Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I must be crazy. Copper has been soaking and staying put in her moss box for a couple weeks, she ate two weeks ago (fat rat so I skipped a week) and when I took her out tonight to feed her. I noticed something that looks like I shouldn't be seeing for about 6 months.
Tell me I am crazy. PLEASE! She has been housed with another female for the past couple months because of a cage needing to be fixed. And when I put her in with Dude, they showed no interest in each other, but now she's this fat?
No, the rat wasn't THAT big.
Help! Tell me I am nuts and she's not gravid.

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Jess
2.4 adult BRBs (Sango, Dude, Copper, Cleo, Cherry, Dudette)
1.1 baby BRBs born 6/18/06 my first litter(Zeek, Isis)
0.1 baby BRB produced by Dave Colling (Sable)
1.1 Pacific/celestial Parrotlets (Dewey and Delilah)
1.1 MORE Pacific/Celestial Parrotlets (Tickle and Booger)
1.0 normal corn (Pop the Cornsnake)
1.1 african brown house snake (Nellie, Lacie)
1.1 crested geckos (Chips, Dijon)
1.0 Veiled Chameleon (Calais)
1.1 western hognoses (Google, Yahoo)
0.1 paranoid mother "too many snakes!"
1.0 significant other that gives me a funny look when I say a baby snake is cute

they showed no interest in each other before cuz she wasn't "ready" but now appears to be ovulating but is doesn't look that big so it might be a pre-ovulation swell and in a few weeks there will be an swell which is the ovulation which could pass both left and right with follicles at the same time and have a real big one or one at a time at be on the smaller side but still noticable but Dave or Jeff will prolly chime in later but this topic has been hot lately on the boa forum. best of luck but I believe I would put them together though
Bob

Thanks Bob, I've separated her for tonight and some observation. I don't feel so crazy anymore.
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Jess
2.4 adult BRBs (Sango, Dude, Copper, Cleo, Cherry, Dudette)
1.1 baby BRBs born 6/18/06 my first litter(Zeek, Isis)
0.1 baby BRB produced by Dave Colling (Sable)
1.1 Pacific/celestial Parrotlets (Dewey and Delilah)
1.1 MORE Pacific/Celestial Parrotlets (Tickle and Booger)
1.0 normal corn (Pop the Cornsnake)
1.1 african brown house snake (Nellie, Lacie)
1.1 crested geckos (Chips, Dijon)
1.0 Veiled Chameleon (Calais)
1.1 western hognoses (Google, Yahoo)
0.1 paranoid mother "too many snakes!"
1.0 significant other that gives me a funny look when I say a baby snake is cute

Well, bottom line is she was in with a male, unless you watched them the entire time and know they didn't get busy when you weren't looking you can't know for certain. I have seen a female get fat and bloated from a large prey item. At least that's what I thought at the time. Will be interesting to see if my female (Eve) breeds or could I have missed her ovulation months ago. I'm now thinking I may have missed the boat on that one since she is a WC and her previous litter came late 2006 or early 2007.
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Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

So if it is pre-ovulation or the ovulation swell, then when would be the best time to put her back in with the male? I dont want to miss it. Could she be harmed if she is gravid and the male mates with her?
Dave do you know how to probe? If someone could show me how that would be helpful but I am always scared of hurting them. It seems like getting a metal rod shoved up your ******** would hurt. Thank god for humans its obvious!
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Jess
2.4 adult BRBs (Sango, Dude, Copper, Cleo, Cherry, Dudette)
1.1 baby BRBs born 6/18/06 my first litter(Zeek, Isis)
0.1 baby BRB produced by Dave Colling (Sable)
1.1 Pacific/celestial Parrotlets (Dewey and Delilah)
1.1 MORE Pacific/Celestial Parrotlets (Tickle and Booger)
1.0 normal corn (Pop the Cornsnake)
1.1 african brown house snake (Nellie, Lacie)
1.1 crested geckos (Chips, Dijon)
1.0 Veiled Chameleon (Calais)
1.1 western hognoses (Google, Yahoo)
0.1 paranoid mother "too many snakes!"
1.0 significant other that gives me a funny look when I say a baby snake is cute

