Reptile & Amphibian Forums

What kinda snake is this??
And I wonder does Pine = Bull = Gopher??
Thx man~

That looks like some sort of Pinesnake morph, probably a leucistic southern Pine.

>>And I wonder does Pine = Bull = Gopher??

It used to, since they were all just subspecies of widely ranging species.

Now they have been split up with the Pine, Bull, and Gophersnakes as separate species.

The problem is
- there are several species of snakes known as "gophersnakes",
- one species (catenifer) includes subspecies (ssp.) known as gophersnakes and another called the bullsnake
- the Mexican species (deppei) is widespread and occurs in a variety of habitats from desert to open forest, just like the US gophersnakes, but hobbyists insist on calling it a Mexican "Pinesnake" because it sounds more glamourous (?).

So here is a current species breakdown:
- Pituophis melanoleucus - Pinesnakes
- P. catenifer - Gophersnakes and the Bullsnake
- P. deppei - Mexican Bullsnakes (sometimes called Mexican Pines, although their habitat preferences are more like those of gophersnakes/bullsnakes)
- P. lineaticollis - Central American Pine/Gophersnakes

then there are a few monotypic morphs that some people don't recognize
- P. ruthveni - Louisiana Pinesnake (may be just a ssp. of Pinesnake)
- P. bimaris - Cape Gophersnake (may be a ssp. of catenifer)
- P. vertebralis - Baja gophersnake (same as above)
- P. insulanus - Cedros Island Gophersnake (same as above)
- P. sayi - Bullsnake (most people regard this as a ssp. of catenifer)

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Chris Harrison
San Antonio, Texas

Thank you Chris, you are a pro.

Since pine, gopher and bull snakes ain't popular in Hong Kong, I have difficulties digging the practical informations for their habitat and the settings. Can you tell me a little bit more about their differences as well as their preferences according to their habitat??

The guy who sold me this snake claimed it is a patternness pine snake, I've got some more pic of it and shall post 'em tomorrow for better id.

There is a bullsnake forum on here too. Go check it out for more info. The main thing with bulls, pines, and gophers is to not keep them too warm. Usually mid to upper 70's is good. Anything hotter than 82 and they start getting stress out.

patternless S. Pine Snake [Pituophis m. mugitis]....TOM CRUTCHFIELD

I meant to say ALBINO patternless.TC

gotta go with southern pine.
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Todd Hughes

Some more pix taken last week

More pix... how do you guys post a few pix in one single msg??? I just can't find a way to put more than 1 pic at a time...

Ok, I will keep the white guy in a cool place. Can anyone tell me if my setting is ok? I did not provide the snake any hiding place, it didn't seem stressed, I guess it's becos I have the tank placed in a dim corner inside my house. There's a rough surface deep water dish and 3 pieces of fist size rocks for it to rub against and exercise, I feed the snake with a baby rat within 4 days, I've got a red bulb to keep the tank warm (I bought it becos we are in winter now), I've got a heat matt place under 1/3 of the tank. The tank's bedding's newspaper.

What else should I add to the tank??? I have plnned to add a hollow (Bamboo like) shaped pottery to the tank for it to exercise, will share the pic later.

Pls advise.

What're the differences between southern pine and northern pine??

The northern pine is the nominate species, P. m. melanoleucus, the Florida pine is subspecies mugitus. The latter, in its normal phase, is less clearly marked than the northern, looking almost as if the snake was dusty. The southern form gets a little longer at maximum, but both run on average, the same four to five and one half feet.

In my opinion, any snake should have a hide box in its cage.

~~Greg~~

I agree with Greg, especially on the hide issue, it needs to burrow or have a hide of some kind. I use any size box that the snake can cram into, they like it kinda tight. Poptart boxes are good! When it's dirty, throw it and replace!
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Todd Hughes