Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I own model #433 vision display tank that is 48"x28"x28", roughly a 75 gallon tank that houses two adult bearded dragons. However, I am having trouble properly heating the tank. I have one 150watt dayspot bulb in a clamp lamp style dome fixture but it is only keeping the tank at 75 degrees. Does anyone have any suggestions on what I can do to heat the tank properly? I'm worried over my pair's health due to the low temps. They are continuing to eat their salad daily but have dropped to only one or two crickets a day. They are both lethargic, not even climbing to bask anymore, just laying underneath their wood overhangs in the sand sleeping.

Any suggestions are appreciated!

Thank you
tangopandaucf
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"Speak softly to my lizard fair nor raise your hand to me, For they are quick to take offense And quicker to champion me." ~Anne McCaffrey.

1.1 Bearded Dragon
0.4 Bearded Dragon Hatchlings
2.2 Leopard Gecko
0.2 Leopard Gecko Hatchlings
1.1 Blood Corn
1.0 Ball Python
0.1 Mali Uromastyx
6 leopard gecko eggs in the incubator

You lost me. Are you saying that you have both a Vision 433 and a 75 gallon tank? The Vision is more like 150 gallons which is why I'm confused.

I know both Bearded Dragon and Uromastyx keepers have used ceramic heat emitters in Visions so there has to be a way. I don't want to give any advice and have you melt your cage. I do know the molded light areas in Visions have heat limitations so proceed carefully. I think you have to mount the heater inside the cage somehow.
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Currently keeping a small collection of various Gonyosoma. Both G. janseni and G. oxycephala.

I only have the one model #433 vision tank. I've been told that its about the same dimensions as a 75g tank. I received a quick reply from Vision saying that undertank heat pads can be used but I'm not sure which ones are ok to use. I know that the exoterra heat pads can only be used on glass.. so I'm unsure of how to proceed.

Thanks
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"Speak softly to my lizard fair nor raise your hand to me, For they are quick to take offense And quicker to champion me." ~Anne McCaffrey.

1.1 Bearded Dragon
0.4 Bearded Dragon Hatchlings
2.2 Leopard Gecko
0.2 Leopard Gecko Hatchlings
1.1 Blood Corn
1.0 Ball Python
0.1 Mali Uromastyx
6 leopard gecko eggs in the incubator

I believe Bearded Dragons need a strong source of overhead heat. Some under-tank heating can be used but not for as much supplemental heat as you need.

Like I said I know people have used ceramic heat emitters inside Visions, I just don't recall how they did it.

Possibly radiant heat panels, I don't know. Call Bob at Pro Products and see if he has a RHP that can provide sufficient overhead heat. I have never used a RHP with lizards requiring high heat.
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Currently keeping a small collection of various Gonyosoma. Both G. janseni and G. oxycephala.

I use 100 watt MVB's from Big Apple in my Bearded dragon cages. On top of my Rete's stack I see temps around 120 F.

What are the temps in the room?

What temps are you looking to achieve?

Visions are poorly insulated perhaps you should consider insulating the outside of the cage as well as useing a substrate conductive to increasing thermal mass.

Best of Luck
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Jeremy

"I am become death, the destroyer of worlds" July 16, 1945 Robert Oppenheimer

0.1 Snow "Khal" RTB
1.1 Double Het "Sharp" Snow RTB's
1.1 Hypomelenistic RTB's
0.0.3 Hypomelenistic RTB's
0.2 Pastel Hypo RTB's
1.0 Double Het Stripe Albino RTB's
0.1 Suriname RTB
0.1 Anerthrystic RTB
3.6.11 Red Bearded Dragon's
1.1 Rhinoceros Iguana's
1.0 Green Iguana
1.0 Ball Python
1.1 Cream Golden Retrieviers
1.0 Pomeriaian
0.3 Catus Terribilis
0.1 Spouse
1.0.1 Child

I used to have that model cage for my boa. Could not maintain temps until I put light fixtures inside the cage. The room was cold, and Visions do not heat easily in such conditions.

One easy way to do this is to mount a metal utility box on the inside ceiling of the cage and then mount a ceramic lamp fixture onto that.

Since you will be dealing with higher spot temps than my cage needed, my advice is to use the round cast aluminum utility boxes they sell. They act as a heat sink. In fact, you may want to use aluminum spacers (cut pieces of extruded aluminum work well) betwwen the box and cage top to further prevent the plastic from melting.

Two fixtures are better than one for heating a cage of that volume.
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Mark

I figured I might have to do some sort of mounting inside the cage itself, however the terms and items you are talking about make no sense at all to me. Thank you for the suggestions though!
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"Speak softly to my lizard fair nor raise your hand to me, For they are quick to take offense And quicker to champion me." ~Anne McCaffrey.