Well, I leave my males with the females 24/7 during breeding season and well afterwards as well. So, I don't think him being with her would cause any problems. I have probes but have never been shown how to use them. On my list of things to learn!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

dagummit! Ok well I'll put her back until March or something. I am glad I am not going crazy. I really don't expect her to be gravid, it just freaked me out. I really need to spend more time with my snakes obviously.
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Jess
2.4 adult BRBs (Sango, Dude, Copper, Cleo, Cherry, Dudette)
1.1 baby BRBs born 6/18/06 my first litter(Zeek, Isis)
0.1 baby BRB produced by Dave Colling (Sable)
1.1 Pacific/celestial Parrotlets (Dewey and Delilah)
1.1 MORE Pacific/Celestial Parrotlets (Tickle and Booger)
1.0 normal corn (Pop the Cornsnake)
1.1 african brown house snake (Nellie, Lacie)
1.1 crested geckos (Chips, Dijon)
1.0 Veiled Chameleon (Calais)
1.1 western hognoses (Google, Yahoo)
0.1 paranoid mother "too many snakes!"
1.0 significant other that gives me a funny look when I say a baby snake is cute

you dont know how to probe you dont know how to feel for the "bumps" no wonder you say only way to tell sex is to see who breeds with who and has babies lol

Wow, that was SUCH a nice post. You know that wasn't very helpful so next time can you just not bother?
-----
Jess
2.4 adult BRBs (Sango, Dude, Copper, Cleo, Cherry, Dudette)
1.1 baby BRBs born 6/18/06 my first litter(Zeek, Isis)
0.1 baby BRB produced by Dave Colling (Sable)
1.1 Pacific/celestial Parrotlets (Dewey and Delilah)
1.1 MORE Pacific/Celestial Parrotlets (Tickle and Booger)
1.0 normal corn (Pop the Cornsnake)
1.1 african brown house snake (Nellie, Lacie)
1.1 crested geckos (Chips, Dijon)
1.0 Veiled Chameleon (Calais)
1.1 western hognoses (Google, Yahoo)
0.1 paranoid mother "too many snakes!"
1.0 significant other that gives me a funny look when I say a baby snake is cute

Actually Tim's right, I do need to learn how to sex something other than a baby!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

bad way or negative i was actually shocked i knew he wasnt good at feelin for bumps but i thought he knew how to probe and between me dave and bob there is a odd humor/trash talk thing if i would of said somethign like that to any1 else besides them two i would deserve to be kicked from here

I'm soooooo offended, maybe I should just leave.....
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

just leave amber in my care and everythign will be A-OK

You keep on dreaming you bad man you!!!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

LOL,

don't know how to probe - yet!

Can't feel the bumps - years of working with my hands and callouses?

Pop babies regularly and oh yeah, those males pop proud!!!

The only disadvantage of popping only is I can't sex adults. But then again, I know the sex of all my adults,
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

I still stand by the only 100% accurate method of sexing. BREEDING!! Every method, popping, probing and palpating has some percent of error. Is NO possibility of error in seeing two snakes tail wrap and then months later, one has babies!!!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

No I dont know how to probe, I am scared to try without proper training. I think that's best for my snakes that someone who is experienced doing it shows me how.

No I can't feel the bumps.

Yes, I can pop a baby.

As far as I am concerned, I am not saying I'm an expert on anything(obviously), otherwise I wouldn't bug you all so much! But I am getting better thanks to many people who are willing and happy to help me along.
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Jess
2.4 adult BRBs (Sango, Dude, Copper, Cleo, Cherry, Dudette)
1.1 baby BRBs born 6/18/06 my first litter(Zeek, Isis)
0.1 baby BRB produced by Dave Colling (Sable)
1.1 Pacific/celestial Parrotlets (Dewey and Delilah)
1.1 MORE Pacific/Celestial Parrotlets (Tickle and Booger)
1.0 normal corn (Pop the Cornsnake)
1.1 african brown house snake (Nellie, Lacie)
1.1 crested geckos (Chips, Dijon)
1.0 Veiled Chameleon (Calais)
1.1 western hognoses (Google, Yahoo)
0.1 paranoid mother "too many snakes!"
1.0 significant other that gives me a funny look when I say a baby snake is cute

i will say probing is the hardest out all to do i hate doing it to babies specialy ones with lil tails lol i usualy do probing for adults as a double check and pop as babies for most my species but now with my boas i also feel for the bumps i tripple sex boas lol well only females if a male is wavin hi to me when i pop him i dont think i need to re sex him but if its a boa ill def feel for bumps along with it

as for you and your learning to feel try more pressure specialy with the adult rainbows i decided to do my male rainbow the other day and i had to take my one hand and use it as a place to put his tail and my other hands finger to really push to feel the bum wasnt as pronounced as my bci but def a male also i noticed my male has a ALOT longer and thicker tail to him any input on that as a poss way to sex adults? works like that in the corn world just wondering if it worked here as well

random tid bit of info baby carpet pythons are the hardest to pop thus far

Brings up a question in my mind....

