they eat either. I do feed crickets and things they lunge for in a sep. plastic container and will continue to do so until the baby is over 5" if I do not remove the younger leo. However, I firmaly believe in keeping animals as natural as possible as it seems to reduce stress without the obvious possible problems with sand. I kept my rats on real grass as well. I am watching them carefully for symtoms and am a certified vet assistant (although I do not work at the vet anymore) so getting vet opinions and help is not a problem.

Anyways, thank you for your concern everyone. It is nice seeing people looking out for the well being of pets and other animals. I am sorry this turned into a sort of debate on substrates.

dont be daft, its what were here for. i mean im no pro with herp's, but have heard alot to know what im talking about (sometimes...lol)

why would you think that you have to remove the gecko from the enclosure to clean up paper towels? as long as the paper towels are not one large contiguous strip, just get the gecko to move to the other end of the enclosure, pick them up, put down fresh, done. of course, my opinion on this may be colored by the fact that my gecko lives in a 20 gallon long, so there's plenty of room for her in the other end of the tank from where she goes to the bathroom, esp for the 1 minute or so that it takes to change out her bathroom area's paper towels.
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0.1 Albino Leopard Gecko - Tigger
0.1 Crested Gecko - Pooh-Bear

Have you ever been to Pakistan, or seen pictures?

It may be desert, but it's not a cactus-and-dunes desert. It's hard-packed clay and rocks, with scrubby brush. If you watch a leo hunt, you can clearly tell that they are NOT adapted for hunting on sand. No animal is going to live long in a sandy desert if they charge face-first into the dunes and eat a mouthful of sand every time they chase a cricket.

I know nothing about different morphs, but I can say that your two are definately cute!!

They are cute, and I would hate anything happen to them. As i do agree with enmon on this whole situation as well. Sand is not what they are found on in pakistan, yes mixtures of sand and dirt and soil, but not just straight sand. So it's not really close to their natural habitat. Although to each his own, studies have shown that geckos on sand verses papertowels, or tile, that they live longer due to not having any impaction or any other issues with sand.

I also agree having the 2 together is very stressful especially on the new little on, as he does need some fattening up as well his tail is very very skinny.Waxies i also hope you are only feeding like 1 a week at most, as they are addicting to leos, it's like crack for them.

Too each his own though, just my opinion. Good luck!

Hi, I can't really answer your question about the color morphs, but they both look like normals to me.

Also, you'll soon learn that no matter what question you ask on gecko forums, someone will reply with "you shouldn't keep them on sand, blah blah blah". I'm not sure if it's the only thing they've ever heard or if it's just their favorite thing to regurgitate.

You seem well aware impaction issues and you are correct, they can be kept on sand with a very low risk of problems. That's according to Vosjoli and Tremper's book, "The Herpetoculture of Leopard Geckos". But maybe they don't know what they're talking about.

They can be kept on sand it has been documented as ok, but they do have shorter life spans and they shouldn't be babies in anyway on sand. It should be only adults at least 100g and a year old.

>>They can be kept on sand it has been documented as ok, but they do have shorter life spans and they shouldn't be babies in anyway on sand. It should be only adults at least 100g and a year old.

I agree that sand is bad and if you're going to keep them on sand it should only be as adults, but do you only keep giants or something? my 10 inch long gecko (with nicely plump, but not obese tail) weighs more like 60g, and is definitely at the maximum adult size she'll reach (more than 1.5 years old at this point).
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0.1 Albino Leopard Gecko - Tigger
0.1 Crested Gecko - Pooh-Bear

if you're going to be so disparaging of the other posters here, why bother posting?

we don't 'regurgitate' everything we hear. I know for a FACT that sand kills leos (look at the pictures in that link I posted) and it's not a natural substrate for them. Plus, sand is expensive, absorbs the ammonia from the gecko's urates, and it's dusty. If you want an impacted, dull-colored leo, go right ahead and use sand.

Tile is a WHOLE lot cheaper, lasts longer, and there's not one iota of risk involving ingestion. Even paper towels (my substrate of choice) are a better substrate than sand.

That's all fine, but the OP didn't ask about sand.

Also, I wouldn't call 5 bucks for a 60lb bag all that expensive.

if you bothered to read my first post, you'll see that I was simply offering some suggestions on how to improve the leo's environments.

I keep my leopard geckos on paper towells (better safe than sorry). However, I also keep smooth knobtail geckos (nephrurus levi levi), an Australian burrowing gecko that feeds exactly like a leo does. They live in the desert sand as their natural habitat, and the few keepers out there believe they need sand in their enclosures due to their daily burrowing requirements. I've been worried about, but have never experienced impaction, with my knobbies. Any thoughts on these or other dessert-dwelling lizards that take in some sand with their food in their natural habitat?

I personally don't use or like and either. But many have used Playsand and had no issues. Calci sand is the only sand i believe people have actually had impaction issues with. I personally have a female that is 97g and about 1 year old. So no i just said that on a precation because i don't belive in sand at all. But to each his own.

I do agree with you begun that people need to be aware of the sand impaction issues, but some people have used it for more the 30years and have had no problems, that is playsand not calci sand. So you need to get a little less fired up about it or people are just going to look at you weird and badger as well about it. Just a heads up and just saying that everyone has their own opinions and own ways of doing things, you can't tell anyone not to post here or not to say what is on their mind.

Wow. I sure didn't want this to become a fired up debate. I have my own opinions and that is that. I appreciate everyone else's but everyone is going to be different. Why try to put your opinions on everyone who comes in? I tell you it sure is sort of scary that on my first post here asking about colour, I get discouraged and have people tell me I am doing an awful job caring for my pets. Of course I'm going to be defensive. I posted on another forum and they told me exactly what I needed to know, high yellow and tangerine, poss hypo. Nobody argued about anything, nobody told me I was an awful caretaker. Sorry everyone for posting as it seems I am distressing the whole forum while just trying to show off my cute little leos.

This is also one of the best forums around. Kingsnake has many reptuatble breeders here at many times. Other forums are just forums with people posting. Non are usually professional or have even breed leos themselves, so they will tell you anything as they may not know. I believe everyone here was just trying to help you and you may just be taking it the wrong way. You need to think about your whole situatuion as well as ours here and from our point of views.