Reptile & Amphibian Forums

copied with pride from Mike (MikesMonitors)

There's a 6'x2' trough in there.

it only cost about a million dollars and 374 trips to Home Depot because I'm a newbie and have the construction skills of someone without any construction skills. It was a good time though.

Here she is lookin sexy:

I have a juv malayan and sulawesi water in there with her at the moment. They love it, too bad I will need one three times that size for them in 6 mos hahaha. Shhh dont tell my wife. The sulawesi looks amazing, I'll throw some pics up if she ever isnt buried hahah.

Thanks for the idea and pics Mike!

Tom

hrmmm hopefully these arent so small:

Nice looking enclosure... just wondering how well it holds humidity for you.

Thanks! So far so good with humidity. I was concerned because there were some big gaps here and there due to the shape of the lumber and fitting them together. I used some plastic wood to fill some gaps, then I tried construction adhesive and finally tried that expanding foam stuff.

I found out that expanding foam stuff requires a sand blaster to remove from your fingers and really expands a lot. A whole lot. It is like THE BLOB that never stops expanding all over your nice cage like sticky concrete balloons. It ended up looking like I sat a 2 yr old inside with a gallon jug of glue and said go for it. Luckily I covered most of it up with fake foliage haha.

I was trying to make something good for them to live in as well as good for a display. So far so good, they are all eating like monitors and digging all over. They’ve got that ‘I’m really excited’ look on their face as they roam around.

Tom

Cool deal. I'm currently building a new cage for my roughneck because he's outgrown his previous cage... and although I really like the design on yours, it's too late in the game for me to change now. Hehe. Hopefully it turns out looking decent enough, and I finish it in time for him to be able to make use of it!
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1.0 Black Roughneck Monitor
1.0 Northern Emerald Tree Boa
0.1 Red Tail Boa

Okay, I'm joking around 'cause you know I love you all. But I still have to shake my head at this. Sorry, don't mean to be a downer.

...

ha no downer, I dont see the problem though. I need a display, but I want to provide what they need as well. The standard trough with plywood or plexi attached is functional and works great...it just looks like crap. This isnt for a warehouse or breeding center, this is for my home.

Actually those timbers are a pretty cost effective way to go too.

Tom

I wrote a big old reply but deleted it as It would like normal cause lots of problems.

First off, its beautiful. You did a great job.

But that cage has nothing to do with monitors or that rudi. That is the problem. A cages first requirement is to HOUSE the inmate properly. Not to decorate your living room. Of course you can do both.

You have to consider, and I am very serious about this, what is pretty to you is not pretty to monitors. They do enjoy certain visions, but not exactly the ones you like.

All monitors first choice is to be IN something, a hole, a crevice, a hollow log. This shelter needs, no has to be, in the sun or partly in the sun. This shelter must have a view, that is, so they can see out to MONITOR what is going on around them. They would like a nice scene, only they want to see it, not be it.

Now this relates to you is, your making them the scene. They want a home first, then places to do what they do, second.

What they do is climb(not in your cage) dig(not in your cage and hunt, very limited in your cage. Your cage is far too small for rudis. Also its mostly the part they do not use, AIR SPACE.

If your cage works well, the monitor will arrange it and rearrange it, thats WHAT THEY DO IN THEIR SPARE TIME. Oh, in a cage, all their time is spare time.

So, If I were you, I would get some anoles, or some other small non destructive lizard, or frogs. Then make it look like a wonderful scene from indo.

Again you did a great job. Just not for monitors. And we are monitor folks. I would love to see the workmenship you put in that cage, put into one that works for the monitor. Cheers

thanks for the input and compliments!

I am gonna try some more, and then some more, and then some more....I'll get this right someday hahah.

but honestly I thought this may work. It has 20" of packed substrate...I took natural forest mulch and cypress mulch and ran it through my vac shredder two times, mixed it really good with a little sand and soil and packed it down in the trough. My neighbors got a kick out of me dumping 12 bags of mulch on the driveway and running over it back and forth with the shredder. They are used to me hollowing out logs with an axe, etc for my toucan but they still just stare.