1.1 Bearded Dragon
0.4 Bearded Dragon Hatchlings
2.2 Leopard Gecko
0.2 Leopard Gecko Hatchlings
1.1 Blood Corn
1.0 Ball Python
0.1 Mali Uromastyx
6 leopard gecko eggs in the incubator

I keep a couple bearded dragons and 75 is a good ambient cage temperature. What you do need is a hot spot of around 110 or more. If you are keeping the ambient temp in the cage around 75 that is perfectly fine. Check your basking site temps with a good temp gun and get an accurate reading directly under the heat lamp. This should read 110 or higher. I keep mine higher. A 150watt spot bulb should produce a number much higher than that, in fact it will probably be too hot. I would say a 45watt halogen flood will be more than enough. I would recommend using 2 lower wattage bulbs over 1 high watt bulbs also.

One way to increase this temp is to raise the basking site. This can easily be done with bricks, rocks, wood, etc. I use bricks or rocks b/c they hold heat great, but anything will work. They also hold heat after the light is turned off.

In addition BD sometimes slow down in the wintertime and consume less food. Also they eat fewer insects as they age and start to eat more vegetables so this is something you should consider when looking at their eating habits. You may have a lizaqrd that is reacting to temps and light and getting rdy to brumate.

I've been worried about both my bearded dragons being housed in this tank. They are both lethargic, hardly ever moving onto the basking spot. I believe the temps in the basking spot sit around 85 and im unable to get them higher. I've been told this type of tank does not hold heat well, has poor insulation? However, I took out the female and soaked her in warm water for a good twenty minutes today and am still getting an unresponsive lethargic type of reaction from her. She lays there with her eyes closed and even when I do put her on the wood/brick area of the basking spot she moves back to the shaded sand area and goes back to sleep.

Not sure what to do about this. Neither of the beardies are eating their salad, and only the male is eating one or two crickets a day.
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"Speak softly to my lizard fair nor raise your hand to me, For they are quick to take offense And quicker to champion me." ~Anne McCaffrey.

1.1 Bearded Dragon
0.4 Bearded Dragon Hatchlings
2.2 Leopard Gecko
0.2 Leopard Gecko Hatchlings
1.1 Blood Corn
1.0 Ball Python
0.1 Mali Uromastyx
6 leopard gecko eggs in the incubator

Well I'm not a vet or an expert but it seems like you may have initiated a brumation period by accidentally lowering your temps. This can happen in the fall or winter b/c room temps fall and affect the cages. You would have to have been keeping track of their weight to have a good idea if they are healthy. If they haven't lost any weight there is probably nothing wrong and they are probably slowing down for the winter. Of course they may be sick. Monitoring their weight is the best way to know but you would have to have been keeping track. I think first off a visit to a good vet is in order and will help you with the dragons themselves.

As far as the cage goes try raising the basking spot closer to the bulb. Try a halogen bulb as well, they give off the most heat for the least watts. Home Depot outdoor halogens will work fine. Also block any ventilation holes. This will slow air movement and raise temps. Mounting the fixtures inside as someone said is a great idea and will probably solve your problem. If you dont have a temp gun, buy one. It gives you good surface temps which is what your concerned with. You need to get the surface temps on the basking site above 110.

you need to either bring the heat lamp closer to the bearded dragons, or the bearded dragons closer to the heat lamp. I usually keep my heat lamp just out of reach of the reptile, which means that it's always less than a foot away from the basking spot. With a 45 watt halogen bulb in a cage almost the same size as yours (4'x2'x2'), I can get basking temperatures up to 180 surface temps (which obviously are not useful, but just an example). My bearded dragon has a basking temp of about 125f, and he's about 9-10" away from the heat lamp.

Granted these are wooden cages, but in the bearded dragon cage I have added an extra large vent somewhat near the basking spot because without it I was unable to get the temperature low enough.

Most reptile bulbs are highly innefficient as well. For a comparison, I have the 45 watt halogen bulbs in two of my 4'x2'x2' enclosures (for my bearded dragon and one of my uromastyx), and in the third I have a 150 watt red reptile flood bulb, and I'd have to say that higher temps are more easily achieved with the low wattage halogens. In that respect, however, you have to be more careful with halogen bulbs as it is easier to cause burns. Especially if you buy the spot bulbs or the bulbs with a clear hexagon in the center of the lens. Always get flood bulbs that don't have that clear hexagon (so it has that textured appearance all across the lens).

That's my basic advice to you. Find a way to move the bulb closer to the reptiles. Also, the way vision has their light shrouds is only affective if they are stacked. Otherwise you are losing more heat through the top than is penetrating into the enclosure. That's why it is easier to heat any enclosure with the lights on the inside as opposed to resting on the screen top.

75 degrees is a fine ambient. The basking temps are the problem.

P.S. The room that I keep those three enclosures in is currently 67 degrees f. I have a cattle trough in my basement for my russian tortoise breeding group that has basking temperatures over 120 and an ambient temperature of roughly 70f. That has enclosed lights but only plexiglass covering the top, and the temperature in the basement is only 59 degrees f right now. It's all about picking the right lights for the right applications, and keeping them close to the animals you are trying to heat (obvious exception: snakes).