Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have a hard time sometimes.

The subject of reccessive and simple traits has come up and my memory needs to be kicked started.

Are there any cal kings with reccessive abberancies?

I don't mean reccessive traits like albinism, hypomelanism, axanthic, hyperethristic ect ect..

I am speaking abberant cal king that is not a simple trait but a abberant trait that acts like a visual reccessive. Like a striper, mosaic. If my memory serves me right there are no known reccessive traits that effect pattern only in kingsnakes.

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ÌÏËÙÍ ËÁÂE!

Times are changing, the correct greeting is Merry Christmas!
Happy Holidays is for geeks, modern metro men, liberals and wimps

I can't think of any either. Like you mentioned, striping in cal kings is not recessive.

There are some aberrancies that follow some recessive genes (Davis, Mendotas, etc..)

Of course if you go to the K-snake Classifieds there are always a bunch of people that advertise differently - SAD !

Kerby...
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Lonesome Valley Reptiles
www.lonesomevalleyreptiles.com
Specializing In California Kingsnakes

I can't spell much...

Kerby...
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Lonesome Valley Reptiles
www.lonesomevalleyreptiles.com
Specializing In California Kingsnakes

We can get past the typos Kerby,.....we're all having much more of a hard time waiting to see the results of many of your projects. I hope you have a good holiday, Tom Stevens
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TomsSnakes.com

Well recently there have been two breeders who are selling abberant Florida kings as recessive traits. One is the Mosaic Florida king founded by Bill Brant who says they Mosaics will breed and produce hets and then abberant ones from the hets. he said they are proven out by him. A wholsaler is selling them from a exclusive arrangment with Bill Brant and is marketing them as reccessives.

Then recently another abberant form has popped up but i have only seen the hypomelnistic form. They are fully striped hypos but like i said they are supposed to be striped normals that are reccessive. Now all the hypo in Florida kings cause abberancies in the visual but NOT het form. In this case the striped form was sold to buyers as a reccessive trait not associated with the hypo visual in that the strped form is a reccessive trait all on it's own.

Now I have never heard of ANY kingsnake that is a recessive in pattern abberacies alone and i wanted to make sure with Kerby and others to make sure.

SO, now all these new Florida kings show up on the horizon that are 100% guranteed reccessive traits. hmmmmm I wonder who will refund the money when it comes time to pay the piper. The broker or the originator?
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ÌÏËÙÍ ËÁÂE!

Times are changing, the correct greeting is Merry Christmas!
Happy Holidays is for geeks, modern metro men, liberals and wimps

You can just about "bet the farm" they will both point the finger at EACH OTHER on that one!, and will claim " I told so and so...this or that",...."not blah blah blah"!..LOL

~Doug
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"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open mouth and remove any doubt!"

...and keep in mind that there are recessive striped and motley and whatever other pattern mutations in corn snakes, and there are patternless and striped mutations in Pituophis. Neither of these are very distantly related to kings.

The Mosaic kings will proven out soon enough. I feel that this is a legit recessive trait.

The striped hypos are BS, IMO. Not that they don't exist, just that they're not a recessive trait.

There's a speckled king morph, checker board I think its called. Makes the bands a lot wider. I believe that is recessive. There was also a patternless (bandless) eastern king morph, but I don't know whatever happened to that.

I have a checkerboard female speck, looking for a male for her, may have to break down and hit Kansas this year.
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Todd Hughes

If you are talking about Mannys checkerboard I don't think that was ever proven out. I could be wrong on that but I remember a lot of talk about it being a reccessive 10 years ago and then nothing ever came of it.
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ÌÏËÙÍ ËÁÂE!

Times are changing, the correct greeting is Merry Christmas!
Happy Holidays is for geeks, modern metro men, liberals and wimps

Well, I have seen some field pics of some, so I want to give it a try. Besides, what ELSE am I gonna breed this freak into, lol! I think that pattern is tops in specks, don't care for lavender or albinos, go figure, the white wall is my favorite though!
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Todd Hughes

Posted by: foxturtle at Sat Dec 29 23:53:31 2007 [ Report Abuse ] [ Email Message ]

The striped hypos are BS, IMO. Not that they don't exist, just that they're not a recessive trait.

Fox,
Just curious as to what makes you think the Mosaics are legit reccessive? Do you have any inside info or is it just a hunch.
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ÌÏËÙÍ ËÁÂE!

Times are changing, the correct greeting is Merry Christmas!
Happy Holidays is for geeks, modern metro men, liberals and wimps

I want to say that striping in caligaster is simple recessive but I don't remember 100% for sure.
L8r Shannon

a) I have no reason to doubt the story on the mosaics.

b) Somehow someone was able to produce a bunch of them.

c) I know of captive hatched (from wild gravid females) mosaics having all normal offspring when bred to wild caught, normal florida kings.

b) Somehow someone was able to produce a bunch of them.

Thanks but i could also create some that look like these. I could create a bunch of them. Edisto or Mosiac easterns bred to Florida kings come to mind.

Personally I have a vested interest in these. So I hope they are the real deal. But before i go breeding them into every morph i have I need more reliable info before I go looking like a chump. The only person who can answer my questions directly is Bill Brant and he will not go to use the phone. He is probably to busy infighting with those freaks on the BIO.
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ÌÏËÙÍ ËÁÂE!

Times are changing, the correct greeting is Merry Christmas!
Happy Holidays is for geeks, modern metro men, liberals and wimps

Striping in Pituophis catenifer catenifer is a dominant trait.
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Rick Staub