Reptile & Amphibian Forums

The female super tiger that I posted about a few weeks ago that seemed to show positive results from being treated with Baytril has died. She relapsed 2 days ago and her lungs filled with bloody mucus. I found her in a pile this morning all twisted up and laying in a deep puddle of very bloody mucus. I have never seen anything like this before, so if anyone can shed some light as to why her lungs would have been bleeding I would be very interested in hearing it.

In short, I retract the positive statements I made concerning Baytril. Once again, to date, I have yet to see this or other antibiotics actually save the life of a snake with a serious RI.
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If 50% of one's enemies are still breathing,... it just means you're doing a half-assed job.

It sounds like IBD ( Inclusion body disease) Pythons tend to contort when affected by this virus. Mites seem to be carriers I say seem because of conflicting science articles. The other thing is there seems to be another bacteria out there that causes renal bleeding then apon death the animal spits blood up or it slowly runs up the esophogus and out of the mouth because of the gases being generated by the dead body. I would get her tested for IBD and if IBD is the problem your collection is in serious trouble and needs immediate attention. I hope this information helps some what.
Please get her tested for the sake of your collection and others IBD is a veru serious disease that can take out entire collections.
Thank you
Albinoretic.com

No, I haven't had mites since the late 80's and this was a single snake that had only been housed in a seperate quarantine room. I took her in from a friend to try to cure her and never introduced her to anywhere even remorely near any of my pristinely clean stock. This is the first death I have had in well over a year, but she came to me very sick. The only other death I had was from another very sick albino labyrinth adult that I purchased from Ben Rogers. Other than that I only get an ocassional egg death or still born. But this is common, as I'm sure you are aware. I don't have any adult deaths as my stock is comprised of a "closed colony" of pristinely healthy animals. And it certainly isn't anything like IBD. It was a very serious respitory infection. Every snake I have ever seen die of one of these always contorted when desperately trying to breathe as they choked on their own mucus at the very end.

I appreciate your suggestions immensely though. Thanks for taking the time to answer my post.

>>It sounds like IBD ( Inclusion body disease) Pythons tend to contort when affected by this virus. Mites seem to be carriers I say seem because of conflicting science articles. The other thing is there seems to be another bacteria out there that causes renal bleeding then apon death the animal spits blood up or it slowly runs up the esophogus and out of the mouth because of the gases being generated by the dead body. I would get her tested for IBD and if IBD is the problem your collection is in serious trouble and needs immediate attention. I hope this information helps some what.
>>Please get her tested for the sake of your collection and others IBD is a veru serious disease that can take out entire collections.
>>Thank you
>> Albinoretic.com
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If 50% of one's enemies are still breathing,... it just means you're doing a half-assed job.

I have had it prescribed on a few ocassions and have never had it cure anything reptilian. I'm so rry about the loss of the super. Definitely have a necropsy doen so you can see what the underlying cause was, if it is possible to know.
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Marcia Pimentel
Tango River Reptiles
GiantFeeders

>>The female super tiger that I posted about a few weeks ago that seemed to show positive results from being treated with Baytril has died. She relapsed 2 days ago and her lungs filled with bloody mucus. I found her in a pile this morning all twisted up and laying in a deep puddle of very bloody mucus. I have never seen anything like this before, so if anyone can shed some light as to why her lungs would have been bleeding I would be very interested in hearing it.
>>
>>In short, I retract the positive statements I made concerning Baytril. Once again, to date, I have yet to see this or other antibiotics actually save the life of a snake with a serious RI.
>>-----
>>If 50% of one's enemies are still breathing,... it just means you're doing a half-assed job.
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Thomas Jones
aligatorhunter@earthlink.net

Tiger Retics Rule!!

Hi Brian.

A number of years ago I spoke with a very good herp vet about respiratory infections. At the time he had recently performed a necropsy on a large Peruvian boa that died with bloody mucus clogging the windpipe.

If the animal's previous environment had been very dry for an extended period of time, this could have caused the R.I. and resulted in acute irritation to the lungs with subsequent bleeding. By that time it's a big problem and often cannot be treated; the damaged lungs keep churning out lots of mucus which eventually clogs the breathing.

You may have gotten the animal with this major lung damage, and there was nothing that could have been done to reverse it.

Regards,

Bill

Once a snake has an advanced RI it is usually curtains unfortunately. You have to remember that snakes don't have a backup. One lung, that's it. I've seen Aeromonas Hydrophilia wipe out half of a collection(twenty snakes approx.). It's difficult to detect until it's in it's advanced stages which unfortunately is too late for any meds to help. This one's even tough on quarantine procedures and it doesn't necesarily affect the eating habits or induce regurges! I always keep a close eye out for lack of strong muscle tissue or "visible" ribs when the snake looks otherwise healthy. These are both possible earlier signs of a potentially serious problem.

As Marcia pointed out a necropsy would be the smart thing to do, but DO NOT freeze the snake, refrigerate it and get it to the vet asap.