Reptile & Amphibian Forums

As we gear up to change over to 2008, here's a look at my new Chinese twin-spotted ratsnake.

These guys have taken a bit of a hind seat, as I've been working with my new rootbeer corns a lot, but bimaculata is one of my favorite Old World ratsnakes. I attempted to put some new blood into my line of twin-spots by crossing my favorite female with a male I got from Rex Knight last spring. The babies tend to be pretty dark when they are born, but lighten up as they get older. At about 15 weeks, this juve is starting to show some decent coloration.

As a side note, I have to tell ya's why I like bimaculata so much. First of all, it's personal. I prefer working with small snakes, and bimacs are one of the smallest of all. I love their color and pattern, and hopefully we'll be getting into some morphs someday soon. They have a true ratsnake personality, by Old World standards, and seem to be most closely related to Elaphe dione and other Old World species. Bimacs are fun to work with and observe, being mainly crepuscular like corn snakes. They are hardy, but need only a short brumation period, and can even mate in the fall. I can also say they are easy on the pocketbook. I just wish there were more to choose from for those starting out.

It's funny, but not many breeders like keeping bimacs for some reason. One could be that they are fairly inexpensive, usually only running somewhere around $40/ea. A second reason could be that they don't handle as well as some other Eurasian ratsnakes, making them a little challenging for some keepers. They are a fairly quick snake. They also are pretty quick to use their musk, which is quite potent.

I rarely see a post about twin-spots on this forum. I know Colubridman has them too, as I'm raising up a couple I got from him two yrs. ago, but if anyone else likes this species, or is keeping them, I'd be very interested in knowing what other lines of bimacs are out there. Please post any comments you have on this strand, or shoot me an email or PM.

Hope everyone is having a great holiday season and I wish a prosperous 2008 for all, with lots of new babies for our hobby.

Cheers...Terry

-----
Ratsnake Foundation

I always thought the little guys were interesting. You make suck me in to that world when you get down here permanently. Very nice looking snake, too. I like the rich red coloring in the spots.

Thanks, Mark. I'm sure we'll get into trading some once I'm in AZ fulltime. If you just look at the Old World rats that don't get over four feet, there's still quite the variety. I only keep four species right now, but that could change,

PS: Hopefully, you'll be able to supply me with a few live mice, because I won't have any when I make the big move next spring.

Say, hi, to all, and Happy Holidays!

Terry

-----
Ratsnake Foundation

The babies are looking good, Terry. Yep, I agree that they are very interesting little snakes, and agree with you on all points. After having kept some for a little while, I would say that their care is about as simple as corn snakes. I also agree that the strong musk and fast movements might turn off some people. They can be tamed down somewhat, as the female I got from you is okay to handle, although she does still musk. The low price is a good point for those who might be considering getting into Asian rat snakes. However, I have mostly seen wc imports being sold for too much, lately.

-Toby

-----
The Ratsnake Foundation

>>The babies are looking good, Terry. Yep, I agree that they are very interesting little snakes, and agree with you on all points. After having kept some for a little while, I would say that their care is about as simple as corn snakes. I also agree that the strong musk and fast movements might turn off some people. They can be tamed down somewhat, as the female I got from you is okay to handle, although she does still musk. The low price is a good point for those who might be considering getting into Asian rat snakes. However, I have mostly seen wc imports being sold for too much, lately.
>>
>>-Toby

Toby, where do you see those imports at? I might be ready to start looking at imports, because it might be the only way to get some new blood into the existing lines here in the States. Also, I'd like to get some color morphs, such as the "blonde" and "silver" phases that I don't have anymore. However, they shoudn't be priced higher than captive born, imho. That would be pretty strange, if folks would rather buy w/c imports, over cb.

One point that I didn't make before is that there is a lot of scientific interest in these snakes which keeps me highly interested, like their taxonomy, ecology, behavior, etc. While their flightiness is a putoff for some, I like that attitude, because I love observing them, and they tend to move around more than other snakes I keep, such as the leopard snakes. I think they're a little more active, and often diurnal in activities. The fact that they're a little hard to handle doesn't bother me much, because I'm not a person that likes handling their snakes very often. I'm more of an observer. I'd rather see them in their captive environment, doing some of their natural behaviors. The times that I get to experience the musk doesn't worry me much either, because I oddly like the smell occasionally, and think it is an important part of ratsnake behavior and natural history.

