Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I cannot believe that we are seeing people selling PINSTRIPES, thats right, PINSTRIPES, for UNDER $2K. I have seen them as low as $1500. Are we kidding???? $1500. One guy decides to have a pre-lay sale and then some people see that ad and say gee, I MUST have to sell mine that cheap now because its the going rate.
Why not just give them away? Whats next, albinos for $500, bumble bees for $2k??

OK now I feel a little better. Thanks for the ear.
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Steve

Is it venting or are you trolling?

If the person could get $10K for each Pinstripe he hatched out, don't you think he would sell them for that. People sell THEIR animals for what THEY can get. Maybe the Sutherlands, Ralph, VPI or any other bigger breeder can get a few bucks more because of who they are, and their good reputations. If you are a smaller breeder, it takes YEARS to establish a good reputation, and people sell for what THEY can get.

Go clean some cages, do something useful! This thread is pointless.

Dave

.....

Trolling... I don't fish. I am a small breeder and believe you should get what you can too, but don't go right for "cheapest price ever". You have all seen "call for best price" thats what should be done.
If you post those prices, people will see them. If you've GOTTA HAVE THE MONEY, you shouldn't have spent it to begin with. Don't let the entire BP industry know that you are desperate and willing to crash the market.
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Steve

Your post wreaks of someone who overspent, borrowed money to fund their "enterprise" and now cannot pay it back, or someone who told their wife they would be a millionaire in a few years if they could spend their tax return on Balls.

Call for best price??? That sounds like someone is scared of people like you to post a REALISTIC cash price. If you are trying to make money, you are in the wrong business. I think people like you are what is wrong with this hobby, all about the mighty dollar. With Balls, it is all about the mighty trade, or nickel!

Quick call Ripley! Daves a genius.
borrow money.....tax return.....wife's permission? are you serious? Don't put your situation on others.
I was just venting over people advertising extremely low prices. It won't really change my life. This is for fun not survival, but I work too hard to just give them away.

hmmmm, super pastel x normal = 8 pastels
if perfect sex ratio 4 pairs at $400 each
$1600 per clutch x 5 clutches, I don't see the problem.

Yes I know every male won't sire 5 clutches and every clutch won't be 8 eggs and every clutch won't be perfect sex ratio, but that is why this is a hobby and supposed to be fun. If people sound harsh the reason is because every week this comes up and every week there isn't anything that anyone can do about it except get tired of it a little more.

Think about what the colubrid breeders have to deal with, making cents off of each animal produced, not the large dollars what python breeders make. Yes I know that's apples to oranges to a point but all animals have to get fed weekly, cleaned daily to a point and marketed accordingly.
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Josh & Krysty Hutto
J&K Reptiles

Various Ball Pythons:::

1.0 striped vanilla
1.0 spider
1.2 Citrus Ghost and hets
1.2 Albino and hets
2.3 het Pied
0.6 50% poss het pied
1.1 Pastel (male has additional gene going on with him)
a bunch of normal female breeders
a bunch of normal female holdbacks and several rescued normal males

0.1 columbian boa, she's a feeding monster, controls my
over production of rats, lol
0.1 brazilian rainbow boa, another rat eating monster
1.1 corns

a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrier as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!

I agree with you , I am glad I dont just look at my animals as breeding machines but as actual pets that I do care about, if you are looking for large returns please do us all a favor take that money and get into stocks and become a day trader if thats all you care about is money end of story next.

The tax return, borrowing money, Credit Card buys, telling the wife you will make millions: all reasons why people start worthless threads like this. All my snakes were bought and paid for with my money, and thus paid for, long ago. I have a $300 a month rat bill, as long as snake sales pay for this, I am good to go. I was smart enough not to pay $20K for one snake, which in MY situations would not have been a good thing to do. Everyone has their own situations, and will need to sell an animal to pay bills, reduce cages space, etc. Who are you to say what is too low of a price for OTHERS to sell at? When Ghosts drop to $1200 each for females, are you going to start another worthless thread, when Cinns drop to $400, are you going to start...???? Go buy some stocks, and complain about them going up and down...that is what I have done, could care less about the prices of snakes, I just roll with the punches.

Dave

I agree totally thats why I purchase hets only and I am in the great enjoyable long journey of producing my own morphs , this to me makes the hobby more enjoyable and once I do this whatever price decide to sale my own created morphs it will be profitable because I created them all from inexpensive HETS , this is the way to go if your not rich like most of us on this forum, as the prices fall which I hope they do it will also weed out those who are just trying to do this for the money.

I just had to add to this, could no0t help it. I think snakes going for several hundred to several thousand$$ is horable anyway "That is why I do not own any" LOL My BP's are both atractive normals from the pet store at $69.95 with a 10% discound for being a breeder of other snakes. I do breed Corn Snakes and do sell them for profit however at the pet store price of $20-$25 each and srtreet value of about $40 each I parly make back what PGE charged me in power to run the incubators let alone to prey for the parents and babys untill they sell. All in all I may have close to a couple thousands invested in my entire collection including animals and suplys but to this day I am still tickled pink when the pet store orders 4 snakes @ $20 from me. I dont mean to wish bad luck on anyone but personaly I would love to see the market crash, that way I could aford and or justify purchasing some of the cool morphs you guys produce LOL
Foot Hill Reptiles

BIG people sell cheap too they just lie about it......

yep
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................

Gawlly Seargent Carter.......Shazaam.........!

>>>BIG people sell cheap too they just lie about it......
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Don't interupt me when I'm talkin' to myself

Gawd I wish there was a way to delete the screw ups in my posts

Essencially I was just laughin' my arse off at that one

Quig
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Don't interupt me when I'm talkin' to myself

Someone payed good money for their snakes, bred them and now have babies. They sell them for what they want. You can do the same. No big deal. The only reason I see these threads keep comming up is #1 the poster is in over their head or #2 they just need something to complain about. Yes sometime your going to see all these morphs close to the price of a normal. But, until then we just get what we can for them. Again, no big deal. If you want more for yours sell them for that. But complaining about others pricing IS NOT going to make them sell for more.I don't know. Just some thoughts.
Thanks,
Casey

if you want to vent about the advertised price, you should see the selling price for someone who has a few connections, lol. Also if anyone is buying bees for 2k, they are crazy. The market is what it is, you nor I can change it no matter how much we complain. I paid over 5k for my spider male and have yet to produce a baby although I do have eggs cooking now but not enough to recoup the initial investment price. But hey, I still have a breeder male spider that will produce alot of baby spiders over the next few years, not to mention the bees, vanilla spiders, vanilla bees, pewter bees. All that from one spider male and some females. Even if they drop to $150 for spiders it will only take 2 years of breeding to recoup our purchase price and we will have several female spiders and other holdback spider crosses in our collection.

now go work with your snakes and quit complaining about something you have no control over.
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Josh & Krysty Hutto
J&K Reptiles

Various Ball Pythons:::

1.0 striped vanilla
1.0 spider
1.2 Citrus Ghost and hets
1.2 Albino and hets
2.3 het Pied
0.6 50% poss het pied
1.1 Pastel (male has additional gene going on with him)
a bunch of normal female breeders
a bunch of normal female holdbacks and several rescued normal males

0.1 columbian boa, she's a feeding monster, controls my
over production of rats, lol
0.1 brazilian rainbow boa, another rat eating monster
1.1 corns

a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrier as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!

For all those who keep saying just go take care of your snakes...maybe you all should too...

my snakes are taken care of very well thank you.
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Josh & Krysty Hutto
J&K Reptiles

Various Ball Pythons:::

1.0 striped vanilla
1.0 spider
1.2 Citrus Ghost and hets
1.2 Albino and hets
2.3 het Pied
0.6 50% poss het pied
1.1 Pastel (male has additional gene going on with him)
a bunch of normal female breeders
a bunch of normal female holdbacks and several rescued normal males

0.1 columbian boa, she's a feeding monster, controls my
over production of rats, lol
0.1 brazilian rainbow boa, another rat eating monster
1.1 corns

a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrier as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!

