Reptile & Amphibian Forums

This is not helping our cause of trying to save the reptiles and stop the ban. Now half of america thinks they will be over run or eaten by large pythons.

Here is the link from Usatoday.com OR just click the link below the picture.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-02-20-burmese-pythons_N.htm?loc=interstitialskip

READ THE ARTICLE HERE

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Thanks
Shawn Morelan
www.Southernboids.com

"they aren't poisonous" ..... lordy....

"crush it to death..." .... nice terms....

cutie in the pic none the less...

and someone show me a burm thats 20 foot and 250 lbs....

I've got a 14 footer and a 15 footer....

ugh

Beth
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The rescue site: www.freewebs.com/okreptilerescue

I just saw this posted on another forum.

It's unbelievable. This line is classic- "One map shows where the pythons could live today, an area that expands when scientists use global warming models for 2100." Great, hysteria based on two levels of junk science.

I couldn't stop laughing at the last paragraph:

"If you see one, don't attempt to engage it. Leave the area, note the location and notify the authorities."

Aside from the fact that 99.9999% are more likely to get hit by lightning than seeing a released/escaped Burmese python, the preceding paragraph says, "The Burmese python is not poisonous and not considered a danger to humans." So it's not poisonous and not considered dangerous... but leave the area!!!!!

We need to flood USA Today with letters.

Thanks,
Ed

>>This is not helping our cause of trying to save the reptiles and stop the ban. Now half of america thinks they will be over run or eaten by large pythons.
>>
>>Here is the link from Usatoday.com OR just click the link below the picture.
>>
>>http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-02-20-burmese-pythons_N.htm?loc=interstitialskip
>>
>>
>>READ THE ARTICLE HERE
>>
>>-----
>>Thanks
>>Shawn Morelan
>>www.Southernboids.com
>>

I'm with you Ed. Junk science x2 indeed. I don't know what the threshold is to establish a self-supporting population of any exotic reptile in the 'Glades, but I'm sceptical it has been reached. And I question why it seems its always the Burmese Python that is the indentified culprit..other tropical reptiles have been common trade in southern Florida for decades: why not new world boids, for example?
Anyway, just my thoughts...not to be confused with data. But from what I've read, objective data on the subject is rare to non-existant. Of course that's no reason to disuade policy makers...
Bill

Thanks Bill. But check out the maps at the bottom of the following government web page:

www.usgs.gov/newsroom/article.asp?ID=1875&from=rss_home

This isn't even junk science, it's outright stupidity, if not dishonesty. Before I saw these maps, I was thinking that the expanded Python range was estimated *after* the assumed global warming. But no, it is being claimed that Burmese Pythons, as of today, can survive in a large portion of the country. Anyone with even basic knowledge of snakes knows Burmese pythons cannot survive the winters in most of the areas in that range. I live in North Carolina (which is in the range), and right now it's 39 degrees. A google search of care sheets for Burmese pythons shows that the night-time low temps should be in the mid to high 70's. Maybe the "scientists" at the USFW and USGGS don't know how to do a Google search????

And we're supposed to trust these agencies that are charged with protecting our environment?? Scary.

Thanks,
Ed

>>I'm with you Ed. Junk science x2 indeed. I don't know what the threshold is to establish a self-supporting population of any exotic reptile in the 'Glades, but I'm sceptical it has been reached. And I question why it seems its always the Burmese Python that is the indentified culprit..other tropical reptiles have been common trade in southern Florida for decades: why not new world boids, for example?
>>Anyway, just my thoughts...not to be confused with data. But from what I've read, objective data on the subject is rare to non-existant. Of course that's no reason to disuade policy makers...
>>Bill
>>

If a snake can make it to Catalina Island (green on their map)we are in serious trouble. Hell, it takes me 15 Min of traffic (I live 5 Min away) just to get to the beach...then you have traverse the gangs and homeless to get to the water....swim it...survive the pollution long enough to reproduce and wipe out the buffalo and then move onto the military on San Clemente...we're all f***ed!