One more thing...about their care. With a little knowledge of these snakes, bimaculata can be pretty easy to raise. This last clutch of mine, six in all, began eating thawed pinkies right away, except for one that took live pinks for a few weeks first, then switched over. In comparison, the rootbeer clutch I got about the same time, eight in all, all refused f/t pinks, and would only take live pinks for the first two months. With proper care, bimacs will eat well, almost year 'round, and reach adulthood, easily, by their third year. ASAMOF, like corns, you can breed the males as yearlings. Females need to be at least two yr. olds, and is size dependent.

Well, as usual, I've got on a bit of a tangent, and am probably talking too much. I'll give it a rest for awhile now.

Happy New Year...

PS: Remember this blonde phase female (an import from the 90's)?

TC

-----
Ratsnake Foundation

Terry, there were two ads in the ks classifieds yesterday, for wc imported bimacs. I believe both ads were selling them for about $100 each plus shipping. One was an adult female and I think the other was for 1.1 (don't remember how old).

I like observing snakes also, and am fine with being musked (I like their musk too), and don't mind their quickness either. Those are merely things which a beginning snake keeper might have a hard time adjusting to. I am also interested in the natural history of all of the snakes I keep.

I remember that you had good success with getting the baby bimacs started feeding, especially compared to your hybrids. I had a similar situation this past summer with my baby snakes. The two baby Chinese beauties (Elaphe (Orthirophis) taeniura taeniura) which hatched out healthy for me, started on f/t pinkies for their first meals and are still putting away f/t (fuzzies now). Whereas, I had several difficult starters in my clutches of corns, meahllmorum and meahlly x corn hybrids, some which would only take live and some (corns) which refused everything until I tried scenting pinkies with (frozen) Mediterranean gecko, which they ate like they had never missed a meal.

Yep, I remember the blonde female, and she was a very pretty and interesting snake. I think you have done well getting her coloration into your lines. I do wonder though, what a blonde x blonde breeding would have produced. You are probably right that we may have to get some wild caughts to get new blood, or any kind of morph or mutation into the lines here in the States. Maybe another amelanistic specimen will pop up some day. You wouldn't happen to have that photo of the amel bimac handy, would ya?

-Toby

ps. Here's a decent photo (for me) of the 2004 male you produced. The female of the pair is even prettier, but for some reason I have not been able to get a good pic of her.

-----
The Ratsnake Foundation

>>Terry, there were two ads in the ks classifieds yesterday, for wc imported bimacs. I believe both ads were selling them for about $100 each plus shipping. One was an adult female and I think the other was for 1.1 (don't remember how old).
>>
Thanks, Toby. I checked the ad and saw that the adult female was striped, as well as w/c, so I wouldn't be interested. I'm mainly trying to produce the blotched form, unless there's something really interesting about the coloration, or a mutation.

>>I like observing snakes also, and am fine with being musked (I like their musk too), and don't mind their quickness either. Those are merely things which a beginning snake keeper might have a hard time adjusting to. I am also interested in the natural history of all of the snakes I keep.
>>
>>I remember that you had good success with getting the baby bimacs started feeding, especially compared to your hybrids. I had a similar situation this past summer with my baby snakes. The two baby Chinese beauties (Elaphe (Orthirophis) taeniura taeniura) which hatched out healthy for me, started on f/t pinkies for their first meals and are still putting away f/t (fuzzies now). Whereas, I had several difficult starters in my clutches of corns, meahllmorum and meahlly x corn hybrids, some which would only take live and some (corns) which refused everything until I tried scenting pinkies with (frozen) Mediterranean gecko, which they ate like they had never missed a meal.
>>
Yeah, when I was just starting out I had some problems, because the babies were afraid of live mice, for one thing; the mice had to be very small for them to be able to swallow them; and also, not all wanted mice for their first meal; so I learned some tricks to get them started. Remember cutting the pinks in two pieces?

That's cool that your Chinese beauties eat so well too. Maybe it's pretty common for many of these Chinese species of ratsnakes.

>>Yep, I remember the blonde female, and she was a very pretty and interesting snake. I think you have done well getting her coloration into your lines. I do wonder though, what a blonde x blonde breeding would have produced. You are probably right that we may have to get some wild caughts to get new blood, or any kind of morph or mutation into the lines here in the States. Maybe another amelanistic specimen will pop up some day. You wouldn't happen to have that photo of the amel bimac handy, would ya?
>>
>>-Toby
>>
Thanks. I think we can selectively breed to bring out the blonde coloration, but it would have been nice to have a pure blonde line. Also, I'm trying to get away from the striping, which my original, lone male has given to the line.

