Reptile & Amphibian Forums

and also hey i couldn't help it they are together in the tank it just happened,i'm not against hybrids i think they are even better,lots of good dog breeds if not all have come from mixing species and then they are considered a pure breed after a while, right, why not the same for these little guys

and about pure saharans i think people should breed them pure too because they are almost unheard of as in captive bred ones, but i can't do anything about that

I am a big cichlid fan as well as a Uro one, hybrids are very much a problem in the cichlid world. I am very much against all hybrids of any kind. The problem with hybrids is, when you breed two different species together, you get rid of the babies, those babies are labled as a pure bred pure bred. One of the hybrids are bred with a pure bred Uro, then those babies are not pure. Then those babies are bred with another pure Uro, and those babies are not pure. It eventually weakens the genes of "pure" Uro's kept in captivity. With fish, you can always feed hybrid fry to another fish and rid the problem like that. I dount your gonna feed your hybrids to something else. I only ask that you do not let your hybrids out into the general public, keep them for yourself.
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1.0 Uromastyx maliensis (gulaktig), 2.5 Eublepharis macularius, 3.2 Cichlasoma nigrofasciatum, 1.1 Hemichromis bimaculatus, 1.4 Xiphophorus maculatus, 5.12 Poecilia reticulata.

I would like to see them, I have no doubt they look interesting. I think some jungle corns (cornsnake x kingsnake) look pretty cool as well.... I don't own any because I have no interest in breeding them, and it would take up space that a pure corn could occupy in my rack.

*lol* sorry, but dog breeds are not seperate species. All dogs are Canis lupus familiaris, a subspecies of the gray wolf. The breeds we see are the result of selective breeding, and at best could be sub-subspecies (though it is possible that if, say, all dog breeds that were physically capable of interbreeding with wolves died out and we were left with, for example, only very small toy breeds, they might be reclassified as a different species).

The difference here is that your hybrids will most likely NOT breed true. There are people working with other hybrid reptiles, attempting to create true breeding animals with the traits they want..... it's a long and difficult process, and it requires the frequent addition of foundation stock - that is, pure animals of both species have to be bred into the 'project' regularily. Dog breeds developed originally by taking 2 animals that were a little taller, and breeding them together to eventually get a much taller dog.... or a much slimmer dog.... or a much faster dog. Not by taking a really tall dog and a really short dog, and hoping for something in the middle.

My 2 cents
Dawn

Personally, I don't see anything wrong with hybrids. People saying things like it takes away from the gene pool simply isn't true. It may very well be adding some varying genes rather than diminishing them. It could even create a more hardy uro, perhaps one that could potentially be more resistant to parasites (I can't think of any uro owner that wouldn't want that). But to create a whole new kind of uro would take a very long time. I'm sure that there are some uro breeders out there that may be trying to get some interesting color morphs to make them more attractive. Some owners might like a uro that is a little different or unusual. If they plan to sell them, they should be CLEARLY labeled as a hybrid (specifically, of which species were crossed) and the buyer should be sure about what they're getting. I think uro "mutts" do have potential. But since purebreds are in such high demand, a lot of people want to keep it pure. I think a "toy" Egyptian would be very interesting, wouldn't you?

Feel free to comment
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1 Mali Uromastyx named Ra

In a perfect world, hybrids would be fine.... the problem is when those clearly labled hybrids are sold to someone with fewer ethics, and he passes them off to the next unsuspecting buyer as pure uros. It is also an issue with endangered or rare-in-captivity species, as each breeding that produces hybrids is one less that can be used to increase the population... as well as possibly complicating breeding/conservation efforts when someone buys a not-so-pure pure animal. Genetic diversity is better served by varying your foundation stock within a species.

Yes, 'toy' egyptians would be neat.... but the way to get them would be to take adult egyptians that just happen to be a little smaller, and create a breeding program with them. Not that hybrids would be possible to create 'dwarf' egyptians....... I imagine that the size difference between an egyptian and most other uro species would be too great for breeding to even occur.

Most of the possible benefits to hybridizing (eg, parasite resistance) can be accomplished within a species as well.... you simply need to keep breeding only the most resistant animals. The same thing is accomplished with dog breeds for temperament, size, color, body type, etc. The thing is that most reptile breeders (and consumers) are much more concerned with brighter/better color and pattern than they are with, say, tameability.

Dawn

I know Doug Dix has a male ornate he's had with a female mali, so I guess he isn't against such things.... I didn't realize they could do it. I'd like to see pictures. I thought by definition if two animals could mate and produce babies they weren't a separate species? does anyone know if the babies are fertile?