Reptile & Amphibian Forums

so mostly for dave, but ive noticed alot (more often BRBs than anything) of snakes from the same litter can vary in price as much as 100 or even 150$ sometimes. having to do with grades i guess, what determines the "grade" of snake from the same little is it just go by looks alone or is there more to it?

I grade mine by looks, color, intensity of color, contrast between dorsal and background, spacing of pattern (busy or linked pattern vs spaced out) etc. Not a quantative analysis at all. I pick out 25% of each litter as the picks of the litter at the highest price, then 1/3 of what's left as the lowest grading at the lowest price. Then split the remainder in half for the two middle prices. I do make some adjustments for specific litters. Some may be above average and have no or very few at the lower porce(s) and more at the higher ones or vice-versa.

Just my attempt to point out the better looking ones (IMO) and charge accordingly for them.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

I look at the babies and price them at different levels based on color and pattern. I also price females higher than males. As the snakes grow I increase the prices for most of them though a few turn out not as pretty as expected and I drop the prices on those. I try to set prices so that a few of the best ones do not sell because having them around to show to potential buyers really helps to sell babies the following year.
Jeff

>>I grade mine by looks, color, intensity of color, contrast between dorsal and background, spacing of pattern (busy or linked pattern vs spaced out) etc. Not a quantative analysis at all. I pick out 25% of each litter as the picks of the litter at the highest price, then 1/3 of what's left as the lowest grading at the lowest price. Then split the remainder in half for the two middle prices. I do make some adjustments for specific litters. Some may be above average and have no or very few at the lower porce(s) and more at the higher ones or vice-versa.
>>
>>Just my attempt to point out the better looking ones (IMO) and charge accordingly for them.
>>-----
>>Thanks,
>>
>>
>>Dave Colling
>>
>>www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com
>>
>>
>>
>>0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
>>0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)
>>
>>LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
>>26.49 BRB
>>20.21 BCI
>>And those are only the breeders
>>
>>lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

At what age/size do you increase the price? And by how much?
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Dave,
...I raise prices as they get bigger and become more desireable to keep because of coloring up and also because they just seem more substantial as they get bigger. As you know if you have similar colored snakes on your table at a show but one is 18 inches and the other is 24 inches the larger one will always get lots more attention. I usually have the lowest prices at shows and on the internet for them when they are babies but gradually raise prices to around twice the baby price by the time they are 25 to 30 inches long. I have 44 2007 babies here that I am keeping through the winter. I was selling them for $75 and up as babies and raised prices to $100 and up as they reached 20 to 24 inches. I plan to sell them for $140 to $250 this coming spring and summer when they are 30 inches or larger. Part of the increase in prices can also be attributed to having less competition selling them after many other breeders have sold out of babies.
Jeff

>>At what age/size do you increase the price? And by how much?
>>-----
>>Thanks,
>>
>>
>>Dave Colling
>>
>>www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com
>>
>>
>>
>>0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
>>0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)
>>
>>LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
>>26.49 BRB
>>20.21 BCI
>>And those are only the breeders
>>
>>lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Thanks for sharing Jeff. I still have 38 myself!! Not too shabby for showing up late in the season with 101 babies, having prices from $125 - $200 and not wholesaling a single baby this year!!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

okay so its mostly your own opinion in deciding "thie pick of the litter" based on pretty much looks alone, got it.

another thing i see is pricing per pair. do either of you do that, im assuming a pair would be a male and female for future breeding right? now would that be from the same little, i know mice dont have a problem with incest but do snakes? or is it a mix and match as long as ya get two snakes or any sex from any litter?

Correct, there is no "industry standard grading guide" but IMO rainbows arer bred for color and the brighter ones are in greater demand, therefore the higher prices on those specific animals.

Quite often I will give a pair discount and for me that's more of a your buying in quantity so youe get a price break.

Snakes cen be inbred from the same litter. I see salmons advertised as F5's which is 5 gens of breeding from one pair of original animals...
P1 being two unrelated animals
F1 is first gen offspring
F2 is siblings bred together offspring
F3 is offspring from two F2's etc.