As far as mutations go, there has been several examples of albinos. One was from Angus Lee, I think. Maybe you can still see it at (probreeder.com). I was never able to acquire one of those, even though I tried pretty hard. And I don't know what ever happened to them. I keep hoping they'll show up in the hobby someday. It's not always easy to get what you're looking for, even when you're really trying, and when you're willing to pay for it. Good luck to us in the future, however.

>>ps. Here's a decent photo (for me) of the 2004 male you produced. The female of the pair is even prettier, but for some reason I have not been able to get a good pic of her.
>>
>>-----
>>The Ratsnake Foundation

Those are pretty decent snakes, Toby. The male has some good "blonde" coloration to work with, as well as pretty decent patterning with the blotches. I think we can selectively breed away from the striping too. I also have a male and a female from that line and may try to breed them this year, or next.

Thanks for the post and best of luck in the New Year!

Terry

-----
Ratsnake Foundation

That silver was a nice looking animal, Terry. I was looking at the color plates in Schulz' bible today, admiring a bluish grey bimac which is kind of similar to the silver, but with less of a metallic sheen.

-Toby

-----
The Ratsnake Foundation

Thanks, Toby.

Terry

-----
Ratsnake Foundation

i know nothing about old world rats and after reading your posts about smaller species and seeing your pic, it raises the question to me on how big do bimacs get?
that is an awesome snake you had their
adam jeffery
-----
"CARLOS MENCIA FOR EL PRESIDENTE"
hybrid breeders association
1.1 puebladurans
1.1 sinacorns
1.1 hypo corns
1.1 kenyan sand boas
1.1 mbk
1.1 albino corns
1.1 childrens python
1.2 ghost corns
2.2 butter(both females motley)
2.2 pyroxgreerixruthvenixalternaxcampbellixholbrooki
0.1 hypo pyroxgreerixruthvenixalternaxcampbellixholbrooki
1.0 snow corns
1.0 jurassic milk
1.0 house snake
1.0 crimson corns
0.2 albino pueblacorns
0.1 striped ghosts
0.1 anery pueblacorn
0.1 bloodred
0.1 striped albino corn
0.1 albino nelsons
0.1 anery motley
0.1 normal corn het hypo,anery
0.1 hypo tang hondo
0.1 rosy boa

>>i know nothing about old world rats and after reading your posts about smaller species and seeing your pic, it raises the question to me on how big do bimacs get?
>>that is an awesome snake you had their
>>adam jeffery

Hi, Adam. That's a good question.

Terry

-----
Ratsnake Foundation

They are interesting ratsnakes Terry. Their small size appeals to me. Another old world rat that interest me is the trinket rat "helena".
I'm not sure if I've seen any bimaculata at any shows that I've been to in the past. They may have been right in front of me and I didn't even know what I was looking at, LOL. But the species I've seen more often then not has been the leopard ratsnake. They are beautiful old world rats that stay a modest size as well.

Steve
-----
Velvet Ant(Dasymutilla occidentalis) This colorful ground wasp has a sting so potent that it also earned the nickname "cow killer"

>>They are interesting ratsnakes Terry. Their small size appeals to me. Another old world rat that interest me is the trinket rat "helena".
>>I'm not sure if I've seen any bimaculata at any shows that I've been to in the past. They may have been right in front of me and I didn't even know what I was looking at, LOL. But the species I've seen more often then not has been the leopard ratsnake. They are beautiful old world rats that stay a modest size as well.
>>
>>Steve

Hi, Steve.

I have leopard rats too. They have always had a large appeal in the hobby, because of their beauty and rarity; but they are kind of slow moving, very secretive snakes, different from twin-spots in some ways. Most ratsnakes are pretty secretive though. I would compare the leopard rats a little more to corn snakes than twin-spots, I think.

The common trinket snake, Coelognathus (Elaphe) helena, is another small, Old World ratsnake that is pretty popular in the hobby, imo. I like these snakes quite a bit too, although I don't keep them at this time. They are tropical to a large extent and even fiestier and quicker than the twin-spots, imho. They are different than bimacs in some other ways too, I can't quite put my finger on right now, but I do like them a lot. It's a snake we talk about frequently on the Ratsnake Foundation forums.

Thanks for the post and Happy Holidays. Keep in touch and let me know if you hear of any bimacs that sound interesting. Thanks...

Terry

-----
Ratsnake Foundation