Reptile & Amphibian Forums

What type of supplement do you use and where do you get it?
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.1 Snow Corn "Hope"
1. Orange Albino Black Ratsnake "Chunk" (Goonies)
.1 Orange Albino Black Ratsnake "Peaches"
.1 MO Locale Black Ratsnake "Molly" (Flogging Molly)

"Have you ever tried simply turning off the T.V., sitting down with your kids... and hitting them?"

I use the same type of calcium that I use for my bearded dragons.(Jurassic-cal) It's just plain calcium without D3. I don't think snakes really need D3 supplement like insectivores do. If you are giving dusted mice (mice coated with calcium dust) and giving them to a gravid female, or soon to be, then I'd do one dusted mouse/rat(whatever your feeding) every two weeks and give her her other food plan and normal.
Other wise once a month is fine. The calcium dust I use seems like it just mats to mice, so I only dust the face of mice to my snakes. None of my snakes are adults yet and I'm paranoid about them being calcium deprived so that's why I do it. some people don't think snakes need calcium supp and that they get all the need from feeders.
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1.0.0 Bearded Dragon (Rex- "normal" orange fire)
1.0.0 Bearded Dragon (Glutany- German Giant Mix)
0.1.0 Okeetee Corn (Okatee)
1.1.0 Spotted Python (Hotdog and Shoelace)

I always understood that vitamin D was essential for the absorbtion of calcium? If a snake is low in calcium, it's reasonable to assume it might have lower levels of other minerals and vitamins.

The way I see it, it makes sense to boost Vit D levels if you're giving a calcium supplement - just as a precaution. Otherwise you risk the calcium going in one end of the snake and whizzing straight out the other end, without doing any good.

if you have a UV lighting then you don't need to worry about D3.Human and animals will synthesis the correct amount if vitmin D with sunlight and UV light. The only real problem with D3 supplements is that it's not water soluble like with other vitamins. Meaning that the D3 will build up in the system if it's not used or to much given and can actually kill the snake or any animal for that matter. And there's no way of knowing that the vitamin D levels are dangerously high, well maybe blood testing... You can do calcium with D3, but do so sparingly. I personally just us calcium dust since I occasionally take my snakes outside.
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1.0.0 Bearded Dragon (Rex- "normal" orange fire)
1.0.0 Bearded Dragon (Glutany- German Giant Mix)
0.1.0 Okeetee Corn (Okatee)
1.1.0 Spotted Python (Hotdog and Shoelace)

There are mechanisms to avoid Vit.d3 toxicity. In it's most active form (1,25 dihydroxy d3) is a potent stimulator of intestinal calcium absorption and bone mineral reabsorption; the net effect of which is to increase serum calcium concentrations in conjunction with parathyroid hormone (PTH). However, to reach this active form d3 (formed by a UV photoreaction) must first undergo two enzymatic reactions in the liver and kidney resp. These processes are subject to feedback inhibition and thus are downregulated if too much 1,25 d3, calcium or phosphate is present in the serum. In addition, if these mechanisms are bypassed, there is an additional level of control to prevent toxicity. Namely, 1,25 d3 is converted to the vastly less active forms 24,25 d3 and 25,26 d3. If this fails, calcitonin can be released to sequester calcium back into the bone and cause increased renal excretion of calcium.

To induce toxicity, one must ingest truly stupendous quantities of d3 for a long period of time. The only case I've ever heard of was in a man who took between 200,000 and 2,000,000 IU per day for a period of two years before toxicity symptoms began to show (hypercalcemia and osteomalacia).

To put it in perspective, the recommended intake of d3 per day is 600IU. By spending 30 minutes out in the sun with exposed skin you generate 15,000IU of d3. If there were not a control mechanism highly sun exposed people would have brittle bones and arrhythmias from all the calcium in their blood.

d3 is fat soluble, which for all practical purposes means it has to be taken with a fatty meal to be absorbed properly (e.g. it requires bile secretion for solubilization and uptake in the intestine).

It's debatable whether d3 and calcium supplements are necessary in animals which consume mammals for a living and are for the most part nocturnally active. But, it couldn't hurt unless you were packing the entire mouse full of the stuff before feeding and probably not even then. The only tangible risk is calcium stones in the animal's renal system.

So is it safe to use a supplement for insectivores if only used for a brief time while she is gravid? All I really have available is like the t-rex line for leopard geckos, iguanas, chameleons, and frogs... Will those work well in small quantities?

BTW if I remember correctly snakes don't need the d3 supplement because they eat mammals which produce it. The only exception of course (to my knowledge) is the smooth and rough green snakes which are insectivores.
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.1 Snow Corn "Hope"
1. Orange Albino Black Ratsnake "Chunk" (Goonies)
.1 Orange Albino Black Ratsnake "Peaches"
.1 MO Locale Black Ratsnake "Molly" (Flogging Molly)

"Have you ever tried simply turning off the T.V., sitting down with your kids... and hitting them?"

Supplementing should be fine when gravid. But from what I've seen with calcium dust on fur, it mats thick, so only do like half a feeder or shake the food pretty hard to get the extra off.

I use calcium dust called Jurassic-Cal and seldomly use vitamin dust called Reptivite(by ZooMed)

I give my snakes a "dose" of plain calcium dust as they are still growing and I wanna make sure they have strong bones and teeth. But I only give them one mouse a month that has calcium supp. on it. I only do half the mouse's face. The extra calcium they don't need will pass through them so no biggy.

The only thing though, I dunno if this is with animals too, but when humans get too much calcium and not enough fiber you can become constipated.

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1.0.0 Bearded Dragon (Rex- "normal" orange fire)
1.0.0 Bearded Dragon (Glutany- German Giant Mix)
0.1.0 Okeetee Corn (Okatee)
1.1.0 Spotted Python (Hotdog and Shoelace)

Well if she gets constipated I will just feed her some McDonalds.....
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.1 Snow Corn "Hope"
1. Orange Albino Black Ratsnake "Chunk" (Goonies)
.1 Orange Albino Black Ratsnake "Peaches"
.1 MO Locale Black Ratsnake "Molly" (Flogging Molly)

"Have you ever tried simply turning off the T.V., sitting down with your kids... and hitting them?"

funny
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1.0.0 Bearded Dragon (Rex- "normal" orange fire)
1.0.0 Bearded Dragon (Glutany- German Giant Mix)
0.1.0 Okeetee Corn (Okatee)
1.1.0 Spotted Python (Hotdog and Shoelace)