Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Ok forgive me I'm not really up on all your crazy morphs and mixing of them. But how was the LAVENDER morph in Brooski made?
And what can you combine it with?
Does it combine with Axan of just make hets when mixed with Axan
Thanks
FlowersReps

Lavender brooks are just that! ... Lavender brooks! Lavender and Axanthic are two completely different/ non-compatible mutations.

Breeding Lavender to Axanthic would give you 100% double het for Axanthic and lavender

breeding those back to each other would give you lavenders, Axanthics and "snows"

~ZF
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Royal ReptileZ

Thanks but how would those make snows?
And is any thing comp with Axan?
Thanks

When Lavender and Axanthic are expressed at the same time it's called a "Snow"

Axanthic is compatible with Axanthic...

***the only *known* unique mutation (in floridana) are Peanut butters, in that when they are bred to T- they produce all morphs.***

When you breed one morph to another morph you get 100% 2x hets for both morphs, when you breed the hets back to each other you get both parent morphs (single morph) and a 3rd double morph as well as possible hets for the two parent morphs.

~ZF
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Royal ReptileZ

You mean that lavender is also amel?
Maybe not clear.
And do you know of a wc lavender/albino FL king?
;Mark
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Surrender Dorothy!

crimsonking.piczo.com/

"And do you know of a wc lavender/albino FL king?"

Mark, Most all the mutations we have were not wildcaught. They come from captive breeding siblings together. Thats how they get discovered.

I think you are still stuck in that '60's thread below when that was the only wany someone would come up with a new mutation was to find it in the wild. Those days are long gone. In the 80's we started breeding siblings back to one another. Thats why we get all these morphs in the snake world.

Its time to snap out of that long acid trip man.
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"Yeah ya told me, and ya wrote it down too. But how the hell am I supposed to remember!"

The above post was not meant to be derogatory towards Mark or the gov't of Canada.
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"Yeah ya told me, and ya wrote it down too. But how the hell am I supposed to remember!"

Too late.
:Mark
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Surrender Dorothy!

crimsonking.piczo.com/

Please don't put words in my mouth or thoughts/ideas into any of my words Rainer.
I was asking if he knew of any wc that IS ALL.
:Mark
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Surrender Dorothy!

crimsonking.piczo.com/

You are right on. That’s why it is so funny the locality guys getting so bent out of shape about all the morphs when their inbreeding started it, and the morphs are the most specific inbred locality pure of all in some cases!

i don't think you meant anything by it but that knuckle ball has a little extra zip on there, no? i think it is just a straight forward question, and if anyone has an answer for it, just for the sake of knowledge, i would also be interested in knowing.

anyone know of a w/c albino brooksi phase of floridana? from the 60's up to current?

daveb

anyone know of a w/c albino brooksi phase of floridana? from the 60's up to current?

Yes I do know for a fact that there were two back in the 80's that popped out of wildcaught stock. I don't recall the details but it seems these dissapeared from the hobby.

Also the Lemke line poipped out of breeding stock from wildcaught parents.. Problem was he got some fakes from Gulf Coast stock AFTER that and had his line critized for that. I had a trio from Lloyd and sold them to Brandon osborne about 7 years ago (or more?). I don't know what he did with them.

Bottom line to your question is none that I know of were fround in the wild. But like I said before, morphs pop out of brother to sister breedings. It very unlikly that a lavender albino was ever found. That does not invalidate them and that was my point earlier in response to Crimsonkings post. Just because someone never found an actual lavender does not mean they are not real floridana. There were no hypos, axanthic or peanut butter found in the wild either.
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"Yeah ya told me, and ya wrote it down too. But how the hell am I supposed to remember!"

No offense!!! I have to disagree with the statement there were no hypo Floridana caught in the wild, there were a lot of very high yellow floridana collected and sold back in the 70’s and early 80’s not much was known about genetics. The general population mainly knew of T-, T , anerythristic, snow, zig-zag and aberrant patterns. A new found morph was kept a major secret.

Dealers, brokers and wholesalers basically graded snakes very pretty, pretty, normal and ugly or by size and physical defects. Basically everything new color variants of corn snakes or albino Burmese in the mid 80’s. Don’t get me wrong I know there were many other colubrid color variants but those were 2 of the most popular.

I’m sure that there are many ole timers out there that don’t use a computer that can verify the odd things they’ve seen and sold. Unfortunately a lot of those ole timers have passed and unfortunately many of those wild caught specimens did not survive, others went to families who wanted to own a snake and the rest seem to be unable to be tracked.

I believe, but could be wrong, that there has been an albino caught of almost every species of snake in Florida. How far fetched is it to think that there wasn’t an albino W/C? I only know my state Florida but to the best of my knowledge there are only 4 snakes that a W/C albino has yet to be found; salt marsh water snake, brown water snake, mud snake. You can make it 5 if you include floridana but in my heart of hearts I know there had to be at least one caught. Whether it was ever used in the pet trade or breeder project, who knows? I do know the first albino floridana I saw was at the 3rd or 4th Expo in Orlando, they were being represented as true but you could tell they were crosses.

Just my 2 cents. I just hope all of us breeders can try to keep a pure line of normal phase snakes. So 10 years down the line when the new generation is sick of seeing designer snakes, they have pure no het specimens to work with.

