Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hiya,

I have some baby snakes that need their sex confirmed. (Heck, some of mine that are a few years old I'd like to double check as well!) I did it visually but want to probe since I don't have much experience yet. I would hate to have miss-sexed and end up putting two males together down the line.

I purchased some sexing probes and have read up a lot about how to do it. I am very nervous! I'd like some opinions and maybe some ideas of what to expect. My guy can help me hold them so I can concentrate on the 'end' I need access to. Should he expect to get bitten a lot? Should I expect to get poo'd upon a lot? I want to try it myself but have been told it's a good idea to have someone show me how to do it. What's your experience going to a pet store and asking? I don't want to bring my babies to the local pet store (Berkeley is closest) if I can avoid it. The people are usually helpful, but unsure if any pet store would take the time to show me how if I wasn't going to buy something. My local herp society meets once a month but I don't live close to that area anymore or I'd ask someone there to help.
Any opinions? Should I just go for it? Make the trip out to a store or the local meetings?
Thanks,
-April
-----
'There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."' -Rainshadow

Hi April,

I bought a probe set at EBV and they were more than happy to show me some techniques there. The hardest part for me was figuring out the proper size. If the probe is too small, you will get up to 6-8 scales on females which may confuse you. Plus you want to make sure you don't puncture anything.

For babies I prefer to palpate them to check for the hemipenes. The way you do it is you start at the tail side of the cloaca with your thumb on the underside of the tail and your index finger on the other side. You then put slight pressure and then slide your thumb towards the end of the tail. About halfway down the tail you'll feel two "pops". These are the hemipenes. For females you will feel nothing.

What your doing essentially by palpating is pushing the blood toward the end of the hemipenes(if there are any). The "pops" are the ends of the hemipene slipping under your thumb.

Once you palpate a male, you will know what I'm talking about. I find this method less invasive than probing or popping. This method doesn't work with bigger boas.

Hope this helps.
eddie

What area do you live in again April? I think you told me recently but I forgot. If I can get some time (which is hard at the moment) I'd be happy to meet up with you and show you what Eddie is talking about. That method works like a charm. It's what I use, and it's guaranteed to be accurate (though I always recommend a second pass using the same method for each boa JUST to make sure).

>>thanks

I wouldn't trust a pet store. I think that you should do it yourself. Maybe have your BF hold still the head end. I have had a few try to bite, but rarely, and I haven't had any poop or musk.
It is easier to get the probe in by spinning it as you are using gentle pressure to get it in. As you move forward very gently, you will feel a definite bottom or dead end.
I've had nearly 100% success in sexing babies by using the "thumb roll" method. You hold the snake firmly between your thumb and forefinger, belly up, just north of the cloacha with your thumb on the belly side. Use gentle but firm constant pressure as you run your grip towards the tip of the snakes tail. The pressure pushes the blood further down into the hemipenes and when your thumb reaches the end of the blood filled hemipenes, it feels like small bb's going under your thumb. It's hard to describe, so I hope that made some sense.
Good luck, April!

If you don't feel the "bb's" passing under your thumb...it's a girl...if you do it's a boy.

EBV is hardly a local “pet shop”, they are very well known in Northern CA as one of the best and most knowledgeable reptile stores. If they aren’t to busy they will be a reliable source for help. April, if you go to the get-together on the 28th I’m sure someone can show you how to do it. I would also take the offer to have someone show you how to do the less invasive method.

At my local herp society, we had a ball python breeder demonstrate how to sex snakes, both by popping and probing.

None of the boas or ball pythons he sexed pooped, only a kingsnake (or milksnake, can't recall).

I took video of the demonstration, and will post a link when I get it up onto youtube eventually.

The important thing is to pick the right sized probe - not too large, not too small, and to roll the probe in your fingers (to tease it in kind of), on one side of the vent, and then the other, and use a little lubricant.
-----
Lauren Madar - OphidiaGems.com | CageMakers
1.0 BP, 1.0 Hog Is., 1.1 Hypo BCI, 1.1 Surinam BCC, 0.1 GTP

first off, thank you so much to all that replied! It's nice to hear some first hand experiences, makes me less nervous.

I've tried to feel the BBs on all 3 litters now but two days the snake feels like it has it, the next 3 times, I don't feel it at all... it was just so inconsistant for me. Maybe I am just not squeezing hard enough to really feel it (I've never gotten one to pop either). Some I never felt the BBs on, but I just don't trust it yet. I wrote down which ones I felt and which ones visually looked male or female and once I probe I'll compare all the results. If I can avoid probing, I'd like to.

Thanks again!
-April
-----
'There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."' -Rainshadow

The technique does take some practice, and some people never seem to get a "feel" for it. After a while, you'll know a female within a 1/4" of the vent and won't need to go any further to feel the "BB's". Sometimes if they roll the tail as you pull your finger back, you'll only feel one, sometimes you'll miss. I'd say make sure you're using your thumb on the top side and your index finger under the snake for more sensitivity. Also, pay attention to how it drops off immediately after the vent on those you don't feel the bb's on. As long as you have babies to practice on, life is good!! Take care

Paul

Here are two youtube videos done by Cathy Love using Cornsnakes.

Probing a Corn - Adults

Popping a Corn - Yearling's ONLY

Hopes this helps!

-----
Jason A.
"Long time Herper, first year Breeder `07."

One thing I strongly recommend is to clean the probes with rubbing alcohol between probing from snake to snake to kill any bacteria.

I had a baby snow last year get an infection just south of her cloaca most-likely due to getting sexed via a probe.