Reptile & Amphibian Forums

In your opinion, which mite killer is better PAM or BK-11?
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1.0 Columbian RTB - "Fedor"
1.0 Orange Ghost BP - "Charlie"
1.0 Mojave BP - "Jack"
3.0 Pastel BP - "Tito", "Cruz"(50% Het Ghost), "Jose"
1.0 100% Het Pied BP - "Logan"
1.0 100% Het Albino BP - "Mac"
0.1 100% Het Orange Ghost - "Mya"
0.9 Normal BP - (3 poss het alb, 1 poss het pied)

"a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrier as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!" - joshhutto

why spend $4 on Pam or $20 for BK or $18 for Provent-a-Mite. In the end you decide whether your boas are worth it. I think my average boa costs at least $800 so the Pam isn't for me or any of my boas, just my opinion though. They also don't ship on airplanes compressed cylinders so it is shipped ground so buy quite a few cans at a time to make it worth your while
Bob

LOL, when I typed Pam I meant Provent-A-Mite, not the cooking spray, didn't even know cooking spray was used for that. So is BK-11 is your choice since it's $20?
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1.0 Columbian RTB - "Fedor"
1.0 Orange Ghost BP - "Charlie"
1.0 Mojave BP - "Jack"
3.0 Pastel BP - "Tito", "Cruz"(50% Het Ghost), "Jose"
1.0 100% Het Pied BP - "Logan"
1.0 100% Het Albino BP - "Mac"
0.1 100% Het Orange Ghost - "Mya"
0.9 Normal BP - (3 poss het alb, 1 poss het pied)

"a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrier as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!" - joshhutto

I have only used Provent-a-mite along with a pest control strip in my room by the entry way. I am very happy with the Provent-a-mite but I have never used the Bk stuff but I wouldn't hesitate to use it if I couldn't get the other but I'm sure others who have been around longer have used the Bk so I just hope they reply, sorry for the confusion and always use it whether you have them or not cuz the alternative sucks especially if you have enough boas to treat after an infestation so always practice strict quarantine procedure with new arrivals but many people buy snakes and put them together for breeding purposes so I guess money will always rule over the safety of their collection, again just my opinion and it's worthless too
Bob

never used BK, but once I got P-A-M, I haven't had mites since and that was years ago.

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'There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."' -Rainshadow

I've used PAM for yrs with excellent results....except for the one time I didn't let the enclosure air out long enough and lost a prized sub adult female Christmas Mt. alterna. But that's another story.
I had a small out break recently, I believe the mites came in with some rats I bought from a local breeder. I decided to give Equate Bedding Spray a try, as it seems to be have the same "ingredients" as PAM, and even in the same quantities. It's $4 in change a can and you can pick it up ASAP at your local Wal Mart. The stuff did the job just as PAM does, but at a fraction of the price and with no delivery delays. The only difference I noticed was that the spray from the Equate can didn't seem as fine as the PAM, and as a result may have taken a little longer to dry. Other than that, it seems to be the same and the results were identicle too. I followed the directions just as I did with PAM and got great results.

One of my snakes had mites a few months ago. I used Reptile Relief on the actual snake and P-a-M on the enclosure. It worked wonders for me.
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Rachel Squier

Currently have:
1.1 '03? BRBs (Blaze and Shimmer)

On the way:
1.0 '07 Albino BCI
0.2 '07 100% Het Albino BCIs
0.1 '07 DH Sunglow BCI

