Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I am planning and getting materials to build a large 8' x 8'x2' cage to house multiple animals. There are going to be 8 2'x2'x2' and then two 4'x2'x2' and one 8'x2'x2 enclosures. I am looking at wiring my own lights was thinking about porcelin sockets to attatch to top of each cage. I forgot to mention this is going to be a shelf like cage setup. Now i am a novice when it comes to electrical. I was looking for instructions on how to wire lights and how to install them or any other ideas people can come up with.

Tom

There are inexpensive, diagram-laden books available that will help explain things.

Depending on the wattage or type of bulb used, the back end of the socket can get hot, so it is best to mount the socket onto a utility box as opposed to directly to the wood. The round cast aluminum outdoor type boxes (for mounting security lights) work perfectly for this and look nice.

One thing to make sure of when using wire nuts to make connections - keep them in an appropriate box or behind a panel or somewhere out of the way. In other words not dangling in the open inside or outside the cage.
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Mark

i see all the enclosures with porcilin fixtures screwed to the roof with cages to protect around the bulb. I was just wondering at wireing and running wires. Also can multiple lights be ran and connected to one plug and what is needed to do all this so i can buy it.

Tom

yeah you can get all the stuff you need at home depot. go get yourself some Romex 12/2 guage wire a hand full (how ever many you need)of those round electrical boxes, metal or plastic (plastic is a bit cheaper and just as good i think) also your porcelin fixtures. now if you plan to wire this all up to plug into an outlet get yourself a heavy duty extention cord as well. youll need to cut the female end off to expose the copper wire inside for making the connection.

whith that many cages and that many lights that totals up to alot of wattage.... i would not recomend running all your light strips into one plug, use 4 or 5 maybe one plug for each level of shelf.

what wattage bulbs do you plan on using?

or an even better way to do it considering that much wattage is to wire it right to your electric pannel into a designated 20 anp breaker (wouldnt have issues here for sure) but thats a little more advanced wireing but still not too hard.

the other thing about that many lights is its gonna be expencive to run. i dont know if you looked into anything else but im gonna be building a simillar one just smaller right now im leanning tward heat tape... its cheap to buy and run... im still working out a plan for installing it, right now im kinda thinking cermic tiles with a little spacer. might work well just a thought
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-Stephen-

0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

hopeful for not to distant future:
--brazillian rainbow boas 1 female for sure
2 or 3? maybe a breeding pair?

more distant future hopefuls
1 or 2 of each maybe a breeding pair?
--anery boa (ooooh)
--jungle carpet python (love to have 1 or 2)
--dumeril boa (ahhhh)

slightly more wishful thinking
--hypo br rainbow boa (love em)
--anery br rainbow boa (oooh even better!!)
--motely boa (gorgeous!!)

I was thinking about 45 watt bulbs the problem is i neen basking spots so i cant just use belly heat and i need uv light for some and i am just nervous cause i dont know much about wiring things i was thinking on doing what you said wiring onre row of cages per plug.

Tom

Tom,

I think you'll find that this is one of the easiest parts of the project. I don't get into the electrical discussions on this forum simply because MarkG and Bighurt are so much better qualified to do so. Don't worry about it too much.

If I were you I'd go to a hardware store and buy an electrical junction box and one of the porcelain fixtures and try wiring it up with an old extension cord you have lying around. That's how I did my first lights and it was just super easy.

Unfortunately I don't know of any sights that show how to do this.
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Currently keeping a small collection of various Gonyosoma. Both G. janseni and G. oxycephala.

It is not best practice to screw the porcelain fixture directly to the cage roof - use a utility box. Screw the utility box to the roof and mount the fixture onto the utility box. You can use plastic or metal. All available.

Also, you will need temperature control. Your UV lamps will need to be on a separate circuit, since these will be on a timer likley. The heat lamps should be wired one per cage, since you will need to plug each one into a dimmer. That's right - one dimmer per heat lamp as opposed to one dimmer for all lamps.

Also, you will need a thermostat. The least expensive way is to use a Ranco or Johnson ON/OFF controller to sense the temp in the top cage, to switch the power to all of the dimmers, provided the wattage is below the rating for the thermostat.

My advice is to have a dimmer on each cage light fixture as mentioned, and run no more than 4 of these to one thermostat. If you can, use one thermostat (like those $30 units) for each cage! That would be the safest control.

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Mark

yes dimmers are needed i agree there.

Mark do you think a thermostat is really needed? i know they are usefull and make things easy, but lets say you have a thermometer with a probe and/or a temp gun. if tepms where monitered rugularly wouldnt you be fine with just a dimmer?

it just sounds like an aweful lot extra to me when you have every cage on its own dimmer, thermostat, timmer, with multiple lights... i dont have as much experince as you do with this but i do have a basic understanding of electricity, im thinking there must be a way of woreing all this up with multiple cages on one circut.

well i know it can be done actually, the whole thing could go on one plug if you wanted it to, buts thats not a good set up not matter how you look at it. this must be what your talking about, geting the right set up both for wireing and for proper temp control.

now the more control the better, but like i said that means each cage on its own. i could be wrong about this but that just seems a little exicessive. i say sacrifce a small % of control to make things a little easier
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-Stephen-

0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

hopeful for not to distant future:
--brazillian rainbow boas 1 female for sure
2 or 3? maybe a breeding pair?

more distant future hopefuls
1 or 2 of each maybe a breeding pair?
--anery boa (ooooh)
--jungle carpet python (love to have 1 or 2)
--dumeril boa (ahhhh)

slightly more wishful thinking
--hypo br rainbow boa (love em)
--anery br rainbow boa (oooh even better!!)
--motely boa (gorgeous!!)

