Reptile & Amphibian Forums

As some of you may have noticed. I ask a lot of nerdy questions of my peers. To elaborate as to why, I
learn more from people such as yourselves than most textbooks can teach me. Having said that please, " don't be stingy with your love "Can not find any Herpetologists hypothesis and or theories on this matter, but I do have one of my own.Most of us have a general idea of how many days will pass before their snake's pass a " bowel movement". in direct correlation to their food intake.

Explanation and actual question to follow :

Said Snake eats, digests, and passes byproducts thereof, is equal to, lets say, 7 days for argument sake.
But, if the feeding occurs around the time the snake turns opaque . The snake will most times not pass a
bowel movement until after or during (most times) the act of molting. With many more than seven days
passing. BTW in this example, there will be no difference in prey type or size, in ambient, and or Hot spot temperatures to possibly influence the digestive process. So ordinary digestion at a certain temp takes 7 days. If the snake goes blue shortly thereafter ( eating ), the amount of time to pass will be lets say 14 days , not the typical 7 days even with the exact same environmental conditions present.

Why is this?

My Hypothesis:

I believe, since snakes usually hide under some type of cover until they shed, the byproducts are "held back" so the snake does not "reveal" itself to a potential predator. ( why I believe some snakes also eat their unfertilized ovum) . After all, they are somewhat blind and or their vision is inhibited throughout most of the ecdysis process. Which explains at least one of the reasons they seek "cover" during this process, other reasons could include things relating to humidity levels which also aid completion of the process.

A little "anthropomorphism" - Don't Crap where you eat and or sleep.

I believe it's an innate "inherited survival trait" to help combat predation. They are most certainly not taught this "behavior" ( not exactly the right word, "survival mechanism" perhaps, hummm not sure it is a "survival mechanism" we are talking about here ) from their parents and or other snakes in their environment.

Thoughts on this being a innate "survival mechanism" ?

Possible other reasons relating to the physiological changes the snake goes through during the ecdysis process ?

Other reasons why the ecdysis process may inhibit bowel movements of the "already digested" prey ?

Concise version for bob...

Why my snake no poop?

PS I wrote this on a word processor email prog, hence the spaces, It took long enough to write this post, so I am not gunna fix that, it is still legible.

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Thanks,

Frank Roberts
Roberts' Realm Of Reptile Research

Frank I don't have no answer to your ? but I can say that my brb's poop where they sleep. About 90-95% of the cleanups are under their coconut (with spaghnum) and having them out of the coconut before dark is a tell tale sign for me
Bob

I was giving a snake human qualities as a form of irony in that part of my post, I am more interested in why they do not poop until they shed. Might not be survival mechanism, which would explain why your snakes poop where they sleep.

denotation:
Main Entry: an·thro·po·mor·phism

Function: noun

Pronunciation: -"fi-z&m

: an interpretation of what is not human or personal in terms of human or personal characteristics : HUMANIZATION
- an·thro·po·mor·phist/-fist/ noun
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Thanks,

Frank Roberts
Roberts' Realm Of Reptile Research

" survival mechanism " due to the fact the snakes sight is inhibited. Which could directly effect the animals "flight or fight behavior"
-----
Thanks,

Frank Roberts
Roberts' Realm Of Reptile Research

Frank,
..It very well could be that you have it right. Perhap they do not go out of hiding while opaque and do not pass a stool in their hiding place because the smell could alert a preadtor to their presence. On the other hand. Have you considered the possibility that the passage of digested food thru their gut is somewhat slowed down while they are opaque and inactive? As soon as they start moving and working to shed they also start the peristaltic muscle contractions which move feces along. This idea fits right in as a logical answer for why our snakes make a mess right after we put them back into a cleaned cage.
Jeff

>>As some of you may have noticed. I ask a lot of nerdy questions of my peers. To elaborate as to why, I
>>learn more from people such as yourselves than most textbooks can teach me. Having said that please, " don't be stingy with your love "Can not find any Herpetologists hypothesis and or theories on this matter, but I do have one of my own.Most of us have a general idea of how many days will pass before their snake's pass a " bowel movement". in direct correlation to their food intake.
>>
>>Explanation and actual question to follow :
>>
>>Said Snake eats, digests, and passes byproducts thereof, is equal to, lets say, 7 days for argument sake.
>>But, if the feeding occurs around the time the snake turns opaque . The snake will most times not pass a
>>bowel movement until after or during (most times) the act of molting. With many more than seven days
>>passing. BTW in this example, there will be no difference in prey type or size, in ambient, and or Hot spot temperatures to possibly influence the digestive process. So ordinary digestion at a certain temp takes 7 days. If the snake goes blue shortly thereafter ( eating ), the amount of time to pass will be lets say 14 days , not the typical 7 days even with the exact same environmental conditions present.
>>
>>Why is this?
>>
>>My Hypothesis:
>>
>>I believe, since snakes usually hide under some type of cover until they shed, the byproducts are "held back" so the snake does not "reveal" itself to a potential predator. ( why I believe some snakes also eat their unfertilized ovum) . After all, they are somewhat blind and or their vision is inhibited throughout most of the ecdysis process. Which explains at least one of the reasons they seek "cover" during this process, other reasons could include things relating to humidity levels which also aid completion of the process.
>>
>>A little "anthropomorphism" - Don't Crap where you eat and or sleep.
>>
>>I believe it's an innate "inherited survival trait" to help combat predation. They are most certainly not taught this "behavior" ( not exactly the right word, "survival mechanism" perhaps, hummm not sure it is a "survival mechanism" we are talking about here ) from their parents and or other snakes in their environment.
>>
>>Thoughts on this being a innate "survival mechanism" ?
>>
>>Possible other reasons relating to the physiological changes the snake goes through during the ecdysis process ?
>>
>>Other reasons why the ecdysis process may inhibit bowel movements of the "already digested" prey ?
>>
>>Concise version for bob...
>>
>>Why my snake no poop?
>>
>>PS I wrote this on a word processor email prog, hence the spaces, It took long enough to write this post, so I am not gunna fix that, it is still legible.
>>
>>-----
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Frank Roberts
>>Roberts' Realm Of Reptile Research
>>

Jeff,

It very well may be related to the expenditure of energy to complete the ecdysis process "borrowing" resources may slow down digestion, very good point and the reason I posted this question. For insight kind of thing. More to ponder, whoohooo lol
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Thanks,

Frank Roberts
Roberts' Realm Of Reptile Research

I agree that after I have snakes out and put them back in the tank, they'll often eject feces. But they NEVER go on me while I'm handling them, whether I hold them for a few minutes or a few hours (even with startling things like a canon going off nearby at the Renaissance Festival--and plenty of activity to jump start their bathroom processes).

Is it because they don't want to poop on the hand that feeds them? LOL Any thoughts? Do your snakes treat you with similar respect---or are mine just exceptionally nice snakey boys?
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Renee

2.0 amel & anery corns (Foxfire & Daguerre)
1.0 BRB (Loki)

mind. The act of handling definitely gets the juices moving ( shrugs shoulders ), you have been fortunate enough up until this point, to not have them vacate on you. It also explains why when we change cages the snake seems to immediately void on "the clean" substrate. Not sure exactly why "the handling" has that after affect. I also have certain snakes that do not get their water bowls immediately refilled upon cleaning their enclosure's. This is done because they are very active when placed back in their enclosure and have a bad habit of either over turning their water bowl, or simply over flowing it. Which obviously involves ( to me any way ) another cage to re-clean. So I wait till they settle down then refill it. Some of my snakes have a "generic" setup. Newsprint & water bowl. For example, it is just not practical for a 17 foot python to have a water vessel into which it can completely submerge. They can tip over just about any water bowl. If the size of the snake allows it, they get hideboxes in addition to their simple newsprint / water set up.

Note:

Some of my snakes that do not have hide boxes still conceal themselves beneath the substrata.
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Thanks,

Frank Roberts
Roberts' Realm Of Reptile Research

My adult male tiger retic ( aug thru nov ) display's some interesting behaviors during these months. I think since his testosterone levels are a lot higher than usual he gets kinda high strung ( feeling his oats ) . With that being said, he body slams stuff during that entire period of time. He does not bite though. He literal will throw his body at you and try constricting you, this is not related to it's feeding response. He also crawls near his water bowl and body slams it. ( for which seems to be, because it's there ) It ( the water bowl ) has literally flown up in the air 18" and hit the "roof" . Since gravity works pretty well at my house, the 180 degree turn somehow empties the H20 onto the floor, resulting in me re doing the enclosure. Not territorial my ass.
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Thanks,

Frank Roberts
Roberts' Realm Of Reptile Research