The problem in Florida is probably the biggest contributing factor to all of this coming to a head. In the Miami area, there sometimes seems to be more non-indigenous wildlife, than there is native wildlife. There are certain areas were there are Nile Monitors with thriving breeding populations and Iguanas in some areas are almost at " plague proportions. " Of course the Burmese are breeding in the Everglades and there are also exotic mammals and birds that are thriving just fine, that are not native. These of course are 99% concentrated in good old Dade county area. If you have never been down there, you really do not understand how rediculous it has gotten and will probably get worse as these populations continue to grow. This has all happened, because of the irresponsible keeping and releasing of exotic Reptiles, by BAFFOONS that really have nothing more than a snake they keep for a while and want to watch it eat while they get drunk in their trailer on Paps Blu Ribbon and show it to all of their buddy's until they loose their job and cannot afford to feed it or something else happens, that they just get tired of it and let it go in their yard! Some regulation is needed. Kids under the age of 18 should not be able to walk into " Hank's Wholesale Herps " and buy a Retic or Burm or Rock or any large constrictor and take it home and sleep with it and name it BABY. I am not even gonna get into this any further, I just hope that some common sense agreements can happen, so that the whole does not have to suffer for the stupidity of the few. Just hope that they do not require a pshycological exam before you can own a Reptile; " at that point %90 would be out of luck! " All jokes aside, this is a serious matter and especially for those of us who have been doing this and loving it for most of our lives. However, the internet took a tight nit community of few and brought it to the world years ago and everyone jumped on the wagon. Anytime you open things up to more and more people to get involved, you will start to generate more and more problems, it is just the way it goes! I really miss the days when a " Ditmars or Coborn or Bartlette book, " was the only way to really sit down and enjoy seeing different types of Reptiles. Now, everything is at the " click of a mouse and there is no more mystery to it. " The fact is; " the internet destroyed allot of Markets and Hobby's out there and has overexposed the crap out of everything. " Trust me, I have several friends that are in other Hobby's and Markets and they agree 100%. In the end, all things will work out, but will it work out to who's benefit, is the question?????.........JJ

Well Said JJ, the boa market is well on its way too and has been for acouple years.The days of four digit animals is soon to end.
people are wising up,being patient and eventually getting the animals they want many "years" sooner and at 2/3rds less$$ then forecasted say 2-3 years ago .People holding their breath waiting for the "cash-in" best re'think their priorities.

This Hobby WILL RETURN to its early roots,you'll have very little choice.The wheat will indeed be seperated from the chaff.

Hide'n Watch !

>>Now, everything is at the " click of a mouse and there is no more mystery to it. " The fact is; " the internet destroyed allot of Markets and Hobby's out there and has overexposed the crap out of everything. " Trust me, I have several friends that are in other Hobby's and Markets and they agree 100%. In the end, all things will work out, but will it work out to who's benefit, is the question?????.........JJ
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TnK

snakes are easily taken care of! if it bites you warm water or amonia will help to get it to release! also burmese pythons get RIs really easy. They are a good snake to have!

this is nothing but a politician trying to use scare tactics to get thier way.
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My Photobucket

"Attacks on humans have involved pet owners who mishandle and misfeed the snakes"

Rather than just there have been attacks on humans.

Seems to be based on Global Warming. A THEORY that hasn't been proven, and not too long ago, we feared global cooling. They listed no real numbers other than by 2100 (92 years from now) the area could be greatly expanded. What temps. are we talking about in 2100? They have only a GUESS! Is it more than 6 degrees? Because haven't we been filled with fear already based on "6 Degrees could change the world"? They need to deal with FACTS, not THEORIES! I could theorize that they will move North as temps. increase due to an UNPROVEN THEORY, and also state that to adapt to the unseasonably COLD weather (which many have had in this global meltdown) they will only increase in size to increase body fat to help maintain core body temps in their "evil snake dens" and probably start to consume humans as their preferred meal as humans will be lying all over the place dying off from global warming due to not having enough carbon credits and/or sucking poison from now Government enforced home lighting choices. I can't believe this CRAP makes the newspaper! Polar bears are probably going to be going South as Pythons go North, so We're ALL GOING TO DIE!!! Wait, that's going to happen anyway?!?!

