Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I watched your video, and I really do not know what to tell you other then in my professional opinion, your male sav does not have long to live. I really really hope I am wrong. But I fear I am not.

Your sav is morbidly obese. You say its young, it appears young, which makes it worse. I could understand an old male becoming fat. But a morbidly obese youngster is horrible.

My bet is, his internal fat bodies are equal to his total weight.

You can see his skin stretch and part, during his gate. In fact, its stretched went it sits. Please consider saving its life.

Please understand, monitors grow like other animals are suppose to. They grow long and slender(not skinny) then bulk up at sexual maturity. That animal is FAT and obese.

Other then that, I see nothing unusual, the monitor knows where its support is and goes to it. About opening doors, we all know monitors understand that. Sometimes we learn the hard way. My indoor/outdoor monitors have metal doors, and they have learned to open and close them as they go in and out. I have two sliding doors, the monitors know how to open them, but not how to close them. Somehow they do close the hinged doors.

That it does not fear you or bite you is not unusual. In fact, its very normal. As I have said many times, once they know you, they just want to use you. And if you want to use them in return, great, that sorta balances out. That you play games with them is not a bad thing to me. I kinda think its better then most allow(most allow nothing). As least they are doing something, even if its not what they are designed to do.

YOUR problem is common, your house and or the cages you keep it in, ARE NOT HOT ENOUGH. PERIOD. So your poor monitor stores fat instead of using the energy. MARK MY WORDS, it will die unless you do something about it.

About the behaviors, from you vid, I do not think nothing of it. ITs not a monitor, its more a submonitor. That is, its not hot enough to behave in any normal fashion. So what you have done is meaningless to me and sad. Let that poor thing have access to air temps around 100F and basking temps around 145F and you will see a different monitor. It may not be mean or bite, it just will not put up with your crap. At least it will have its full range of abilities. Even hot, monitors are not mean, unless they are deranged by humans.

In the pic I just took, there is three young monitors, about 6 months old. They have never been held(except to be moved) or tamed in any way. They are outside and at the moment of this pic, its 95F. Ground temps of 128 or above.

It took about three feedings to get them to eat out of my hands, mind you, this is a group. As many here already understand, in a group setting, they feed in a totally different more agressive manner then when they are by themselves. Also I am feeding live food, again as many here know, that brings out a much more agressive responce. So I am doing this with a very very aggressive species(at feeding) and in the most extreme of circumstances.

So, hot untrained, untamed monitors, that gently take live food out of my hands.

So what does that say about you methods, hmmmmmmmmmm I think your fooling yourself. Because you are not fooling me.

Also I have wild lizards that eat out of my hands and sit on my lap, and follow me around, just to sit by me. WILD, not captive, and I have pics too.

But you know what, I could careless about that, your welcome to fool yourself and others, but please do something about your obese monitor. If you do not believe me, then ask a qualified Vet. Good luck and cheers

Thanks for looking.
I'd hoped you'd comment on the nosing & marking behaviour as well, but it is nice to have it agreed that:

1- monitors are naturally non-hostile
2- monitors are intelligent and capable of learning a great deal
3- monitors can get along safely interacting with humans

I accept this as a normal set of expectations.
Where does this lead, is what I find interesting.

About fat- are you saying so knowing how savs like to inflate themselves into footballs? I mean- are you seeing past that and remarking on actual fat?

Their preferred temp range (by axillary IR reading) seems to be 91-95F. Their temps in the vids should all be in this range. If they reach 95.5-96F they look for a cool spot. If they get to 90 they go find some heat (unless it's the middle of an exploration that is too interesting to quit- then they'll let themselves get below 90). They have no trouble maintaining this range. They just don't like basking under lights any more. They did it when they were very small- maybe cuz they really needed it and had little choice- but once they got large they chose other ways to keep their range.

Your in denial. That Sav is obese and not bloated or puffed up.

About temps, now your lack of knowledge about husbandry is showing. When I say temps, I say "usable temps" They use temps in many ways, NOT JUST SITTING UNDER A HEAT LAMP. In fact, monitors rarely bask, unless there is no option.

You still must figure out how to provide enough heat to allow your monitor the ability to process its food intake. As of now, its FAT, there is no question about that.

If you cannot figure out how to allow it to use heat, then cut back of its intake(the hardest of hard ways to lose weight)

Or you can go on and kill your monitor. Please understand, this has occurred many times before, right here on KS. When you monitor dies, you will disappear and move on to something else. You may not even tell us, you were wrong and your sav died.

I can tell you right now, when it will die. It will during a change of seasons. One day your going to go to see him and his back legs will be twitching a little, then it will lose the use of them. You will take it to a Vet and he will treat it for an overall systemic infection, there may be some surface blisters. It will not help as your monitor has lost its immune system and has liver and kidney damage. You may cut it open and you will not believe how much fat that poor animal contained. Then DWS you will actually learn something. Cheers

This is proof of what FR is talking about exactly. A chronically chunky savannah monitor at about 4 years old who's owner fed it scrambled eggs, turkey burger, and mice only and didn't keep it hot or humid enough (big fish tank and a 60 watt clamp lamp on repticarpet). One day it began to get picky with what it wanted to eat...then it stopped eating....leading to a week of noneating and beginning to look emaciated/ dehydrated/ tired....another week and it was dead. The owner reported that the sav sat in it's water bowl all the time. It happened that quickly. It had normal skats,etc except that in the last few days it produced those yellowed, strongly ammonia smelling urate chalk pellets. Here's what it's liver looked like on necropsy (black and cystic - it should be pink and uniform in consistency). The gall bladder was also full of heavy bile and was inflammed. This is a severely damaged liver that is the likely cause of death. Also, the fat bodies (already removed in picture) took up 1/2 of the coelomic cavity(gut space for the organs):

This 'phenomenon' which happens so frequently to savannah monitors has to be a combination of a rich gluttonous diet, chronic low temps, chronic mild dehydration, undermetabolized / underexercised. It happens to captive savs constantly.

Here's one with fat bodies intact:

I hope you realize your Sav has four times that. Cheers

Once a monitors fat bodies are full, the liver starts storing fat, I don’t think you can save such an animal.

Fatty liver is a fatal condition.

Is there an average length of time that it takes for the liver to start storing fat and thus beginning the end?

What I mean is, if a monitor is fat and remains fat, how long will it be before its reversible? Just curious.

Thanks!
HH
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It is said that 1 out of every 4 people are mentally unbalanced. Think of your 3 closest friends, if they're normal, then it's you.

What I mean is, if a monitor is fat and remains fat, how long will it be before its NON-reversible? Just curious.

Sorry!
HH
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It is said that 1 out of every 4 people are mentally unbalanced. Think of your 3 closest friends, if they're normal, then it's you.

No one can answer this! The vast majority of obese captives die when you try to slim them. This condition is terrible on the entire system.

The good news is its easy to avoid, a heat range from very hot to room temperature and an equal range of moisture is all that a monitor needs to metabolise properly. With these options is unlikely any monitor will become obese.
The key is prevention, good keepers can help you avoid husbandry mistakes, but we cant fix what’s already don.

Thanks to everyone for the info!

Have a good one!
HH
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It is said that 1 out of every 4 people are mentally unbalanced. Think of your 3 closest friends, if they're normal, then it's you.