By the way this is the 2500 century and not all albinos are being selectively breed or inbred to create morphs. Last year an albino ring neck snake was caught in New Port Richey also a personal friend caught a albino cottonmouth.

Bottom line beauty is in the eye of the beer holder. You think a snake is pretty buy it. If you want to get top dollar for any hatchlings it produces know the lineage.

This isn’t a personal attack on anyone. It’s just a response to a statement.
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B

The 21st century, sorry.
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B

Well i don't personally KNOW of any WC Amel floridana... i've HEARD about WC amels and i heard of amels that popped out of WC adults, i have no clue if they were lavedners or T- amels

What happened to those snakes?? (if they do/did exsist)... bets me... no one can give me an answer!?!?

Who knows they may be sitting in someone's living room???

~Z
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Royal ReptileZ

If I myself or almost anyone for that matter came on the forum with a history of Lavenders or just about any snake be it normal or morph, someone....if not many people will argue that it just can't be. Therefor why bother..... I think I have an eye for some Hybrids and will use my best judgement. I don't think there's any way we can get the answers we wish we had
Tom Stevens
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TomsSnakes.com

Tom,......

I love your statement!!LOL......it does seem to be quite fitting these days!LOL

~Doug
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"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open mouth and remove any doubt!"

It is really a bummer we most likely won't get to the bottom of this. I just refuse to waste too much time on the subject anymore. If I think a snake is a Hybrid it usually comes from the fact I have seen them in person from people who produced them and represented them honestly.
If I tried to explain how to spot a Hybrid it would only start a wave of suspicion with lots of people and since there's enough of that already may as well just let everyone use their best judgement, and also the judgement of others who very well may know more about this than they do...
Tom Stevens
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TomsSnakes.com

I agree,....

I've had my fair share of "pissing matches" on forums, and I too can sometimes anticipate things getting ugly, and usually don't bother with alot of issues I don't agree with, of course there are some exceptions. But most of the time(I'm sure you will agree) it doesn't even begin to merit the time spent typing out long, carefully thought out explanations pertaining to certain topics, only to be "shot down" by some kids ignorant five word reply to your post!

I know you can relate!LOL

~Doug
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"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open mouth and remove any doubt!"

>>
"And do you know of a wc lavender/albino FL king?"'
>>;Mark
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Holy Osmosis Mark! your telepathy or their ESP sure are going haywire.

Did my computer erase all the other stuff that was perceived to be in your post?
LP

well there is NO documentation. the lav brooks magically appeared about a year or 2 after the albino calkings hit the hobby. some beleive its pure some dont. the main problem is the "P" word see a calking bred to a fla.king is still "pure" getula but there are splitters who actually beleive them to be different sp. take for example these babies i produced this year the female is from ricks lines and the father from gulfcoast

mother

father

babies


some beleive them to be crosses while others that have seen them say pure. noone will ever no 100% eitherway but i am pretty sure they are "pure" getula but i certainly could be wrong. we all are now on that slipperyslope of responsible breedings and record keeping that wasnt done in the past. sadly its the morphs that will always be suspect w/the purist luckily most purist dont like morphs anyway so it kinda works out. like i tell everyone who is in the market buy what is visually appealing to you and go from there if your a diehard purist trust noone and go snakehuntin ,,,,,,,,,,thomas davis
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Morphs... just like baseball cards BUT ALIVE, how cool is that???

my website www.barmollysplace.com

You're right, a lot of ripoffs really wouldn't have happenend if some snakes had simply been labeled "Pretty Cool getula". The buyer could then decide if that is what they want. But there have been times when sellers have decided that a 3/4 Florida 1/4 cal king is close enough to call it ABC morph brooksi and that what the the buyer doesn't know won't hurt him. If someone tries to get away with that selling a "1959 'vette with all original parts" but it's really been rebuilt with "better than original" parts, they call that a felony. If what's under the hood (genetically) doesn't matter to a buyer then that should be their choice. It's not unreasonable for a buyer to ask or expect accurate labels.
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Lindsay Pike
Urotopia Uromastyx

agreed, my point is there is/was no documentation of amel fla.kings UNTIL the amel calis made it into the hobby. then and since there are amels in all the getula ssp. hmmmm its fairly easy to see what was & is still being done. i beleive this is also why most diehard purist dont really care for morphs. whether up front or behind closed doors honesty should of prevailed sadly it didnt. take for instance the second pic is of "pure" locale f1 l.g.nigra

now this one is of a 50/50 cross l.g.nigra and l.g.california,

see how much they look like nigra hmmmm lets say the calking was amel making these 50/50s hets. lets say i sold them as nigra and lets say somewhere in a year or two someone pops out amel nigra hmmmm could this have been done with ALL the getula morphs??? hmmmmm??? ftr i would never sell these offspring just trying to show how its very possible,,,,,,,,thomas

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Morphs... just like baseball cards BUT ALIVE, how cool is that???

my website www.barmollysplace.com

great points. there are already albino nigers out there (lemke had them in the 80's) and they are crappy looking.I also know of some albino mexican black kings that should hit the market next year.I don't know for sure that they are 100% nigrita but the breeding claims they are and he has a good rep?

L8r

OK, Lav is albino and albino is albino, right? If you breed a Lav to albino do you get 50% Lav 50% albino?
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B