Anyway all of them are often 12" or more down in the substrate. Actually they are everywhere in there all day, deep in the substrate, up on the flora, in the water, over under this light, then that light, back to dig, etc. It has really been entertaining to watch. Everytime I come back to look something has been moved or toppled over. Hmmm maybe I will take apart the top and add another 9" or so to give more climbing options.

Thanks again, I love to hear it...my goal was to provide what they need first and a display second. Seems I got that backwards, common newbie mistake I am sure.

Tom

I hope this helps you. Manifacturerd materials like your doing are not exactly good for reptiles. Including most store bought materials. The reason is, newly shredded wood materials are full of splinters, and this often is very uncomfortable to monitors, as such, they will not use it.

These splinters can and do cause problems.

Also manmade sands are the same, they are crushed rock, consider, sand is what glass is made out of. Crush it and it creates sharpe edges.

Natural plant materials do not contain splinters as they are not shredded. Natural sands are rounded from the natural process of movement(natural polishing)

Also another great thing about troughs, they hold in crickets, a cage like yours pretty much eliminates the use of crickets, as they will be all over your house. Crickets and similar insects are an important option. Cheers

My first reptile was a water monitor. I raised it up, my husbandry was lacking but it grew quickly and never seemed to have any problems that I was aware of. One day I noticed some bubbling from a nostril. I took the monitor straight to the vet. The man looked him over and said he thought he had found the problem. I held the poor fella tightly while the vet proceeded to pull a splinter of cypress about 2-1/2" long from the lizards nose hole with a pair of hemostats. This happened a long time ago but I think the vet said the splinter had caused an infection that would have quickly spread to the u.r.

yeah I was worried about that so I shredded all the mulch two more times in a walk behind 9hp leaf vac. Not sure if that will still be bad news but it does pack in there pretty well and they dig like crazy in it. Thanks,

Tom

thanks, hey you do realize there is a 6'x2' water trough in there right? There is substrate from the bottom to just under the start of the timbers. I know there are still issues but I was hoping substrate depth isnt one of them.

Tom

No substrate depth in not an issue, substrate lenght is.

This thing about digging has without question gone stupid. All people think about is digging. I have an idea, why not think about why they are digging.

Birds flew. But would you call keeping a bird in tiny cage standing on its perch flapping its wings, FLYING. No, its flapping its wings. Which a bird does when flying, but its still not flying, its just flapping its wings.

Which leads to this, monitors dig for reasons, they dig to make a burrow. A burrow must be longer then the monitor, or its not a burrow, its a divit. They dig a burrow to make a home, something that allows depth and safty and comfort(right conditions)

Lets put on the thinking cap, a six foot trough for an ackie(18 avg. lenght) it can burrow four times its lenght, three longwise and one shortwise. It can also turn again and make a burrow six times its lenght. A rudi is much much longer and much much wider. So to have that for an average rudi(four foot) then you need a 16 foot long cage. But in reality that is still much smaller as the mass of the rudi is far more then four times the ackie.

So yea, that cage would be great for a small lizard like an ackie or storrs, or tristis or kimberly.

Then you stuff things in there for your enjoyment, a budda. That takes away from what the monitor can use.

Now please consider, I hit you with this a little harder then I do most, the reason is, YOU SHOWED THE ABILITY to actually do something about it.

About the crickets. The advantage of crickets is, you throw in handfulls and monitors can eat them at their leisure. That is not done with other prey items. People foolishly thing reptiles are people or dogs that are fed a few meals a day, only with monitors people feed heavy meals one a day or less, sometimes muchless. The reality is, they eat all the time, lite feedings, many times a day and heavy feedings several times a week.

You feed your bird daily, in fact, you leave a bowl of food in with it. An active monitors is near bird like in metobolism.