I used provent-a-mite once and they were gone, I use it once a month while cleaning as a preventative measure. If any lil suckers (pun intended) get in... they die before they get a chance to meet, mate, and lay more little nasties around my facility! I am sure BK is good, and I've heard of folks using more average things found in local stores with the same 'active' ingredients as both pam and bk, but I stick with what works for me, despite the cost.
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Steph S.
Boas...
1.1 Albino boas (Loki & Hope)
1.4 07 Het. albino boas (Petty & Lady,Sierra,Madeline,Lola)
0.1 Reverse stripe poss. het albino (Cookie)
0.1 Salmon/hypo (Scarlet)
0.1 Anery poss. het snow (Missy)
1.0 Anery (Reno)
0.1 DH Sunglow (Bonnie)
0.0.1 Hypo het anery
1.0.0 Het. Anery (Guy & ?)
0.3 Normals (Ophelia, Sasha, & Lulu)
1.1 Surinames (Solomon & Surreal)
1.2 Hog Isles (Mr.Orange & Peaches, Apricot)
0.0.1 Central American (Sassy)
0.1 Emerald Tree boa (Jade)
1.0 ATB (Satan... seriously!)
Pythons...
2.1 GTPs (B., Monty & Jewel)
0.0.3 BPs (MJ, Precious, Houdini)
1.1 Carpet Pythons (Jackson & Charlotte)
0.1 Blood python (Akaia)
Misc.
1.1 Mandarin Ratsnakes (Jack & Jill)
1.0 Boxer/Pitt Mutt (Tyson)

PAM or any brand of the lice sprays aren't even in the same class with BK-II.
Neither product can equal the knock down,residual kill of cost per use.

Black Knight is the solution !
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TnK

I use 10% Seven Dust, although I'm sure 5% works equally well, probably less risky. Surprised no one has ever mentioned it.
Let me hear the reasons why I shouldn't. I'm sure there are valid reasons why not to use Seven. Just don't know what they might be.
jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

In the past, I've used No Pest Strips, Dog Collars, Repti-Rinse, Provent-a-Mite, and Black Knight. I've soaked 'em and I've oiled 'em.

Last year I brought in over fifty Boids from probably half as many sources. Probably had at least a dozen arrive with mites.
Used the Seven Dust just one time on each case as I noticed them. Had absolutely no spread and no problems since.

Like I said, I figured there was some harmful reason why I haven't heard someone mention the use of Seven Dust here. Does anybody know of neurological damage or organ failure with Seven Dust? I guess if not used intelligently and with caution there could be some serious problems. But, that is true with all mite treatments.

jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

http://hpd.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/household/brands?tbl=brands&id=19022002
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
[quoted from above]
Warning from
Product Label: Keep out of reach of children. Caution.
STORAGE AND DISPOSAL STORAGE: Keep pesticide in original container. Avoid contamination of feed and foodstuffs. Store in a cool, dry place, preferably in a locked storage area. DISPOSAL-PRODUCT- partially filled bag may be disposed of by securely wrapping original container in several layers of newspaper and discarding in trash. CONTAINER DISPOSAL. Do not reuse empty bag. Discard bag in trash. PRECAUTIONARY STATEMENT: HAZARD TO HUMANS AND DOMESTIC ANIMALS. CAUTION: Harmful if swallowed. Causes eye irritation. Avoid contact with eyes, skin and clothing. Avoid breathing dust. Wash thoroughly after handling. Avoid contact with food, feed, feeding troughs and water receptacles. FIRST AID. Swallowed: Give water or milk to drink and telephone for medical advice. Consult medical personnel before inducing vomiting. If medical advice cannot be obtained, then take person and product container to the nearest emergency treatment center or hospital. In case of eye contact, wash eyes immediately with fresh water for at least 15 minutes. Get medical attention if irritation persists. For skin, wash with plenty of soap and water. Inhalation: remove patient from exposed area. NOTE TO PHYSICIANS: Emergency Information call 1-800-454-2333. Carbaryl is a moderately reversible cholinesterase inhibitor. Atropine is antidotal.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
ENVIRONMENTAL HAZARDS: This product is extremely toxic to aquatic and ***estuary vertebrates***.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Do not apply directly to water. Do not contaminate water by cleaning of equipment or disposal of water. This product is highly toxic to bees exposed to direct treatment or residue on blooming crops or weeds. Do not apply this product or allow it to drift to blooming crops or weeds if bees visit the treatment area. NOTICE: Buyer assumes all responsibility for use not in accordance with directions.
Bar Code: 0-71549-02410-9 Form 5835-A/Product 2845
EPA Reg. #239-1349

>>In the past, I've used No Pest Strips, Dog Collars, Repti-Rinse, Provent-a-Mite, and Black Knight. I've soaked 'em and I've oiled 'em.
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>>Last year I brought in over fifty Boids from probably half as many sources. Probably had at least a dozen arrive with mites.
>>Used the Seven Dust just one time on each case as I noticed them. Had absolutely no spread and no problems since.
>>
>>Like I said, I figured there was some harmful reason why I haven't heard someone mention the use of Seven Dust here. Does anybody know of neurological damage or organ failure with Seven Dust? I guess if not used intelligently and with caution there could be some serious problems. But, that is true with all mite treatments.
>>
>>jsc
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>>"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
>>John Crickmer
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TnK

That's pretty much bare minimum boiler plate for any insecticide. Those warnings are rather benign compared to many.

The snake's contact with the Seven is minimal. I use a very fine dusting to the inside bottom of the container (as you would flour a cake pan) with paper substrate above and a more liberal application to the underside and top of the container where applicable. Access to water is denied.

jsc

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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

I know of a dealer here in Tampa that dust his feeder rats with it. I thinking if it was bad for them alot of snakes here in Tampa would of turned up dead by now.

Yes. I have used it with my mice. Not directly. Just in their bedding. I'm very careful not to feed my snakes a mouse laden with Seven. That would NOT be good.
Ingestion or contact with mucous membranes should be avoided at all times with any pesticide.
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

never considered the dust personally,just did a quick search on topic.
The few people I do biz with would never ship extra critters so our chances of a bug infestation would be far less then minimal.Therefore no need for any treatment options here.

I have considered using the BK-II on my dogs this season for fleas.(applied like Frontline*)seems like it just might work ?

If it werks fer ya,get after it RIGHT !

>>That's pretty much bare minimum boiler plate for any insecticide. Those warnings are rather benign compared to many.
>>
>>The snake's contact with the Seven is minimal. I use a very fine dusting to the inside bottom of the container (as you would flour a cake pan) with paper substrate above and a more liberal application to the underside and top of the container where applicable. Access to water is denied.
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>>jsc
>>
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>>"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
>>John Crickmer
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TnK

jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

on the label it says about vacate ROOM and ventalate and making sure everythign dries (duhh) and airs out now if i use it on one cage would i have to remove all snakes form the room since its even telling me to leave the room or what? i have only used it once with rescues i knew i was gettign in and i sprayed cages in a room where no1 goes and it was 3 days before animals got here but never used it yet in my collection room hopefully i never will lol

Hmmm, I can't remember reading that I should vacate the room... but I only spray a light mist and then let tub or cage sit awhile and air out before putting all items and reptile back in. Nobody seems to have suffered and I've used it for almost a year now.
Also, the other cages are closed so that none of the mist wafts into those while I am spraying another. Just be sensible, is what I think.
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Steph S.
Boas...
1.1 Albino boas (Loki & Hope)
1.4 07 Het. albino boas (Petty & Lady,Sierra,Madeline,Lola)
0.1 Reverse stripe poss. het albino (Cookie)
0.1 Salmon/hypo (Scarlet)
0.1 Anery poss. het snow (Missy)
1.0 Anery (Reno)
0.1 DH Sunglow (Bonnie)
0.0.1 Hypo het anery
1.0.0 Het. Anery (Guy & ?)
0.3 Normals (Ophelia, Sasha, & Lulu)
1.1 Surinames (Solomon & Surreal)
1.2 Hog Isles (Mr.Orange & Peaches, Apricot)
0.0.1 Central American (Sassy)
0.1 Emerald Tree boa (Jade)
1.0 ATB (Satan... seriously!)
Pythons...
2.1 GTPs (B., Monty & Jewel)
0.0.3 BPs (MJ, Precious, Houdini)
1.1 Carpet Pythons (Jackson & Charlotte)
0.1 Blood python (Akaia)
Misc.
1.1 Mandarin Ratsnakes (Jack & Jill)
1.0 Boxer/Pitt Mutt (Tyson)

You can spray it on newspapers or cage liners outside and let them dry there, then bring them inside and put them in the cage.

You can also just wipe the stuff on any openings if you're not infested. It says so in the paper instructions that come with each can.
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Caden Chapman
slithering.serpents@gmail.com
http://slitheringserpents.com

I had a mite problem and nixed it. no problems since. no side effects on the snake either.
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My Photobucket

Just used this method for the first time on a new acquisition this month. Worked like a charm, and I still have a gallon left $13 later.

I would be concerned with the shelf life of a "mix",tap water isn't very friendly and causes most everything mixed with to degrade before its time.
Hopefully people are using distilled water when mixing these or any treatment products.

>>Just used this method for the first time on a new acquisition this month. Worked like a charm, and I still have a gallon left $13 later.
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TnK

People are using distilled... this person anyway.

I would also add to keep the mix in an opaque container or dark area...light will break down the chemical as well...
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Heather Martin
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"I had a mite problem and nixed it. no problems since. no side effects on the snake either"

Which Nix product are you using? I saw a Nix spray for sale, is that the one you dilute?

No its not the spray, its a small squeeze bottle and the Nix is in a gel/lotion-like form. 1 bottle per gallon of distilled water. Thoroughly mixing into a solution takes a little while.

Mix 1 bottle with one quart of water useing a wire wisk(beat well till diluted),add to remaining gallon and shake well

>>No its not the spray, its a small squeeze bottle and the Nix is in a gel/lotion-like form. 1 bottle per gallon of distilled water. Thoroughly mixing into a solution takes a little while.
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TnK

Yeah, that would have beat the heck out of shaking that gallon jug for 45 minutes

Filed away for next time.

why spend 20 bux on either when you can get Sawyers with the same ingredients as PAM and only cost 1/4 the price. Ive been using it for a couple years and it works great. It is sold in the hunting section of walmart. Sawyers with permethrin works wonders.

I don't have a Walmart nearby, and I hate the price and delivery method of P-A-M. I buy the Sawyer Pump N Spray online. To me it is better than P-A-M, because you just pump the package and can spray a while before pumping it up again. The P-A-M containers always seem to screw up before I finished using what was inside (which is pretty frustrating at 25. a can shipped). The price is good too. I use it on my newspapers everytime I replace them.
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Caden Chapman
slithering.serpents@gmail.com
http://slitheringserpents.com

IF you have a Walgreens in your area look in the shampoo/hair isle and they have a aerosol spray for lice treatment. It is the same active ingredient as Provent-a-Mite (Permithrin) in the same quantity.

Costs is $5.99 a can or if you go to WalMart look for Equate bedding spray, also Permithrin for $4.99 a can.

It is the SAME THING as Provent-a-Mite.

BKII is a different ingredient and is safe to use DIRECTLY on your animals.

I have used all the products on the market for Mites in the past ( have not tried BKII yet ) and in my personal opinion the original Black Night was awesome! Very long lasting product. I am sure BKII is just as good, but for the price you cant beat the stuff from Walmart or Walgreens.

Jared
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~ ASK ME ABOUT MY BALLS ~

BK-II is the EXACT same product as the original Black Knight.
The aerosol propellant is the only change.

Ever hear the story back in 04 of the guy who sprayed one puff of BK in his basement (just playing with the product)the next morning he found his entire invert/disco collection dead !The entire basement was wiped out.
Sad for him but a testament for just how well BK works.
Folks with bug collections will need to consider this !

>>IF you have a Walgreens in your area look in the shampoo/hair isle and they have a aerosol spray for lice treatment. It is the same active ingredient as Provent-a-Mite (Permithrin) in the same quantity.
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>>Costs is $5.99 a can or if you go to WalMart look for Equate bedding spray, also Permithrin for $4.99 a can.
>>
>>
>>It is the SAME THING as Provent-a-Mite.
>>
>>
>>BKII is a different ingredient and is safe to use DIRECTLY on your animals.
>>
>>
>>I have used all the products on the market for Mites in the past ( have not tried BKII yet ) and in my personal opinion the original Black Night was awesome! Very long lasting product. I am sure BKII is just as good, but for the price you cant beat the stuff from Walmart or Walgreens.
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>>Jared
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>>~ ASK ME ABOUT MY BALLS ~
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TnK

I've tried all the above products, which seem to work well. Ivermectin seems to last longer.

np

N/P