People have tried to explain the concept of supply and demand too many times to count.......yet it never seems to sink in.......

Let's try this instead.......If you don't understand the reptile breeding buisness.......you shouldn't be in the reptile breeding buisness.......It'll eat you alive.......simple as that.

yep.....one gallon canning jar,brown glaze..worth $40 got for $10....cake crock ,stoneware blue decorations all around with lid....$200.......yelloware mixing bowl......1910 or earlier maybe ....worth $125 plus...cost $70.......redware apple butter crock.small......$25....worth a little more.......amish boy doll..."Joshua".....$20.....why do wives do this?......F H Cowden one gallon crock, squat,ferrugionous clay (rusty looking when fired).....figured they'd bid to $65.....sold to me at $40............yes..this is what I do with snake money........they don't eat....they don't die....they don't depreciate in value .......I have 300 pieces of stoneware,redware,yelloware plus granitewares and various antique kitchenwares and farm type stuff etc etc etc etc

as for the rant/ vent.....people been selling albinos for $500........you just don't know it.......duh.........LOL

........
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................

Gawlly Seargent Carter.......Shazaam.........!

I'd love to find an albino for 500

all you have to do is ask people.......and buy alot of them.......or buy alot of them and other stuff combined,,,,,,,,they are out there but you have to spend more than total of 500 to get it usually.......this year we don't know...........my friend sold a pair last year for 1200.....then the buyer sold them for 1000 each more or less........?.......

.....good luck.........
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................
left.....aaaiii.....left.....aaaaiiii......left......move it!!,, move it!!,, move it!!...........!

I've seen pastels for $75.
I've seen pastel pairs for $450 shipped.

I paid $550 shipped for mine...as a hatchling.
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"What is man without the beasts?
If all the beasts were gone,
men would die from great loneliness of spirit.
For what happens to the beasts,
soon happens to men.
All things are connected."

-Chief Seattle (Duwamish Tribe)

- - - - As a buyer - they've finally reached "affordable" level - - - -

- - - - As a seller - you have more buyers at the $1500 level than at the $7000 level - - - -

- - - - As a buyer - by the time you are selling - they will be "really affordable" and you'll have a larger market - - - -

- - - - As a seller - they're hitting "must have - staple" status - - - -

- - - - heard this before? - - - - didn't ya believe it? - - - -

- - - yep good things happening all around - - -

- - - or the market is crashing - - - depends on which meds you took this morning - - -

- - - - This will be a good year for the Pin - - - -

- - - - That $1000 prediction is looking more and more like reality - - - -

- - - - ≤ $1000 - I'm stocking up on females for crosses - - - - maybe
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Tosha
JET Pythons

Very well said Tosha.

Dean
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Dino W.

that's what you figure......but people still don't buy enough of the stuff at all.......I'm still going to just wholesale the stuff to Ian G I bet.....he can sell anything........why bother keeping it till the thing is 550 grams and still get less money.....

........people suck................LOL.....just as much as wild balls....................(*people..when I say wild balls suck......I really mean it...and the captive hatched babies you all say are so good and just as good as captive USA stuff..yea...they are not wild balls........they aren't even balls yet when you get them..they are hatched out critters that don't know anything yet......yet I still prefer USA stuff.....but babies will grow if all went correctly.)

have fun........

.......
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................

Gawlly Seargent Carter.......Shazaam.........!

LOL - I agree - I guess my ambiguous sarcasm doesn't come across very well.
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Tosha
JET Pythons

..........I'm just lost anyways now........

women tend to think of this as more fun.........for now.........

I am just getting too old.......and the balls are just not helping me out.........

what are they waiting for ??? (to lay )
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................
left.....aaaiii.....left.....aaaaiiii......left......move it!!,, move it!!,, move it!!...........!

