Reptile & Amphibian Forums

i place a small rat in a zip lock bag, inside water that was heated to near boiling temperature and then poured in a plastic rubbermaid i then let the rat float for about an hour and a half. This is the method ive always used and it worked for about 2months and for two weeks none of my balls will take it.
( my colubrids and boas dont think twice) my balls act interested but then change their mind.
am i over or under thawing them?
how long do frozen rats stay good for?

They stay good for longer than you want to have them in your freezer, lol.

I like to run hot water from the sink over a bowl with the rat(s) in it. Usually thaws them out in a few minutes. Gotta dry the rat off some but it's usually not a big deal. With any of my balls that are eating normally, never had an issue with them not taking the rat when it's thawed that way.

Also could be that your balls just don't feel like eating. Try sticking the front half of the rat under a heat lamp (if you have one available) for a lil bit and then wiggling it for them. Takes longer but then you'll know for sure the balls just don't feel like eating and it's not the rat

~jenny
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"The python has, and I fib no fibs,
318 pairs of ribs.
In stating this I place reliance
On a seance with one who died for science
This figure is sworn to and attested,
He counted them while being digested."
~Ogden Nash

jenny.thegreenes.org

"If you're happy and you know it,
Bomb Iraq!
If you cannot find Osama,
Bomb Iraq!
If the terrorists are frisky,
Pakistan is looking shifty,
North Korea is too risky,
Bomb Iraq!

I'm in the process of switching my female ball to f/t. She will sometimes eat them if I wiggle it a bit then leave it in the cage. My question is how long should I leave the rat in the cage before it spoils?

I've personally never been able to 'save' one after a couple hours, but other people might have had success.

They start to stink REALLY bad if you leave em overnight on the heat pad and the snake doesn't eat em, though.

~jenny
-----
"The python has, and I fib no fibs,
318 pairs of ribs.
In stating this I place reliance
On a seance with one who died for science
This figure is sworn to and attested,
He counted them while being digested."
~Ogden Nash

jenny.thegreenes.org

"If you're happy and you know it,
Bomb Iraq!
If you cannot find Osama,
Bomb Iraq!
If the terrorists are frisky,
Pakistan is looking shifty,
North Korea is too risky,
Bomb Iraq!

lol I have never had the pleasure of smelling one that was left over night. I'v always removed the uneaten ones within a hour, usually within 30 to 45 min.

Thanks for the reply!

The real question I ask ball keepers is why even switch really think about feeding f/t is supposed me keeping these balls alot easier but from what I see in these threads its alot more of a pain than what most would admit , from the high cost of shipping f/t to the acceptance of the frozen prey by snakes as prey , my balls love the live prey and for people who say it does not make any diffrence all you have to do is observe your snakes when they feed.

Mine love live prey also. But I dont want to breed stinky rats and even though shipping is $40-50, I still end up paying less than $1 for a med-Lg rat...

That is ALOT cheaper in the end, even with shipping, than anyone I know pays for a live rat of the same size?

Also, besides one or two snakes that are really special to me and will pretty much only eat live, I tend to get get rid of the ones that are a pain in the butt to feed.

I only have two snakes and the rats grow faster than the snakes eat them. I am considering feeding the female live though because I hate feeling like I'm fighting with her to get her to eat.

Thats a good idea , I feed my balls live to me its the only way to go , I am with you I hate trying to force them to feed on f/t , I give them live prey its what they prefer and feeding has never been a problem for me and never will.

I can certainly respect the way you want to keep and feed your snakes. After all they are yours to do with what you want. But I don't really understand your negative attitude towards F/T. Nor can I understand how you can justifie statements like" my BPs are happier because I feed them live" or "if you don't think it makes a difference just observe your snakes when they feed". First off its hard not to observe your snake feeding when your offering them food from tongs. second I am curious how you know your snakes are happier. Do they tell you they are happier or maybe its the big grin they get on their little faces. Now if you think they are happier because they eat well I can tell you that my snakes must be ecstatic. Just a few examples: Albino female purchased on 10-22-06, weight 109gms. last shed with weight 4-18-07, 831 gms. Another example: Pastel female: purchased from same breeder as above on 10-22-06, weight:95gms. last shed with weight 4-22-07, 827gms. Third example: Lemon Patel female purchased on 9-5-06, weight 340gms. last shed with weight 3-1-07, 1098gms. Spider female purchased on 10-22-06, weight 175gms. last shed with weight 4-11-07, 1020gms. And the last example. orange Ghost female purchased on 12-14-06, weight 143gms. In shed now, Just weighed 4-28-07, 771 gms. All these girls have eaten F/T from the day I got them even if the breeder was feeding live. All have eaten every 3-4 days every week since I've had them. And all have averaged well over 100gms per month weigth gain and growth. In fact they have such strong feeding responses that they usually come out of the tub and grab the feeder before I can even get it in the tub. If yours don't feed like that, well I sorry.

Jeff

I dont understand why ball keepers get so angry when they have someone else with a diffrent oppinion on how they feed their balls , all I am saying is let the snakes do what they have evolved to do over millions of years and that is kill rodents simple if you want to feed f/t go ahead fine but the fact is that its done only to make the keepers job easy thats it! Its not about us the keepers its about the balls !

Listen dude I am not angry. I clearly stated that I respect the way you want to keep your animals. And I am not against feeding live. I have 2 females that will only eat live and I am OK with that. Does that mean that I don't ocassionaly try to give them a F/T? No. What ever it takes to get an animal eating and thriving is the method I prefere, wether it be live, prekilled or F/T. And I don't think that my feeding F/T is to make it easier on me, its all about the animals. You yourself stated that feeding F/T is to much work. Which I will have to admit it is more time consuming then feeding live. But I have been keeping snakes for thirty years and feed live many, many times. But I have over the years had several incidents where snakes were injured by their so called prey. Now I don't know what kind of snakes you keep or what value you place on them, but I myself have a few of $X,000.00 snakes and I just recently aquired a $XX,000.00 snake and I be damned if I am going to risk any injury from a $2.00 feeder if I don't have to. Thats all.

Jeff

P.S. I hope that that your CB females arrive safely.

I keep ball pythons , thanks for your reponse.

This is one of the reasons why I feed my balls live prey, I dont have the time to deal with f/t issues that they have , they are one of the species of snakes that I peronaly feel should be fed live due to these issues that are always mentioned by ball keepers on these threads.

But what if you have snakes like mine that tend towards the garbage disposal side?

I often switch between F/T and live, depending on what I've got on hand. Rarely have an issue with either one when they're regularly eating. Like you said though, shipping is a PAIN. I get my rats locally and just recently started makin some myself.

Just my two cents.

~jenny
-----
"The python has, and I fib no fibs,
318 pairs of ribs.
In stating this I place reliance
On a seance with one who died for science
This figure is sworn to and attested,
He counted them while being digested."
~Ogden Nash

jenny.thegreenes.org

"If you're happy and you know it,
Bomb Iraq!
If you cannot find Osama,
Bomb Iraq!
If the terrorists are frisky,
Pakistan is looking shifty,
North Korea is too risky,
Bomb Iraq!

I am lucky and have a plenty of retail stores who sale reptiles and I get them live pretty cheap,so live is the only way for me.

LOL - unfortunately people don't usually come to Kingsnake to post how flawlessly their basic husbandry is working - they post for help - thats why you only see posts about problems. Trust me there are many, many of us that feed f/t to our collections and are quite happy doing so and have no problems getting a our snakes feeding regularly on them. And for most people opening up the freezer defrosting a rat and tossing to the snake is much easier and cheaper than a trip to the pet store.
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Tosha
JET Pythons

Yep! It's like thawing out a steak from the freezer for dinner, or going out to eat at a steakhouse to get one. You still get a steak, and if you're lucky, it costs the same for either one. I'm just a fan of having steak at home

~jenny
-----
"The python has, and I fib no fibs,
318 pairs of ribs.
In stating this I place reliance
On a seance with one who died for science
This figure is sworn to and attested,
He counted them while being digested."
~Ogden Nash

jenny.thegreenes.org

"If you're happy and you know it,
Bomb Iraq!
If you cannot find Osama,
Bomb Iraq!
If the terrorists are frisky,
Pakistan is looking shifty,
North Korea is too risky,
Bomb Iraq!

I agree with Tosha... "there are many, many of us that feed f/t to our collections and are quite happy doing so and have no problems getting a our snakes feeding regularly on them."

I feed around a hundred BPs a week (a little less during breeding season) and all but 2 or 3 feed very well on F/T.

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Larry Walker

WebSite

What you want to do is defrost the rat - what you are doing is cooking it.

Try taking it out (of the freezer) the night before, put it in a ziplock in the fridge - it should defrost overnight) then about an hour before you are ready to feed - take it out and let it warm to room temperature - you can then heat it up a bit with either hot water or a heat lamp and then feed.

Good luck!!
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Tosha
JET Pythons

still to much work

When I first started feeding F/T I had a couple of issues in the thawing process. Usually forgot they where under the heat lamp and over cooked them. My solution was to make an convection oven. I started with a 20gl Visionarium that I had before I switched to racks. I mounted a computer fan and two 25 watt light bulbs in the top. Covered the top with tin foil and styrofoam. Used duck tape to cover the side vents and plugged it in. It reaches a temp of 102 degrees. I use two teflon coated bakers racks to keep the feeders of the bottom. Air circulates 360 degrees around them heating them evenly and dries out any condensation. I am not exactly sure how long it takes to defrost but I usualy put about 30-40 feeders in, go about my business and come back several hours later and they are perfect ever time. Infact I like it so much I am putting another one together. I know its way to much work for some and my BPs would be much happier if I just feed them dangerous rodents with sharp teeth and claws, but I just love to feel the power of the strike. When I stick a thawed rat in the box and they yank it out of the tongs. Well it just makes my heart pound.

I know its way to much work for some and my BPs would be much happier if I just feed them dangerous rodents with sharp teeth and claws

Wow the 2 replies from you are a little harsh and sarcastic about feeding live, what happened to they are your snakes and you can keep them how you like. Someone needs to lay off the caffine
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Damian Macioce
www.strongholdreptiles.com

Sarcastic, yes. Harsh, I don't think so. And maybe I was feeling just a little cranky today. But sometimes I get tried of the the same reply to the thread. And I apologize if I offended or hurt anyones feelings, and thats not sarcastic. But if someone comes on here asking for advice on any particular topic I don't feel its neccessary for anybody to reply to every other reply with an opinion to the contrary. State your opinion or offer your advice and move on. If you have something else to add thats great, but if its pretty much what you stated in your first reply, whats the point. Not to mention that a lot of times the original question gets lost in the reteric, that the person looking for help goes away more confused then when they decided to ask for help in the first place. Thats all.

Jeff

I agree with you Jeff,
There are only 2 or 3 (maybe) answers to the original post. This is one of those topics that goes on and on. No one method is the best. For some who feed alot of snakes f/t are cheaper.. if you just have one maybe live or prekilled is best. You have to take into consideration each persons situation and snakes preferences. one form may be "the best", but it isnt much good if snake won't eat it. Some snakes like "home cooking" from the fridge and some like "take out" from the pet shop. Just my 2 cents.
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This is courage.. to bear unflinching what heaven sends. -unknown

2.1 chocolate labs and bassett (Harley, Barker and Capone)
1.0 leopard gecko (Nacho)