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or solid yellow or white heads or sheds with no pattern ? Im just throwing things out there. I hatched out some and some look like super smokin' normals so how is one to determine by appearance alone ? I know you can determine it through breedings so please dont offer that as thats not viable way to determine recessive mutations.

Keith

how close to the letter of the law do you wish the definition to be? the literal translation as you well know is less black pigment than (the) normal (phenotype). i think it is still qualitative, where you look at a brooks and say,"that's hypo/not" instead of a quantitative "95% of melanin must be absent..." plus other characteristics (ventral pattern,etc).
what i look for is the reduction of pigment within the dorsal bands and on the head. i have had hypos within the same clutch with and without checkerboard ventral pattern (0-100%), or very high orange color and no yellow ( which i am thinking is/ and leaning towards hypererythrism).so far i have seen a higher incidence of patternless ventrals and striping in the orangeish animals i have hatched. the hypos which hatch out from 2x het ghost pairings are frequently yellow with darker brown bands/slightly aberrant pattern, but really clear up to be super light yellow/whitish kings.
i like this question a lot because there is significant variation in what we see/call hypo brooks, and i am really trying to refine my colony in order to squeak out some of these color and pattern traits. like with the possibility of hypererythrism tossed around in other conversations, we may inadvertently be lumping several traits together under hypomelanism.
how about this-do you think the yellow and white ones are ANERYTHRISTIC and the black and white ones are AXANTHIC????? -that would take care of THAT debate.LLLOOOLLL.
dB

Alright dont get me going on the axanthics Dave ! LOL I think you are right about the red ones maybe being Hypererythristic but at the same time Brooksi vary so much in coloration its hard to say. I can actually tell on mine which are and which aren't but the Hypos look so much like freakishly nice normals It makes me wonder until I look at the hets that are 80 percent darker and then its obvious.

Keith

p.s. Did you get my email I sent you last night ?

Post em if ya got em!
Rainer

Hey Rainer

What I meant was the color difference between the 2 make it real obvious. I guess Im just used to looking at Hypo's with strange crossbars . These things look like how Ive always wanted a Hypo to look like with super straight crossbars and a nice vivd orange color. I just have to post pics I can describe them till Im blue in the face LOL.

Keith

Good question, since there's obviously a few things going on there. I would look for hatchlings with the least belly pattern when I was looking for them years ago, since I did that with corns. (no other reason really). However, I ended up with some from other breeders that have varying amounts of belly pattern. Currently I have Krysko, Ricks, Love and Beard lines. This year I mixed most of them and got,as might be expected, many different looks. However, if I didn't know which was which, I could not tell one clutch from the other. That is, I got different looks within each clutch. From red,(light and dark head), bronze/yellow, bronze/white, and most had some belly pattern and lots of dark head pattern. Difficult to call when we're dealing with an animal that gradually lightens in some cases to a pale yellow anyway (even normals). I feel the bronze/yellows will be brighter yellow than the others as adults, but we'll have to see. My favorite FL. hatchling this year is a "normal" from a het x hypo pair and looks great! All bands are bright orange as well. I will keep her. Dave, we'll get the stripe deal I was talking with you about done this coming season. email me. I have not had a "perfect" red one hatch yet. One with a high number of clear,clean, perfect bands. If you get to check Len's first as they hatch, he sometimes has a few. I'll let you experts decide what to call 'em! Just let me know.
:Mark

Did you produce this snake ? WOW what a beauty. Im not a big CaL King guy but thats a sweet looking snake. Is it for sale or is it a keeper ?

Keith

p.s. Sorry for postin' your pic just wanted you to know to which I referred to.

...yeah, she's from my Cal. colony. A mixed bag for sure. I always get a few surprizes and this is one of about 4 that look similar. Sorry, keeper!
:Mark

Mark, sign me up for a pair - REALLY!

Kerby...

..pic doesn't show red as well as it is, but...

... more "gold/bronze" colors.

Now I've seen some pretty snakes in my time...and that looks like it will be a real beauty when older. Sure looks great now too! Good for you!

This one looks close to mine but mine has a few more crossbars and they are a tad thinner. Whats the lineage on this one Mark ?

Keith

It's what I've been working on. My 3 yr olds (very small for their age) are still somewhat more red than average, so I'm getting there.
:Mark

...where is my #99? heh heh!
Will you be at Raleigh NC show this weekend?

.."another one".. is #99, but it's a crappy pic of it. I won't make it to Raleigh, although I wish I was going. I have a pair of snakes (mole kings) waiting up there for me..Damn!
:Mark

you know I need some sleep. Try the post above "another one"
Sheesh!

.. kinda dark now.

.... pic as a hatchling. Now is a bit more gloden a few weeks later.

I'm an idiot.
:Mark