And I sat ageen,
Posted by: dsreptiel at Sat May 5 10:42:34 2007 [ Report Abuse ] [ Email Message ]

I do agree with most of what you said until you said that wild couth Balls suck . Well maybe for someone without enough Experience to get them to thrive they might !! , But for those of us that can deal with them they are no problem and offer fresh bloodlines that haven’t seen years of selective breeding !.Thanks David of DS Reptile Rescue , Removal & Rehabilitation

..new bloodline....any 2 balls bred together...........no matter where they were born....tadaaa...new genes mixed.....

....wild sucks.....we all prove it......

......passengers pigeons would all agree........as would Mr and Mrs Dodo .......and Sir Tazmanian Wolf
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......wild balls suck ! BUY AMERICAN DAMNIT

Kind of like the price of gas...not a damn thing you can do about it...you can't control what other people do...skip the stress and enjoy your animals, and if you really enjoy your animals price don't matter, buying or selling. Nothing personal, just sick of these whiney price threads.
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Dale....dgoins222@yahoo.com
www.LibertyReptiles.com

get over it!!!! markets have trends. the ball market happens to be in a buyers trend. it's not a sellers market anymore. but in my opinion it's better this way because now i have a larger customer base. the average reptile owner will spend $150 for a nice looking pastel rather than $5000 for a clown. and yes the big breeders sell cheap too. i got a 450g het red male from ian at hamburg last month for $275.
last year i bought a late 05' spider in february for $2600. 2 months later i could have bought her for $1300. thats business. you never saw me on here whining about it!!!!

"THE SKY IS FALLING!! THE SKY IS FALLING!!"
CHICKEN LITTLE

I started admiring these snakes years ago. They were $17,500.00 per pair for an albino, and I did not even have an outside shot at getting one of the spectacular animals. This year, is a different story. I have paid for a 500g pastel male that will be here next week (paid $350 shipped). The best deal I found this season is on albino balls. I have paid my deposit for 1.0 albino, and 1.2 hets for $1,250 shipped. That is an advertised price on a website listed on kingsnake.com (find it and take advantage of it). The breeder who I am getting this group from gave me the name of a person I know has been breeding balls since the first albinos were produced. I called him, and he said he is mainly a wholesaler to large breeders, but I have reserved a low white female pied and spider male for $2,500.00 shipped. I hope those prices don't tick anyone off, but I found a good deal and am going to take full advantage of it.

NICE, good luck, post a pic of the Pied when you get her!

Dave

What ever happened to free speech? and you are lying in your pants if at one point you didnt think investing into a group of snakes would make you A LOT OF MONEY! I bet if you would ofinvested in these animals when they were the BIG BUCKS , none of you would be thrashing this guy. You just waited YEARS to get them cheaper since you couldnt afford them or didnt produce them yourself. There are plenty of snakes that were put in the wrong hands , that could of easily kept prices higher than what they became. delete that...

I really didn't have a choice to wait. I was only 14 when I first learned of the availability and existance of the albinos. I don't think you could find a 15 year old anywhere who could afford that. I was working in a grocery store for about $5 / hr. and made my own car and insurace payments. I remember when PK first made pieds available to the public. $35-$50k a piece and hets were like $25k / pair. I aint thrashing nobody, cause I will probably sell a few cheapies myself. I am in this to make enough money to break even on my hobby I hope, but I do think there is still some money to be made in this hobby. I do use my head though, and am not going to pay $4k for a bumble bee when I can buy the ingredients for less than $1k.

Again , you are trying to make some MONEY back , profit , cut the recovery time down from what your initial INVESTMENT was.. it is all the same. Certain people (me) like to have stuff that not everyone else has. Thats why we invest into it and start trying to create our own version. If everyone is going to complain about pricing , stick to the snakes you can afford or just wait for more to be on the market. When the supply is there , the demand will follow. Every couple years this happens and the same kind complains... Just go into this knowing , WHAT a BAD *** snake I just got. Let me know try to make my own or SAVE to get one.

i really do love snakes...

