Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Are there many alterna in this mountian range in presidio county? I tried to look on the internet but practicly found nothing.

I don't think there are any known captives from that area currently, but they're there. I don't believe there are any public roads through the range.

HCU now has a lease deal with a major ranch there and I hope to go out and look around. Maybe I'll find the first founder pair. Or maybe some more skillful herper will beat me to it.

This promises to be a very exciting locale.

HCU thats why im asking I realy think that be a cool spot to herp! How would i go about looking for alterna without roads?

>>How would i go about looking for alterna without roads?

There are roads. They are just private (not to mention not paved).

Option one: Cruise the private ranch roads that are on the lease property.

Option two: Field herp along canyons, bluffs, or rocky outcrops.

CAUTION: I am assuming from what I recall of some earlier posts that you are new to field herping and west Texas. If that is true, I'd strongly discourage you from field herping in west Texas at night UNLESS you pair up with one or more experienced field herpers. This country is rough during the day. At night it is down right dangerous.

Also, the terms of the Sierra Vieja lease require 4-5 people for a 5 day minimum (or something like that).

What are the dangerers? and is there anybody that would like to team up with me in june?

>>What are the dangerers?

-Snake bite: This is always a risk, but the risk is higher in rugged country at night. Most of the public rock cuts are maintained with a minimal amount of vegetation and rocks where herpers would walk. Wild country is another story.

-Injury from falling: Slipping and falling is a very real risk. Along the public roads, this is no big deal. In the back county, the farther you roam from your vehicle, the greater the risks of not being able to hike back out.

-Injury from falling rocks: For the same reasons as stated above, this is a very real risk.

-Getting lost: Hikers get lost and die every year in the Trans Pecos. Many of them are experienced and almost all get lost during the day. At night, you can only see as far as the beam of your flashlight and it is VERY easy to get disoriented. I got disoriented on my own 27 acre property on a dark night. If not for my GPS, I could have easily been stranded overnight.

Animal attack: This area is home to mountain lions, bears, coyotes, javelina, bobcats, and many other wild animals. Any of them can be a danger, especially if you startle them at night.

Drug or human smugglers: Don't discount this threat. The illegals crossing the borders are typically passive, however the folks smuggling them or drugs across can become dangerous if the feel threatened.

Dehydration: You will need to carry lots of water and hope that your water container doesn't rupture when you fall.

>>Is there anybody that would like to team up with me in june?

Maybe. I'm planning a trip (or two) but haven't set a date. Also, it would be best to meet (or have some personal knowledge) of anyone you pair up with before the trip. The right herping partner can minimize your risks and make the hunt more enjoyable. The wrong herping partner can make things much worse. Committing to spend 4-5 nights herping with strangers in a strange land could be a blessing or a curse.

It might be advisable to be a little less adventurous on your first trip to the Trans Pecos. I'd be delighted to spend a night or two showing you around some less remote properties of mine in south Brewster county.

Wow lots of dangers! but if i do go with someone I will definetly make sure there the right person to go with. Thanks for the help and i would love to see some of your property in south brewster county!

>>I don't think there are any known captives from that area currently, but they're there. I don't believe there are any public roads through the range.
>>
>>HCU now has a lease deal with a major ranch there and I hope to go out and look around. Maybe I'll find the first founder pair. Or maybe some more skillful herper will beat me to it.
>>
>>This promises to be a very exciting locale.

I'd love to see a local alterna from there. I hope to get out there with you some of you guys sometime after the HCU meet this year. Might be a fun year.
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Snakes of Hudspeth County, Texas

>>Are there many alterna in this mountian range in presidio county? I tried to look on the internet but practicly found nothing.

Cool place, I went there last summer with Mike Price. A lot of reddish orange igneous rock in the canyons there. The subocs and lepidus from that area are reddish orange.

I think the last documented alterna from that area was reported in this 1949 article:

Jameson, D. L., and A. G. Flury. 1949.
Reptiles and Amphibians of the Sierra Vieja.
Texas J. Sci. 1(2): 54-79

It'd be cool to find one of the first documented Gray-banded Kings from there in almost 60 years.

Dusty R.
Suboc.com

So is there a pretty good number of subocs and lepidus? and what other species did you find when you were there?

Thanks in advance

Blake Molone

We found a Crotalus viridis on the ranch road, Crotalus scutulatus on Hwy. 90 not too far from the road that leads to the ranch, one Crotaphytus collaris, two Coleonyx brevis that were walking right next to me in a creek wash and on the dirt road, Hyla arenicolor, some Aspidoscelis and a few other lizards.

The group that was there before us a month earlier found a Trimorphodon, three orange phase subocs, and I think a few Heterodon and a even a Masticophis taeniatus was found drinking from a water hole at night. I'm sure others here on this forum have found plenty of other species in the Sierra Viejas.

I was fortunate to spend one night there, but we didn't find any colubrids. I will say this; I have never seen so many insects filling the skies at night. Bats were everywhere, and I'm sure the little Coleonyx geckos did not have to work too hard to make a living either.

Dusty R.

Suboc.com

On the subject of night dangers,Eby forgot to mention the plantlife. The plantlife itself is a danger. If you stumble into a pile of lechugilla, sotol, or agave, you may not make it. That stuff is nasty. Also, some of the cactus such as the eagle's claw or horse crippler have huge thick spines. Definately not a place to be alone at night.

DAN

Dog Cholla is the worst of them all!
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Herp Conservation Unlimited
Mexicana Group Directory
Photography by Joseph E. Forks
Captive Bred Locality Matched Desert Kingsnakes

>>Dog Cholla is the worst of them all!

That stuff is spring loaded and evil! I once stepped on the edge of one and it jumped up and bit me in the a$$. Nasty stuff. Some locals carry an afro hair pick to pull it off. If you try to pull it out by hand, it will usually spring back on release and nail you in the hand.

I was showing some land to a desert newbie and got a good laugh when he got stuck in the right foot. He pulled it loose with his right hand and on release, two spines stuck him in the hand. He then used his left hand to pull it off of the right, only to get nailed in the left hand. He then stepped on it with his left foot to pry it off. His left foot was spared, but it stuck to the sole of his shoe. When he scraped it off on a rock, it sprung free and flew straight back into his right foot. After laughing myself to tears, I used a stick to pry it loose. He watched his step more closely after that!

Another desert newbie was kind enough to demonstrate the perils of hiking across igneous outcrops in boat shoes and no socks. The idiot watched as I changed from hiking shoes to hiking boots and refused my suggestion that he borrow my shoes. Both soles fell off after walking to the back edge of the 20 acres I was showing him. Even then, he refused to let me hike back and get him some decent footwear. By the time we got back, the wafer thin inner soles were worn through and peeling off. Surprisingly, he actually bought the land (and promised to buy some better footwear before returning).

The locals call it Los Brincandos loosely translated to Jumping Cactus. We call it Jumping Cholla. I swear that stuff jumps off the ground to hit you in the back of the calf.
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Snakes of Hudspeth County, Texas

Is that the same cacti that when snagged on your pants, pulls off an entire section of itself? We ran into some down in Langtry like this. We nicknamed it landmine cactus.

thanks

>>Is that the same cacti that when snagged on your pants, pulls off an entire section of itself? We ran into some down in Langtry like this. We nicknamed it landmine cactus.
>>
>>
>>thanks

That'd be it. When that section falls off you pants leg, it puts down roots and BAM, new land mine.
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Snakes of Hudspeth County, Texas