Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Ok Guys,

I have a 8-9ft Green burm... about 1 and 1/2 yrs old.. great snake , great personality , very inquisitive , great food response every single time... She is in and 8ftwide by 3ft deep by 4ft high cage ... temps are 85-90 day and mid 70's at night ...

out of the blue she has gone lethargic on me ... She is moving around slow... has no food response ...and almost seems mentally impaired... But she does go to her hide spot at night ... and she comes out when the lights come on... but she is acting extremely wierd.. basically sick ... The reptile vets in my area are basically worthless... I do have and aapt set up for tomorrow but I would like to know if any of you have had this problem come on out of the blue ... Ive kept and bred pythons and Boas for over 20 years now and i have never had a snake just change its personality this quickly ...
Any input would be greatly appreciated
-----
Safari Tom
See'em Touch'em Save'em
www.SafariTom.com

you thought was "no pest strip" poisoning, that snake also had neurological problems as well. Since this has happened pretty recently in your collection you may have a problem with some kind of virus or possibly Inclusion Body Disease. Worth a look over by a competent Vet. I would have some tests run, all you need is some mites to be the vectors of IBD and other various diseases / Viruses which could easily spread throughout an entire collection by either the mites, cross feeding, and or some other means of cross-contamination ( you obviously had a mite problem which you tried to eradicate with the "no pest strip" )
-----
Thanks,

Frank Roberts
Roberts' Realm Of Reptile Research

I have thought about that .. I did treat my collection with no pest strips ... The mites are gone ... Im not sure where they initially came from , but they are gone ...

The snake that had been exposed with ill effects before is still alive ... drinking but not eating ... It was a 4 month old green burmese python. This new snake with the problem is another Green Burmese Python. Keep in mind that i keep numerous species. Boas, Burms, Retics, Monitors, Tegus, Colubrids etc ... no other animals have had any ill effects.. Just these 2 green Burmese Pythons. I am feeling as though these snakes genetically may have a sensitivity to Dichlorvos( No Pest Strip )

I dont understand why no other animal in my collection would be left unnafected. Dichlorvos is an Organophosphate. I am currently trying to find a reversal or antidote for this.
This may not even be what is wrong with this snake. My "reptile " Vet said today that he would xray her to determine whether she is eggbound. That is about the extent of His Reptile Medicine. That and treating respiratory infections.

Thanks for your advice
-----
Safari Tom
See'em Touch'em Save'em
www.SafariTom.com

If IBD is the culprit the Retic would be next. Boas can also get it, but it may not kill them. Still they can infect other Boas and Pythons. Pretty much all of your Boids should have liver biopsies done and isolate the sick animal well away from your other pets.
-----
http://www.GilbertBoas.com/

You are correct in that Dichlorvos is an organophosphate. The only known counteractant that I am aware of is atropine, but it would need to be given at the onset of symptoms to be very effective in alleviating any long term side-effects. Dichlorvos strip sections can be used successfully and safely to treat mite infestations on snakes, but it needs to be used under very specific guidelines or you can cause some serious problems. What size sections of dichlorvos strip are you using per cubic foot of cage volume, and how long of an exposure time are you allowing?

Kelly

Kelly

I use about a 1/4 inch x 2 inch slice, in a tupper ware container with numerous small holes drilled in it left in the cage with the animal for 24-36 hours then repaeated 2 weeks later for the same ... Its the same amount I have used for about 10 years. I have never had a problem. It has only been with these 2 green burmese pythons.
-----
Safari Tom
See'em Touch'em Save'em
www.SafariTom.com

the problem is the dichlorvos. It would take a larger exposure than that for a 8 or 9 foot snake in that size enclosure, or direct contact with the material itself. Unless of course like you speculated, if they are genetically more sensitive to dichlorvos. I have never seen anything on that before however.

Kelly

Kelly

Well , yesterday we took the small green burm to the Vet to be weighed for her dosage .. Our Doc , wanted us to try Atropine... so we have an Atropine Injection for 3 days to give each snake .. So far there has been no change. He also wanted to try 2-Pam or Protopam but it is on an indefinite Manufacturer backorder.

While he is an excellent vet, he just isnt a reptile vet... he knows a bit , but not much ... He tried researching Organophosphate poisoning in reptiles , its in all the herp vet books but there is no treatment listed at all.. Its been very hard finding a real reptile vet in my area... they all claim to be reptile vets but we as experienced keepers seem to know more than they do... Antibiotics for rep infection or oxytocin for egg bound herps... thats about the extent of their knowledge . Yes, they can run blood chemistries but No they dont know how to treat unknown ailments..
All of my other animals are fine .. no problems at all... only these 2 green burms have been affected... housed completely separate from one another... The only thing it can be is the Dichlorvos...

This really sucks because I truly love the larger of the 2.She is a sweetheart. The smaller one was nasty to the bone though...

Any other ideas or advice is welcome...
-----
Safari Tom
See'em Touch'em Save'em
www.SafariTom.com