I got my Bumblebee for 1500. Money talks and them bills aint goin nowhere fast.

First the big money on morphs has always been a pyramid scheme. The one that is first reaps the maximum benefits and then you go to the next level. As the price goes down the customer base goes up. The first truly high end morphs were albino burmese pythons. Believe me I followed this market as I am the one who supplied them to Bob Clark. I made the most money not at the beginning but when they sold for about $1,000 ea.Thats because it was possible to sell many more at that price. The ball python market has ALWAYS been an inflated one. Most really high end morphs are TRADED for other high end morphs and not sold for actual cash. These inlated trade deals do not indicate a real selling price. An animal is worth what someone is willing to pay cold hard CASH for not trade!!! If ball pythons produced lots of eggs many co-dom morphs would already be a $100 ea. Earlier in the thread someone made mention of the stock market. Anyone that has invested in stocks knows that you have to be in for the long run. Very few ever made money playing the stocks 5 or 6 years. The bottom line is to keep what you like and what gives you pleasure. Who cares about the price unless thats the only reason you began in the first place. If thats the case you should cut your losses and get out now before you lose even more money. Remember everything economical is based on supply and demand!!! Well i've vented enough. Usually I don't comment but only peruse the forums but in this case I felt compelled. Thanks for reading....Tom Crutchfield

Tom I must agree with you there.There is still a ton of money to be made in the ball market and people ARE still buying.I believe tho that if you are doing this JUST for the money and don't have a love and PASSION for the animals then you will NOT make it in this hobby.
The first year I bought a Pastel male for $1,500.I made over $20,000 of that $1,500 investment and ok so I spent most of it on MORE balls lol.Now that is pretty damn good.
I also paid thousands for my Mojave and now they are selling for a fraction of that and it DON'T bug me at all.
Why because I LOVE the look of him and I only have to sell a few more to make back my initial investment and I can now enjoy looking at him for the rest of his life.
My wife thinks I'm NUTTS to keep spending so much money on balls and holding all the females back and not selling them lol.I don't CARE if they sell and WHY?
The way I see it if I don't sell them then I can raise them and ENJOY looking at them
This is a hobby and PASSION of mine and I look forward to what's NEXT lol.
The only thing I can say is LOVE what you do and ENJOY your animals and you will do just FINE

OK that's the end of that for now lol.

PS' I wish you ALL luck with your projects this year and have FUN
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Kelvin,J,Tourangeau

www.PastelDreamMorphs.com
Underconstruction

I think that is great to sale them at these prices, balls should not cost as much as a car, this is a hobby for a great deal of people and you are out just to make a ton of money than just change your marketing stragey and market your animals to the rich , but for those of us who work a regular job we welcome the prices $1500 is steal a great deal of money for a ball, you will actually sale more balls this way and make more money because you will now attract a great deal of more buyers simple economics its the future of morphs thank GOD.

Dougle, if you don't learn how to use proper English, you'll be working the rest of your life in a low paying job. The word your looking for is sell, not sale. I must have forgotten where I was for a minute. If you want a cheap snake get a ribbon snake.
Your the guy with like 8 snakes, total; none of which are anymore than a het, and your gonna post on how you want to make your own morphs cheap because you "love this hobby/business" and then go right on talking about when you sale (lol) the morph, which you took forever to make, that any money made will be a profit? I thought "YOU PEOPLE" weren't looking for a profit? If you love them, just keep them all and don't sale anything!
Next time just keep your $.02 and put it with the rest of your savings and buy another het! Actually, Pokemon cards might be better for you.

dude
i don't know either of you guys , so this isn't personal...
if you're going to trash someone for their crappy spelling ,
you'd better do it with YOUR spell check on next time.
ck

That is You're to mean you are, not your.

speaking of cars, $200K is alot for a car too, I don't care that its a Ferrari. Do you think they will lower it to $30K just because we think they are beautiful and can't pay the $200K? I doubt it. Get a KIA.