>>Mark do you think a thermostat is really needed? i know they are usefull and make things easy, but lets say you have a thermometer with a probe and/or a temp gun. if tepms where monitered rugularly wouldnt you be fine with just a dimmer?
>>

Where I live, the snake room can be 70 deg one day and jump to 80 the next, as our weather can do that. If I am not home to check, well, it can be uncomfortable for the cage inhabitants. A dimmed light in a 70 deg room is one thing, but that same light on the same dimmer setting in an 80 deg room heats the cage tremendously.

I agree that it is an extra step. It is not difficult. In fact, MG Reptiles sells a pre-wired unit with an outlet strip to plug your dimmers into. Takes all the work out of it.

>>it just sounds like an aweful lot extra to me when you have every cage on its own dimmer, thermostat, timmer, with multiple lights... i dont have as much experince as you do with this but i do have a basic understanding of electricity, im thinking there must be a way of woreing all this up with multiple cages on one circut.
>>
Yes you can wire it all up to one plug. Remember you need to add wattages up of the lamps.

Thing is, your house doesn't have all the lamps wired to one circuit. You lose control that way. With cages it is the same thing. If all the animals have the same temp requirements, all of the lamps are the same type and wattage, etc, then one dimmer and one plug may be OK. Aside from that, individual dimmers are best.

>>well i know it can be done actually, the whole thing could go on one plug if you wanted it to, buts thats not a good set up not matter how you look at it. this must be what your talking about, geting the right set up both for wireing and for proper temp control.
>>
You got it. The reason rack systems often have one dimmer for an entire rack is that the heater is the same watt density under each cage, and each cage properties are the same.

>>now the more control the better, but like i said that means each cage on its own. i could be wrong about this but that just seems a little exicessive. i say sacrifce a small % of control to make things a little easier
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I cannot argue that I am excessive I can also say that I have never overheated a snake cage. I feel proud of that, both for the snakes that have no choice to be in our cages and because I have seen too many instances of dead animals in others' collections.

You sound like a smart guy. I'm sure you can find a way to setup a system that is easy for you and yet gives you some control over temps. Just keep in mind that the different-sized cages will hold heat differently. My advice is to have a dimmer at least for each cage size (i.e. if you have 4 cages that are 2x2, use one dimmer for all of those and another dimmer for all of the cages that are 4x2, etc.) Good luck.

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Mark

i see what your saying there you have alot of very good points. and thats quite the claim you can make there. im sure there are many many methods that would work well with "little chance" of failure. what im getting from you is even a "little chance" is still a chance!! better to put in that little bit extra to be foolproof

I'm sure you can find a way to setup a system that is easy for you and yet gives you some control over temps. Just keep in mind that the different-sized cages will hold heat differently. My advice is to have a dimmer at least for each cage size

thats kinda what i was thinking say you have 4 levels of caging, but a total of 11 cages... instead on a dimmer for every cage (11 dimmers) use one for each level only 4 dimmers. to me this doesnt sound all that bad...

and when it comes to thermostats.... you know far more about that than do i. then again i have read several old posts about thermostats failing and over heating... is this due to the unit its self or improper instalation?

not knowing more about it than that, it makes me less trustring of them. i can wire a light or two up to a dimmer and control it with a digital thermometer or temp gun myself with 100% confidence. assuming these are as accurate as i think they are. only reason that i am assuming they are failsafe, is because i havent read or heard anything about them causing issues. whereas i have read about thermostats failing, but again i dont know if thats due to the unit or instalition.
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-Stephen-

0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

hopeful for not to distant future:
--brazillian rainbow boas 1 female for sure
2 or 3? maybe a breeding pair?

more distant future hopefuls
1 or 2 of each maybe a breeding pair?
--anery boa (ooooh)
--jungle carpet python (love to have 1 or 2)
--dumeril boa (ahhhh)

slightly more wishful thinking
--hypo br rainbow boa (love em)
--anery br rainbow boa (oooh even better!!)
--motely boa (gorgeous!!)

I agree with you - do what makes you comfortable and go from there. The fact that you are now thinking 4 dimmers instead of just one is a huge improvement already. You are on the right track for sure.

The good ON/OFF thermostats like Ranco and Johnson do not fail like you mentioned under normal use. And your use would be normal use - for high temp cutoff of wattages likely below 750 Watts. When you are ready to try one, let me know and I'll walk you through it. Enjoy your cage building experience.
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Mark

This will probably be easier than you think once you get started. I'm don't feel qualified to give out advice but I've done a bit of wiring and found it quite easy. One thing you could do is go to a local electical supply to buy the parts. The workers there are usually way more knowledgable than home depot and will help if you buy the stuff there. May cost a little bit more but not much.

A sight I often use is http://www.the-home-improvement-web.com They have some diagrams there that are in color and very helpful.
There are also some cheap books that you will find helpful as well available at most home improvement stores.

>>I am planning and getting materials to build a large 8' x 8'x2' cage to house multiple animals. There are going to be 8 2'x2'x2' and then two 4'x2'x2' and one 8'x2'x2 enclosures. I am looking at wiring my own lights was thinking about porcelin sockets to attatch to top of each cage. I forgot to mention this is going to be a shelf like cage setup. Now i am a novice when it comes to electrical. I was looking for instructions on how to wire lights and how to install them or any other ideas people can come up with.
>>
>>Tom

You can wire each cage or group of cages separate, and run them to a acessable area where you can add dimmers or thermostats as needed. Power strips work well also to group or regroup your cages by temp. with thermostats.
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R.Bichlers Colubrids
http://www.webspawner.com/users/rbichler/index.html