Which leads to this. The one reason folks are more successful with ackies is, they are little and its easy to feed them enough to allow success. With larger monitors, that is not done. Think about this, how would an ackie progress feeding on three crickets a day. By size comparision that would be like feeding three adult mice to a rudi a day.

I can go on and on, but you should get the idea, To keep a rudi at the same level most people keep ackies, you need a room size enclosure and hot areas as large as your cage is now.

Other then your cage allowing crickets a free pass to your house, you did a great job, just not for a living monitor. Oh one more thing, how will those logs stand up to years of hot and moist?? don't logs warp in those conditions. Cheers and happy cage building(where the real fun is)

haha!
ANOLE CAGE

OMG thats the funniest thing i have seen all day. except for the red hypo sav on craigslist columbus lol

I guess I am at a disadvantage. I use to consult and build large cat and bear enclosures, gorrillas too. Whats weird was, I am a reptile guy and they have me building those dang things cages.

Heres the deal, when consulting, they would tell us that we could not put any plants or medium limbs or logs and boulders and such in the cages. There reasoning was, when they kept them in small prison cells(type cages) these animals would destroy everything put in the cages. In fact they would tell us these animals would harm themselves with this natural stuff. If these animals had access to sticks, they would poke their eyes out and stick them up their bums and all such things.

Heres the kicker, they would in those small "horrible" cages.

But thats not what we were designing. When given a large cage with stuff for them to do, they did not stick everything up their bums and in their eyes. In fact, they did not destroy everything in the cage.

Which leads to you, a medium to large monitor does not have enough space in a six foot cage to do anything. Its friggin too small. So IF your monitor is healthy, it WILL tear the whole cage up. The reason is simple. What else do you expect it to do? It cannot go down a hole and rest, it cannot climb a tree and find a hollow limb or hollow area in the trunk. So whats it to do?

I have to wonder what your thinking. What are you expecting? What are your goals for that monitor. Or it is just a TV screen? Cheers

Frank,
Your post brings back memories of my zoo days. Our director's philosophy was ... fake rocks, trees and plants .... might as well have fake animals. As a result, we utilized live plants, natural substrates, rocks, and branches. Even some of the smaller cages would start to weigh 300-400 pounds. The front end loader would have to bring scoops of sand, rock, and soil for some of the medium-sized exhibits. I used to love finishing an exhibit and watching the animals so I could tweak things here and there.
They don't do quite as much of that anymore as when I worked there. During my nearly decade at the one zoo, there were NO accidents on rocks, branches, or plants. We tried to go natural at the zoo I supervised at, but the vet staff and upper administration was all worried about certain gram negative bacteria, so it was a constant battle.

AH

no man I agree totally Frank, my for sale ad was simply a joke at my expense, not a slight at your advice. I was making fun of myself.

I am still very happy with the cage, now I just have to build a bigger better version for the rudi and figure out something cool to go in this one. It would make a great display enclosure for any number of reptiles. Maybe a tv...

You do realize that forever, whatever is in that thing, it will be known as the 'anole cage'. My buddy's 3 yr old daughter just came over and said, I kid you not..."Daddy I want to see the anole cage".

Thanks again, I've been laughing all day and learned stuff too. Win win.

Tom

I can vouche for Ol' Tom he does value your advice. If you were an action figure he would own it.

Nice looking log cabin, but you better build something else soon as those 3 won't last long in that size of a cage. I hope your ready to build onto it for the rudi as well. That would probly work out well to raise them up in. I would seal the wood too just to be safe. I think I read that Mike was planning on doing that with his. Better to be safe then sorry.

thanks! yeah I sealed it with a marine grade sealer even though the acq treated lumber is supposed to be safe.

Yeah I know...those waters wont last long (not how they friggen eat they wont ahaha) but it is an ok 'second stage' until they graduate to the big daddy cage in a couple months.

Tom