I think we'd all agree in order of invasive procedure...

Palpating
Popping
Probing

I understand probing can be dangerous to the animal, risk of poking a hole in genitals (cringe) what are the risks with popping and palpating? Only one I can think of and would apply to both would be over zealous pressure causing damage to organs and/or spine.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

in my mind safest to worse

palpate
pop
probe

palpate if you dont support and push to hard you can cause damage to interior organs and crack the spine

pop also crack spine but a lil more easily also if you over exert either male or female parts you can also cause problems from stretching and squishing the goods so to say lol

probing it is more than to easy to poke thru either male or female and likely never have that animal ever reproduce for you and its very easy for males to tighten and get a false reading and or cringe real fast n jerk and you accidently poke a hole where you didnt want a hole to be hence the reason i will never probe a adult corn snake again every 1 tenced up bad and jearks so instead of hurting the animal i just dont probe them

interesting... okay so i know about poping tried it on my baby ball worked great... and i know what probing is, is it really THAT risky? i know if not done right it can be damaging, you guys kinda make it sound like its to risky and allmost not worth doing at all.

then Palpating whats that? lol sorry ignorant yes but courious (tend to ask alot of questions sometimes)
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0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

if you dont know how to probe dont try it have some1 who is good at it show you a few times on male and female explaine whats going on when he/she is doing the probing and ask lots of question dont go in blind never probed before or been showed and tought how by soem1 who knows how and try to probe your self only bad will result its always better to use less force and get a false reading of a male is really a female then to much force causeing problems and have a female thats really a male

as far as palpating hopefully some1 chimes in and explaines im bad at typing to explain things it ends up being a book lol but in a nut shell your feeling for lil bumps using your pointer finger and thumb or whatever combo in the tail to feel for the tips of the hemipiens (the lil bumps you feel) and thus far to my knowledge it only works in boas

so dont try to probe myself?? lol trust me i dont need to probe myself to tell me i'm a male lol just kidding

no i dont plan on trying, well unsupervised for sure. i just didnt think it was as risky as you guys make it sound

i was more courious as to what Palpating was sounds like that to is something you need a feel for
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0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

nice yeah its somethign you jsut gotta get the feel for it isnt bad but (in my experiance) bumps are diff sizes and have a diff bump feel to them in diff species

and no you dont have to probe feel for bumps or pop yourself either lol

lol yeah probing isnt needed i can diffenatly feel two distintive bumps lol sorry if that was uncalled for

really though how about poping it can only be done in young snakes right? at about what age do the snakes get befor poping loses accuracy? when is it most accruate to do it
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0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

me i feel that only young snakes should be popped i prefer once snake is out the egg or birthsack pending type of snake and dried off some so it isnt so slippery lol is the best time and easiest also another time once shed just as a double and i havent popped one snake thatw as older than 3 months of age and it was deff harder to do than when younger and i wouldnt personaly popp any snake older than that however i have both heard and seen some of the more well known breeders pop adult snakes so hopefully you get some opinions from every1 on this one

I only pop the babies!!

My buddy did pop two yearling boas for me though!! he's been doing it for years so was quite easy for him. I thought they'd be too old!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Dave.... you are getting MORE aberrant BRBs?? Where do you find them all!?
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Aubrey Ross

©
www.SlipstreamSerpents.com

Not BRB's some striped salmon abbys from basically boas...

The two that say sold DC

Plus a supersalmon female ...

-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Ahhhh..... I see.... very nice looking ones too!
-----
Aubrey Ross

©
www.SlipstreamSerpents.com

>>
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

yeah only babies my question is how long is a snake considered a babie? a week a month 3 months? if i get a ball python from the pet store thats inbetween 1 and 2 months old is that still young enough to result in an accruat pop? or should poping only be done with in the first week or so? thats more what im wondering, i poped my fiancee's baby ball but it was allready a few months old at that point im wondering if my pop was accurate. i had two at the time one for my g/f and one for my cousin they both lookd like females to me... but if poping isnt accurate after a few months old them i might be wrong
-----
0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