Actually, I thought the same thing, but look at the maps at the following website:

www.usgs.gov/newsroom/article.asp?ID=1875&from=rss_home

I don't know whether to laugh or cry...

>>Seems to be based on Global Warming. A THEORY that hasn't been >>proven,

They're not putting much along with those maps. What are these temperatures expected to be 92 years from now? What is the percentage of increased "suitable habitat". Suitable habitat is not solely temperature related either, so saying "oh, it'll be 88 degrees in all of these locations, so pythons WILL live there" is a stretch. I've seen better information using Salmonella to ban reptiles, but once it was looked at realistically it was proven BS as well. Don't forget 6 degrees and we're all going to die according to Discovery Channel, so what "current global warming trend" THEORY are they using. Also, that is a lot of current suitable habitat mapped out, why are we only seeing populations in S. Florida? Let's see maps of current populations, and a realistic THEORY of expansion at the current rate. ALSO, and I feel this is a valid point to go along with the THEORY...if the temp. is rising, won't currently suitable habitats become TOO HOT, which will drive them North, but leave other currently inhabitable areas uninhabitable???? A little give and take? I don't like examples that only show ONE outcome. What is the other side of the story?

The map on the left isn't post-global warming, it's for today!
So right now we could have Burmese Pythons surviving from Virginia to dry deserts of the southwest!

Anyone know how to initiate a Congressional inquiry, this is bordering on criminal.

Thanks,
Ed

>>They're not putting much along with those maps. What are these temperatures expected to be 92 years from now? What is the percentage of increased "suitable habitat". Suitable habitat is not solely temperature related either, so saying "oh, it'll be 88 degrees in all of these locations, so pythons WILL live there" is a stretch. I've seen better information using Salmonella to ban reptiles, but once it was looked at realistically it was proven BS as well. Don't forget 6 degrees and we're all going to die according to Discovery Channel, so what "current global warming trend" THEORY are they using. Also, that is a lot of current suitable habitat mapped out, why are we only seeing populations in S. Florida? Let's see maps of current populations, and a realistic THEORY of expansion at the current rate. ALSO, and I feel this is a valid point to go along with the THEORY...if the temp. is rising, won't currently suitable habitats become TOO HOT, which will drive them North, but leave other currently inhabitable areas uninhabitable???? A little give and take? I don't like examples that only show ONE outcome. What is the other side of the story?

You mean you don't already??? A government agency is incorrect?? Say it isn't so!

These people are OUT of their friggin minds if they think that burmese pythons could live in the areas they have shaded on the map on the left RIGHT NOW. I'm from Charlotte, NC and it occasionally gets down to single digits in the winter! Burms can't handle temps that low, ever! I'd say that burms would be hard pressed to survive well here in Orlando. It gets below freezing once in a blue moon.
This is absolutely ridiculous! If USFW thinks that burmese pythons are going to be the biggest problem if the earth warms a few degrees over the next 90 years, they are completely off their rockers! Wow... I can't believe people are so stupid as to let issues like this make it from the back of their minds, to their lips to be spoken.
...ridiculous...
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Jonathan Brady
"Sarcasm is angers ugly cousin" -Dr. Buddy Rydell (Jack Nicholson) in "Anger Management".

If their predictions come true, their point is moot. That entire area will be under water.
jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

I personelly know that if a burm was set loose in the climate I live in right now that it won't live long! it was 37 degrees this morning when I took my kids to school.If anybody has kept there burm alive at 37 degrees for more than a week I would love to hear about. I had one of my boas get out the window 10years ago in the same weather conditions he didn't get 10' from the window and was frozen solid. It is all a bunch a bull. The escape I mentioned happen when the animal knocked over a branch and actually broke the glass front of the cage. I have much better caging now!

Al Brown/Brown's Boas

Oh Yeah, I live in Chattanooga Tn in the heart of the South!!!

Al Brown/Brown's Boas

Probably some well protected niche/microclimate, an optimum habitat for giant constrictors, with lots of small dogs, cats, and children.
jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer