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KGTV (San Diego, California) 13 February 08 Officials Seek To Stop Sale Of Venomous Reptiles
San Diego: Snakes like the quick and deadly king cobra could soon be on a plane or in a mailbox near you.
Many snakes are being shipped across the country -- not to a zoo or a laboratory, but to snake enthusiasts.
Possession of any dangerous reptile that is large or venomous in San Diego is illegal. However, that does not mean snakes and other dangerous reptiles are not being shipped in.
Dan De Souza from San Diego County Animal Control said, "Does it happen? Yeah. Do we know how often? No, it is very much an underground situation."
The problem went public last fall when 28 illegal reptiles were found in a garage in El Cajon. Prosecutors believed the reptiles were purchased over the Internet.
10News found dozens of Web sites where dangerous, venomous snakes could be purchased. Many of the Web sites know the laws and will not ship to states like California, where it is illegal, but at least a handful of sites were found that will send what customers want, where they want, as long as they can pay.
"We can't go after them if they live in a different state or country. We need to go after the people that live in our jurisdiction," said De Souza.
De Souza often gets the call when a questionable package is found.
"Fed Ex calls us, USPS calls us…," said De Souza.
Federal law dictates how the snakes are shipped. They need to be double-bagged, placed in a clearly labeled box and sealed shut.
Any reputable dealer will follow this procedure to ensure there are no "Snakes On A Plane"-type mishaps, but the ones that aren't doing this legally are shipping them any way they can.
"It's much more dangerous this way because everyone has to keep things hidden," said Robert Applegate, who runs a reptile farm in Campo.
Applegate said he owns some of the only legal venomous reptiles in the county. He owned deadly Gila monsters and Mexican beaded lizards -- before they were outlawed -- and he pays a hefty fee to the county in order to keep them.
Applegate said the strict laws in San Diego are doing more harm than good.
"They have caused more problems by trying to prohibit it because the people that want it could still get it and there aren't any regulations, so it's more dangerous," said Applegate.
He also said in states where it is legal, there is more control.
However, De Souza disagreed.
"The laws are there to protect the public. We are not going to take the chance if they are underground. Are they going to be even more careful? Yes, because they do not want to be found out," De Souza said.
He does admit the problem in San Diego is quickly slithering out of control.
"They don't have enough fish and game wardens to deal with this problem," said De Souza.
10News learned from talking to snake dealers around San Diego County that Delta Airlines is the main carrier of venomous reptiles. However, there is such a patchwork of laws employees cannot be expected to call authorities when they see a specifically labeled box. For many, it's too difficult to know every law in every city they visit.
Experts said many of the federal, state and county laws often contradict one another. That often leaves the public confused, in a place where rattlesnakes are so common that many don't know they are illegal.
Applegate said he knows of people who have discovered they were breaking the law and just let the snakes go.
"He basically left it in a box anonymously on the door of the San Diego Zoo," Applegate said of one snake owner.
What's worse then an angry snake on a plane? A venomous snake at your front door.
If you come across a snake, animal control officials said to leave it alone, notify them and they will take care of the matter.
Even with native snakes like rattlesnakes, it is illegal to transport them even if you are just moving them off your property.
As for snakebites, the antivenin is readily available at most major hospitals in the San Diego County area.
On Wednesday, 10News at 6 a.m. will have more on this story, including how some of the venomous reptiles are being used to save human lives and who is in favor of loosening the constricting laws.
Officials Seek To Stop Sale Of Venomous Reptiles

"It's much more dangerous this way because everyone has to keep things hidden," said Robert Applegate, who runs a reptile farm in Campo.
Applegate said he owns some of the only legal venomous reptiles in the county. He owned deadly Gila monsters and Mexican beaded lizards -- before they were outlawed -- and he pays a hefty fee to the county in order to keep them.
Applegate said the strict laws in San Diego are doing more harm than good.
"They have caused more problems by trying to prohibit it because the people that want it could still get it and there aren't any regulations, so it's more dangerous," said Applegate

Very nice Bob. Well done!
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AMAZON REPTILE CENTER

NAMED BEST REPTILE STORE IN LOS ANGELES

I agree with what I am interpreting what he was saying in that article as we have a similar problem here in fl. I do not disagree with the venomous permit system here in Fl. I think it is a somewhat good idea. If you ever go to any of the hot shows you always manage to see some idiot who has no business owning any snake at all running around wit a cobra or gaboon viper they just bought. But my problem with the permit system is that there are way too many hours involved in getting the permit and then once you do get it it's carte blanc on whatever kind of hots you want. So basically some one who works reptiles professionally such as myself and does it as a full time job has a difficult time obtaining a permit because they do not have the time to go volunteer at someone else's facility for the required 1000 hrs. This ends up not taking into account years of experience with other non-venomous herps. Those of us who have been around the block a few times are most likely not going to go out and buy a bunch of mambas right away because we have a new hot permit. Under the system here I could not legaly go out and collect pygmy rattlers or water mocassins and keep them (snakes like these eyelash vipers and helodermids would be my theoretical choice if I wanted to go through the hassle of getting a permit...which I don't) yet I have been keeping reptiles formany years and could easily qualify for a Komodo dragon permit (as a business not as an individual) which is a class1 permit. And yet I have seen it personally where some guy who volunteers at some nature center somewhere and feeds their rattlesnakes and water mocassins for a few years and then gets a hot permit and can keep whatever they want. I shouldn't have to tell you that there is a huge difference between maintaining local crotalids and some of the elapids out there. What this does in effect is tempts people to go underground and get there snakes from a source out of state and keep their mouth shut. You can see the potential danger here should such an animal get loose as there is going to be a tendency to not want to alert authorities and risk incriminating one's self. Such a situation happened in Melbourne fl. when I first moved here and the snakes involved were cobras. Like I said I agree with the permitting system (at least for hots and crocodillians) but if they are too difficult to obtain they are essentially useless.

A realistic approach would involve common sense and personal responsibility, of course.
I don't care if you want to keep pit bulls, large cats, huge pythons, venomous serpents. I don't care if you want to have all the firearms you can handle. I don't care if you want to fly airplanes, drive fast cars, fast boats. I just don't care. This is America, Land of the Free. Do what you want to do, but you better well have your ass covered in the event you cause harm to someone else or someone else's property.
Get liability insurance. Show financial responsibility.
The only one single law throughout the land that should be required is, personal responsibility through liability insurance should a mishap occur.
Specific to each class and category let me speak just to the venomous question. Along with insurance, hot keepers should have an antivenin provider phone list along with a hospital emergency procedural statement. You've got to make sure you can pay your hospital bill should a mishap occur. Make sure your health insurance/liability insurance covers such events. I'm pretty sure most health care providers would laugh in your face if asked to pay, given the circumstances of most bites.
Personally, I believe all buildings and structures housing deadly snakes should have a double door system on entrances and exits along with a security system, locks on cages, video surveillance monitors, and be designed to be completely escape proof. That is just my opinion. There's half a dozen twice as many as the other ways to split hairs over the details.
Go knock your socks off. Just be responsible about it.
jsc
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