Yeah, each of the three methods (seen/do one, understand the other two) showing as male = male, showing as female = female, along with a small percentage male)

sniff, sniff still have my sensitive feelings hurt!!!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

when it comes to feeling for the bumps push as hard as you can till it pops out the tip of his tail and if you hear two pops in the process you got your self a male lol (whoever else reads this dont really try that lol) it must be my soft girly fingers that i can do it so well lol and you being a big bad cage/rack builder cant feel a thing hey i bet thats why you feed your snakes with your fingers hey guys watch this it doesnt hurt a bit now you try lol

Jess,
....It is hard to tell from PICs. However, based upon her eating a large meal two weeks ago and then looking swelled up after a new meal I think the new meal pushed the feces in her along and she should soon pass it. To me the swelling looks too far down the body to be an ovulatory swelling.
Good luck,
Jeff

>>I must be crazy. Copper has been soaking and staying put in her moss box for a couple weeks, she ate two weeks ago (fat rat so I skipped a week) and when I took her out tonight to feed her. I noticed something that looks like I shouldn't be seeing for about 6 months.
>>Tell me I am crazy. PLEASE! She has been housed with another female for the past couple months because of a cage needing to be fixed. And when I put her in with Dude, they showed no interest in each other, but now she's this fat?
>>No, the rat wasn't THAT big.
>>Help! Tell me I am nuts and she's not gravid.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>-----
>>Jess
>>2.4 adult BRBs (Sango, Dude, Copper, Cleo, Cherry, Dudette)
>>1.1 baby BRBs born 6/18/06 my first litter(Zeek, Isis)
>>0.1 baby BRB produced by Dave Colling (Sable)
>>1.1 Pacific/celestial Parrotlets (Dewey and Delilah)
>>1.1 MORE Pacific/Celestial Parrotlets (Tickle and Booger)
>>1.0 normal corn (Pop the Cornsnake)
>>1.1 african brown house snake (Nellie, Lacie)
>>1.1 crested geckos (Chips, Dijon)
>>1.0 Veiled Chameleon (Calais)
>>1.1 western hognoses (Google, Yahoo)
>>0.1 paranoid mother "too many snakes!"
>>1.0 significant other that gives me a funny look when I say a baby snake is cute

She didn't eat last night, she wasn't interested in a rat.
-----
Jess
2.4 adult BRBs (Sango, Dude, Copper, Cleo, Cherry, Dudette)
1.1 baby BRBs born 6/18/06 my first litter(Zeek, Isis)
0.1 baby BRB produced by Dave Colling (Sable)
1.1 Pacific/celestial Parrotlets (Dewey and Delilah)
1.1 MORE Pacific/Celestial Parrotlets (Tickle and Booger)
1.0 normal corn (Pop the Cornsnake)
1.1 african brown house snake (Nellie, Lacie)
1.1 crested geckos (Chips, Dijon)
1.0 Veiled Chameleon (Calais)
1.1 western hognoses (Google, Yahoo)
0.1 paranoid mother "too many snakes!"
1.0 significant other that gives me a funny look when I say a baby snake is cute

LOL, and how hungry do you get when constipated?

If it is a bowel movement in the making as Jeff suggested, that would easily explain the lack of appetite for one feeding. I'm feeding eery week and every week will have a few not eat. Not the same ones but still, they are not hungry, does that mean they are starting the breeding cycle, probably not.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

If you saw it in person ( I know its hard to tell from the pictures) you would know it wasn't a constipation lump, I know that Cleo has that at the moment, but hopefully she'll have a BM soon, she ate on Saturday. Copper on the other hand, it looks like she's about to poop out either a guinea-pig sized poop or a bunch of babies, but its a solid mass, I didn't feel any lumps that might denote her being gravid.
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Jess
2.4 adult BRBs (Sango, Dude, Copper, Cleo, Cherry, Dudette)
1.1 baby BRBs born 6/18/06 my first litter(Zeek, Isis)
0.1 baby BRB produced by Dave Colling (Sable)
1.1 Pacific/celestial Parrotlets (Dewey and Delilah)
1.1 MORE Pacific/Celestial Parrotlets (Tickle and Booger)
1.0 normal corn (Pop the Cornsnake)
1.1 african brown house snake (Nellie, Lacie)
1.1 crested geckos (Chips, Dijon)
1.0 Veiled Chameleon (Calais)
1.1 western hognoses (Google, Yahoo)
0.1 paranoid mother "too many snakes!"
1.0 significant other that gives me a funny look when I say a baby snake is cute

so, toss in the male and cross your fingers?
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats