Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Need to know for sure.

Do the strains of Albino cross?

Meaning . .

het Kahl X het Sharp = 25% albino? or just a bunch more hets?

Are the kahl and sharp strains separate genes or are they just bred out to look different?

If someone buys a sharp and a kahl will they or will they not be able to produce albinos?

ALSO, what exactly does coral mean? is it a proven gene or just a bred trait (such as pastel)

If it is a gene is it simple recessive? or what?

if it isn't a gene if only 1 parent is corral do the babies show the trait?
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Russ
1.0 Basset Hound (Goofy)
1.0 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (Apollo)
1.0 Columbian Rainbow Boa (Odin)
1.0 Guyana Red-Tail Boa (Ares)
0.1 Pastel Salmon Boa (Minerva)
0.1 Rosy Boa (Athena)
1.1 Western Hognoses (???)
1.0 Albino Cal. Kingsnake

Melbourne, Fl

100% het Kahl albino x 100% het Sharp albino =

A whole litter of 50% het Kahl albino, 50% Sharp albino. Meaning, all snakes would have a 50/50 chance of being het for Kahl, and another separate 50/50 chance of being het for Sharp. Hard to keep track of.

The two strains are not compatible, so it would be like crossing a het anery with a het albino, you'd have a bunch that would be possibly het for either/both traits.
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Lauren Madar - OphidiaGems.com | CageMakers
1.0 Ball Python, 1.0 Hog Island Boa, 1.1 Hypo BCI, 1.1 Surinam BCC

thats what i thought but i wanted to make sure!!

thanks!

but that leads the question, has anyone gotten DH for Sharp and Kahl and gotten Sharp/Kahl Albinos? O.o
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Russ
1.0 Basset Hound (Goofy)
1.0 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (Apollo)
1.0 Columbian Rainbow Boa (Odin)
1.0 Guyana Red-Tail Boa (Ares)
0.1 Pastel Salmon Boa (Minerva)
0.1 Rosy Boa (Athena)
1.1 Western Hognoses (???)
1.0 Albino Cal. Kingsnake

Melbourne, Fl

Someone asked that before in the last couple of months... and no one answered that they knew of anyone who was trying to make double hets for both types, in order to see what happens when you get a fully Kahl AND Sharp albino.

If someone has done it, they have been quiet about it!

I would imagine the 'fastest' way to do it would be to breed a Kahl albino to a Sharp albino, and then breed two of the offspring together. But how would you tell for sure which of the babies had both sets of albino genes? That's the big question. Would they look different from both? No one seems to know.
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Lauren Madar - OphidiaGems.com | CageMakers
1.0 Ball Python, 1.0 Hog Island Boa, 1.1 Hypo BCI, 1.1 Surinam BCC

Actually they all would be double hets.

Since an Albino X normal = 100% hets
then an S Albuno X K albino = 100% Double Hets.

so any two offspring bred together would yeild double albinos (or wtf ever you would call it)
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Russ
1.0 Basset Hound (Goofy)
1.0 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (Apollo)
1.0 Columbian Rainbow Boa (Odin)
1.0 Guyana Red-Tail Boa (Ares)
0.1 Pastel Salmon Boa (Minerva)
0.1 Rosy Boa (Athena)
1.1 Western Hognoses (???)
1.0 Albino Cal. Kingsnake

Melbourne, Fl

Not so sure about that...

het albino x het albino =
25% normal
50% het albino ( so, normals hets = 66% het)
25% albino

So, two double het Kahl-Sharp snakes bred together would have a whole lot of possibilities... Not sure of the numbers but you could possibly get:

Kahl-Sharp albino (the goal)
Kahl albinos 66% het Sharp
Sharp albinos 66% het Kahl
and some non-albino 66% het for either (or both) strain(s).

You wouldn't be guaranteed a litter of all albinos. Telling the Kahl-Sharps from the regular Kahls and Sharps would be the issue.
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Lauren Madar - OphidiaGems.com | CageMakers
1.0 BP, 1.0 Hog Is., 1.1 Hypo BCI, 1.1 Surinam BCC, 0.1 GTP

(ignore my first sentence in my last post, it's early, I know you're on the same page)
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Lauren Madar - OphidiaGems.com | CageMakers
1.0 BP, 1.0 Hog Is., 1.1 Hypo BCI, 1.1 Surinam BCC, 0.1 GTP

AHH yea, i misunderstood, i thought you meant telling the Double hets from the hets would be a problem.

Well Hopefully the Kahl-sharp albinos would look diffrent aye? At least thats the idea.
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Russ
1.0 Basset Hound (Goofy)
1.0 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (Apollo)
1.0 Columbian Rainbow Boa (Odin)
1.0 Guyana Red-Tail Boa (Ares)
0.1 Pastel Salmon Boa (Minerva)
0.1 Rosy Boa (Athena)
1.1 Western Hognoses (???)
1.0 Albino Cal. Kingsnake

Melbourne, Fl

>So, two double het Kahl-Sharp snakes bred together would have a whole lot of possibilities... Not sure of the numbers but you could possibly get:

If you can tell the difference between the Kahl albino, Sharp albino, and the combo, the expected probabilities are the same as in the F2 generation of a standard dihybrid cross:
1/16 Kahl-Sharp albino (the goal)
3/16 Kahl albinos 66% probability het Sharp
3/16 Sharp albinos 66% probability het Kahl
9/16 non-albino 66% probability het Kahl and 66% probability het Sharp albino.

If you can't tell the difference between the Kahl albino and the Kahl albino Sharp albino combo, the probabilities are as follows:
4/16 Kahl-Sharp albino (the goal) and Kahl albinos 66% probability het Sharp
3/16 Sharp albinos 66% probability het Kahl
9/16 non-albino 66% probability het Kahl and 66% probability het Sharp albino.

If you can't tell the difference between the Sharp albino and the Kahl albino Sharp albino combo, the probabilities are as follows:
4/16 Kahl-Sharp albino (the goal) and Sharp albinos 66% probability het Kahl
3/16 Kahl albinos 66% probability het Sharp
9/16 non-albino 66% probability het Kahl and 66% probability het Sharp albino.

Worst case scenario is not being able to tell the difference between the Sharp albino, the Kahl albino, and the combo:
7/16 albinos of various types
9/16 non-albino 66% probability het Kahl and 66% probability het Sharp albino.

Your guess is as good as mine as to which will occur. But I wouldn't bet the farm on the combo looking significantly different from one of the parental strains.

Paul Hollander

>>Worst case scenario is not being able to tell the difference between the Sharp albino, the Kahl albino, and the combo:
>>7/16 albinos of various types
>>9/16 non-albino 66% probability het Kahl and 66% probability het Sharp albino.
>>
>>Your guess is as good as mine as to which will occur. But I wouldn't bet the farm on the combo looking significantly different from one of the parental strains.
>>
>>Paul Hollander
>>

If you were to breed the dbl het albinos and get a perfectly distributed litter of 16 babies, wiht each possible genetic outcome properly represented. And assuming the strong likelyhood you can't tell the difference between the strains or the combo strain......

How do you tell them apart asside from raising them all up and doing breeding trials to prove out the genetics of the original litter.

And BTW, those genetic trails would create MANY other litters of babies many of which would also be visually unidentifiable babies.
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Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
24.36 BRB
19.19 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

>How do you tell them apart asside from raising them all up and doing breeding trials to prove out the genetics of the original litter.

Breeding trials are the only way I know of. Unless you know a really reliable psychic.

Paul Hollander

Point being the process of proving out what you had would make even more unknown lineage babies then you started with.

I played with the numbers and came up with some interesting info.

ALL breedings based on litter size of 16 and follows punnet square exactly (duh, as if that would happen) Had to set some parameters to run numbers.

First gen, Kahl albino to Sharp albino
16 DH's

Second gen - breeding only one pair of DH's

7 assorted albino's of unknown lineage
9 normal's also of unknown het status

Third round of breeding - breeding only the 7 second gen albino's to start proving out lineage of each. bred to Kahl

80 albino's, 32 normals

Fourth breeding - breeding only the 7 second gen albino's to start proving out lineage of each. bred to Sharp.

80 albino's, 32 normals.

After the last two rounds of breeding you would have :
1 original Sharp
1 original Kahl
16 original DH's
16 second gen babies of which there are
1 Sharp/Kahl albino
2 Sharp het Kahl
2 Kahl het Sharp
1 Sharp
1 Kahl
9 normals

160 albino's from rounds 3 and 4 of which:
32 known Sharp het Kahl
32 known Kahl het Sharp
16 Sharp
16 Kahl
32 Sharp 50% het Kahl
32 Kahl 50% het Sharp

64 DH's

Totl of 258 snakes, 112 babies, 112 yearlings, 34 adults.

Hope you have lots of cages and lots of buyers for all the babies. And after all that, you still have only onbe Sharp/Kahl albino!!!!
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Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
24.36 BRB
19.19 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

you have too much time on your hands but I know you're smart so it was prolly too little time lol nice post
Bob

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Voices in the darkness... scream away my mental health. Can I.. ask a question.. to help save me from myself? Enemies fill up the pages, are they me?... Monday till Sunday in stages, set me free!!! " Diary of a Madman " Ozzy Osbournewww.freewebs.com/bahreptiles