Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I am thinking of moving to Florida but have not made a decision. If I do go then I will unfortunately have to give up my Easterns. Are Texas Indigos legal in Florida? How do the Texans compare with the Easterns as far as habits and attitudes? Which of the Cribos are the most like Eastern Indigos?

Thanks,
Dan

Had to move to FL myself not too long ago which prevented us from keeping Easterns. Texans are indeed legal here but I'd advise that you become familiar with the scalation differences between the two in the event you run across a less informed law enforcement official (just in case). From what I've read they are equal in attitude, although IMHO I still like the Easterns a little better for their color.

As far as the Cribo's go. I only keep Y/T's and they're about 50-50 in attitude. Like most snakes they all have their own personalities. Haven't heard much about bites from B/T's or Uni's when you hear about bites it seems to be the Y/T that is most likely.

Just my (relatively inexperienced) opinion. There are a number of folks here that have more experience with different ssp.

Regards,
Jeff

all of the subs are really pretty docile, almost shy even [wc included] except the yt's. wc adult yt's are noticeably jumpier and quicker to pull the trigger than their cousins. ouch!!! they will calm down some but .....i kinda like the 'uglier' look of texans myself but it does seem like i'm in the minority on that one. most people want that super glossy look that only the easterns possess.

From what I've seen, Texans and Easterns are fairly similar in size, dispositions and habits. As Jeff mentioned some Florida keepers of Texans have run into some confusion with Florida Fish and Game agents (Chris?) as far as being able to tell the difference between the two. If you know what you are looking at, it's a no-brainer, but apparently these guys don't always get to see a lot of Easterns. Easterns can have red (orange), black or occasionally white chins, and Texans are somewhat variable, but one thing that doesn't change is head scalation. The Eastern is easily identified by the fact that the 3rd supralabial scale is cut off from the ocular scales because the 2nd and 4th supralabials meet above it. If the 3rd supralabial scale (counting from the corner of the mouth to the front) contacts the ocular scales, it's not an Eastern. I've never seen one vary from that. Sometimes these guys want to get into counting dorsals, ventrals and subcaudals. I think they are just trying to show what they know, or hoping against hope for that "big bust". Anyone that has seen both can tell the difference at a glance.

I think probably the closest Central or South American Drymarchon to an Eastern would be rubidus, as far as coloration and temperament. They are difficult to tell morphologically from Texans, and scale counts may, in fact be in order. Rubidus normally has more white and the entire venter, or nearly so, can be white or cream color. I found that out recently when I purchased an adult pair of "Texans". I posted pictures on here and some of the guys said "Hey, those look like rubidus". So, I went and found (actually was sent) the scale counts for erebennus and rubidus, and sure enough, they are rubidus. I'm not disappointed, because rubidus actually appear harder to find and obtain than Texans. I had intended to find a pair and add them to my breeding projects anyway. Hopefully next year I'll have some rubidus babies to trade for Texans, etc. The pair I have are huge, ravenous and puppy-dog tame.

As the others mentioned, you can own Texas indigos or any of the cribos legally in FL. I also live in FL and I originally looked into erebennus as a legal alternative to couperi. However, the more I learn about them the more I like them and now I think I actually prefer them to couperi (maybe this is just one of those subconscious coping mechanisms
As far as fish and wildlife goes, you probably dont have anything to worry about. The only reason an officer was in my house was because I was being inspected for my venomous permit.
The officer actually had a paper showing erebennus / couperi scale counts in his car and he didn't give me any problems once he verified it was a Texas indigo. (Of course he took another step back when he saw my 5' gaigeae sticking out of his hidebox)
I have no experience with rubidus but out of the cribos I'm currently keeping,(BT's, Unicolors, YT's) the unicolors are probably the most tame. Of course I think that's probably an individual animal thing based on how much you interact with them.
Good luck,
Chris

Uni's are most like Easterns & Texans in temperment...I have all of the subs...Not sure who else has a collection to compare...

My Rubidus, (unlike OldHerper's) are all very iffy in attitude and will bite at any time..My biggset one we just call
"Killer Mex"

I have 2 YT's that are fairly gentle and 2 that would rather eat you than prey!

My BT's are all very gentle...

My uni's are great big puppy dogs...

All my Easterns are gentle..

3 of my Texans are very gentle, but one we call "Chainsaw"!!!!

My opinion only...Take it for what it cost...
-----
Carl W Gossett
Garage Door Herps
Monument,Colorado...northern territory of the Great Republic of Texas

I don't know to much about Eastern Indigos (I will be picking my first one up in two weeks), but I have some experience with Texas Indigos. I had about 10 different ones counting adults and babies that I've hatched and I can tell you they are very hardy snakes and very tame (never been bit). My first one that I raised from a hatchling was 19" long and grew to around 5 foot in 18 months. I then had to part with him due to a lenghty overseas assignment. But when I had him I was a rookie to Indigos. I raised that one for 18 months with no heating lamp, no heating strips, no thermometer (room temp) in a 4' by 2' cage and fed it garter snakes, rattle snakes, frogs , mice, rats, and some fish. When I got rid of him he was in excellent shape and very pretty (quite dark for a Texas also). Just wanted to illustrate how hardy these guys are even in less than perfect conditions.
Take care and good luck!
Indigos RULE ! ! !