Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have the Rats in question and I have the exudate I've mentioned.
I'm also willing to put up some money toward sending the aforementioned to a lab for further research.
Someone/anyone with some serious input would be appreciated.
We need a plan.
How, When, Where?
Lab?
Looking for?
Determined how?
Financing?
We're all pretty much agreed it's boa specific, probably fat related, possibly toxin involved.
It is a husbandry issue. We've just got to pin it down and take corrective action.
jsc

Contact Cornell University....they did the lab testing for the Dog and cat problems related to the Dog food Toxins.

It is my understanding that Rats can handle alot more Toxins than can Dogs and especially Boas due to the easy renal failure in dogs and boas.

I believe alot more people than we think have had these incidents but may not belong to forums such as this one to even be able to come forward.

Rat suppliers buy rats to fill orders...and buying rats from testing labs just does not make sense.

I wish we had real data to go by but so far it has only been word of mouth, although from two of the big rat suppliers, I have been assured that these lab surplus rats are safe.
I really would like to know more. Thanks and please keep us informed.

Andy Federico
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I think it's more about the specific size of the rats.. Most ball pythons can't handle an XXXL rat.. The large rats are the only ones I've ever had a problem with... I dunno about the big python keepers, has anyone asked around on that forum?

As I previously stated, just recently I've had this problem (regurge and greasy stool, no bad shed,no mortality) with a neonate Central American Boa that ate a live very fat crawler mouse from my own colony. It would seem it was too large and too fatty a meal for a small snake better suited to eat Anoles at the time.
jsc

I have no doubts about the "Zucker" rats causing a problem with boa constrictors..... Without raining on the parade of the people who brought the "Zucker" rats to attention, there are other rats that are causing problems that are NOT "Zucker" rats.. I buy live rats the size of small puppies from my local petstore and they have never caused a problem in my collection.. Is it really hard to believe that (some) lab rats exposed to certain chemicals find their way into a boa's mouth? Zucker rats are not what caused my problem. Also, would it be so hard to believe that Zucker rats and "toxic" rats cause the same symptoms? I'm sorry if my posts seem comical, I'm just a young girl who dropped out of highschool that has a lot of boas and is explaining a situation. No biologist over here but I know I've never fed my snakes a Zucker and I know that the live rats I buy locally are the same size, if not larger than the ones I bought from a certain rodent supplier.

take it to your vet. tell them of the problems that we are having. that you want to have a blood analysis done on the rat to check for any kind of toxinsit may have bin fed. thats what they do for dogs.this will reveal everything.
greg

Do you have a vet close by? I would start there as I'm sure they could send out tissue samples and possibly blood samples for analysis. Not too sure about the blood once the rat's been frozen though.

Billy

>>I have the Rats in question and I have the exudate I've mentioned.
>>I'm also willing to put up some money toward sending the aforementioned to a lab for further research.
>>Someone/anyone with some serious input would be appreciated.
>>We need a plan.
>>How, When, Where?
>>Lab?
>>Looking for?
>>Determined how?
>>Financing?
>>We're all pretty much agreed it's boa specific, probably fat related, possibly toxin involved.
>>It is a husbandry issue. We've just got to pin it down and take corrective action.
>>jsc

if there was a toxin in the rat wouldn't freezing preserve it more?
greg

Has anyone bothered to collect any of this greasy mess of a stool and take it into their vet to be examined? Couldn't the shed skins also be something worth looking at? If the only certain way to know that a rat is going to give this end result is to feed it off and see what happens....you could test a lot of rats before you find anything.

Have any of these animals that have had these stools, followed by death, been taken in for a necropsy? If so, do you have any results to speak of?