Once you breed two unrelated animals together you start all over again.

I label my babies so people (myself included) can see where they came from so they can make that decision for themselves. Too much inbreeding csan lead to genetic defects as well as the traits being bred for.

One other point Jeff already mentioned, from a breeder standpoint a female is more valuable than a male.

Exception being morph males, early on in the project, they can and will have a higher price tag since they can breed multiple females. One hypo male and three het hypo females is less expensive than 1 het male and three hypo females for example. That tends to drive the value of the male up. Once the market is saturated with males, it switches the other way around and now females are worth more.

Really follows the laws of supply and demand!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

ohhh okay thanks. yeah well you allready know i plan on getting at least one for sure, just have to build me cage setup first. but that wont be for a few months, been outta work since august and im kinda broke...

i would really like to get more involved in this whole herp world (ive kinda been obsesed these last few weeks). i want to expand my collection at the very least, that might trigger a want to start breeding myself in a few years. so im allmost thinking that maybe i should get a pair, so that in a few year i do decide that i do wanna give it a try ill have that option (if it even works that way i dont know if it does). or i migh just get a couple of femals (im kinda partial to the ladies) to fill the extra cages i hope to build.

Well, unlike boas, I've had zero success with breeding young males. For both males and females I've had a lot of success at breeding them once they get to 2 1/2 years old. Have had no success at breeding a younger male. Point being, if you want to breed, getting the same age male will allow you to breed the soonest.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

no that would be good like i said i myself wouldnt be ready for that kinda thing for at least a couple years till im a little more grounded and settled. i quit my job in august and moved from MA to abq NM, i had two job offeres then i shattered my wrist and been outta work since. but i have a job now i start in jan at a cabinet shop and once i start saving again ill be able to start building the bookshelf style cages i want, save a little more and get a BRB or two or three heh heh heh. either way i wont be breeding for a while.

one good thing about being un employed is that it gave me time to sit on the comp all day looking up snake stuff, ive learned alot and still have alot more to learn. but i love it and want to really get in to it more.

Hmmmm, cabinet maker, that'll come in handy for caging. been there, done that....

-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

heh heh yeah yeah i know i might have sent you an e-mail back a week or two ago asking about those... you might rember me Myrddyn_2001. but that was befor i learned how to use the fourums then i found you post here so even better!
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0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

Yeah I remember you., glad you found us here, this is an awesome forum. But ya have to have a sense of humor!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

yeah this forum is great you guys all rock
-----
0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

by the way i meant toask you about those heating pannels... where did you get those and about how much are they
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0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

I got them from pro-products.com veryu helpful folks. You do need to supply them with all the detaisl so they can select the right panel. Mine netted out to $75 each shipped.

www.pro-products.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=8&Itemid=30
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

nice thanks looks good

whats your experence with heat tape, ever use it? im inbetween heat pannels and heat tape for the cages im gonna build. the pannels look geat that seems to be the way to go just a bit pricey, heat tape is inexpencive but i dont know if heat tape alone is enough for a 4'x2' boa cage, or is it only use in addition with another main heating source.

im using 3/4 melamine and they are gonna be stacked so that helps with insulation and heating eachother. but i still dont know if heat tap can do it alone what do ya think?
-----
0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

That's why I went with heat panels. Heat tapoe works great with a thin layer for it to pass the heat through, problem with wood cages is strength = thickness of material. I use 3/4" plywood. Heat tape has a hard time getting through that much "insulation". A proper installation would be either routing a significant recess from underneatht the floor (weakening it - some for ply, a lot for melamine) Or cut sa hole and laminate over a piece of something like plastic etc and put the heat tape under that.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

yeah i dont want to to go cutting out half the floor pannel so if used i would use it on the inside of the cage and cover it with something, dont know what but something i dont think that would be hard. either way i still dont know if its enough to get the 80-90 ambient air temp.
-----
0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

Where's the PVC going that you have inside of each enclosure there? And also, very cool setup idea, small footprint with the water on top of the humid hide.

The PVC is used to connect various cage sections into larger cages for breeding. The plan this year is to connect cages in vertical pairs.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats