Reptile & Amphibian Forums

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080229/ap_on_sc/snake_phobia

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Marcs Reptiles

I had previously heard (can't remember where) that humans do NOT have an innate fear of snakes, only of spiders. I don't know that the test given identifies fears, only abilities to locate so I question the validity of the result.
Jonathan
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Jonathan Brady
"Sarcasm is angers ugly cousin" -Dr. Buddy Rydell (Jack Nicholson) in "Anger Management".

A woman scientist came out with a theory that the way that our
eyes focus came about as a result of the interaction of our simian ancestors and poisonous snakes.

It's crazy, I thought it was absurd, but apparently the
scientific community accepted it as a possibility...

I have read in several places that people are usually afraid of snakes or spiders. I find that many of the snake breeders that I ask about this all have a fear of spiders. I think it is always interesting at shows to see how snake breeders who are stuck next to spider vendors feel.

Bill Kirby

Most people I know are scared of one or the other!
I actually have a few tarantulas that were dumped at a pet store I once worked at. People try to sell them to the store, store says sorry no room, and then the people walk out and leave them on the counter. Naturally the other gals beg me to get rid of them, so I end up with spiders and snakes that kids essentially get bored with. ;p
I only really held one in the first place to prove I wasn't a ninny, but I have a lot of respect for something that small with fangs that big! LOL! One of the 5 I have (mostly Rosehairs) is a mean ol' black thing guessed to be a native of Arizona, and it hates me. I get a little creeped out by it, as it thumps it's toes at me and rears up to threaten me. And although black widows are so pretty to look at... I hate that feeling that something so small (and poisonous) could be on my body and I'd never know. So I don't mind spiders I can see, and will hold tarantulas that aren't aggressive, but I still get the heebie jeebies sometimes too!
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Steph S.
Boas...
1.1 Albino boas (Loki & Hope)
1.4 07 Het. albino boas (Petty & Lady,Sierra,Madeline,Lola)
0.1 Reverse stripe poss. het albino (Cookie)
0.1 Salmon/hypo (Scarlet)
0.1 Anery poss. het snow (Missy)
1.0 Anery (Reno)
0.1 DH Sunglow (Bonnie)
0.0.1 Hypo het anery
1.0.0 Het. Anery (Guy & ?)
0.3 Normals (Ophelia, Sasha, & Lulu)
1.1 Surinames (Solomon & Surreal)
1.2 Hog Isles (Mr.Orange & Peaches, Tang.)
0.0.1 Central American (Sassy)
0.1 Emerald Tree boa (Jade)
1.0 ATB (Satan... seriously!)
Pythons...
2.1 GTPs (B., Monty & Jewel)
0.0.3 BPs (MJ, Precious, Houdini)
1.1 Carpet Pythons (Jackson & Charlotte)
0.1 Blood python (Akaia)
Misc.
1.1 Mandarin Ratsnakes (Jack & Jill)
1.0 Boxer/Pitt Mutt (Tyson)

This was actually written about in Genesis thousands of years ago. After Eve was tempted by the serpent to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, God cursed the serpent. In Genesis 3:15 God's Word says, "And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel." Meaning, God put a dislike between snakes and people. The natural state of man is to have an innate fear and dislike of snakes. Many of us have gotten past that and have a fascination with snakes obviously including me.

So this is nothing new. Though scientists have often been late to the knowledge of some things. Relatively recently, a hundred years ago or so, science figured out that snakes at one time had legs too. People who read their Bibles, and believe it, knew this thousands of years ago. It was no surprise to us, and it's no surprise to hear that science maybe thinks that the fear of snakes is genetic.
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Boaphile Home
All Original/Boaphile Plastics
The Boa Network

TRUTH! I love that. It will set one FREE! LOL

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Ty
Rat Race Solutions
www.ratracesolutions.com

Wow! Truth and reptiles do go together there is alot of time and money spent to prove what the Word of God already said. There really is no new idea under the sun
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Adrian De Leon
Hissenia Reptiles

What Bible translation did this come from ?

>>This was actually written about in Genesis thousands of years ago. After Eve was tempted by the serpent to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, God cursed the serpent. In Genesis 3:15 God's Word says, "And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel." Meaning, God put a dislike between snakes and people. The natural state of man is to have an innate fear and dislike of snakes. Many of us have gotten past that and have a fascination with snakes obviously including me.
>>
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TnK

np
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Ty
Rat Race Solutions
www.ratracesolutions.com

np

Hey Jeff,

I actually disagree with your interpretation/assesment of that passage in Genesis. As we all know, there are quite a few different interpretations of the Bible. Just thought I'd share my view. Genesis happens to be my favorite book of the Bible that I have done the most research in (primarily because of the creation vs evolution debate).

When God said : "And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."

I dont think he is necessarily saying people will dislike snakes. I believe the serpent is symbolic for satan. Something interesting to note about this passage is the usage of the word "seed". The seed of the woman? Thats a violation of biology. Looks to me like a hint of the virgin birth. I believe the seed being referred to there is Jesus and that it (Jesus) shall bruise his (Satans) heel. God's ultimate plan of redemption... written before time.

Much more correct then the folklore tail from above.
Unchecked people inherit such garbage into heart felt belief therefore perpetuating unwarranted interpretation(s)
There is plenty more but . . . . .

>>Hey Jeff,
>>
>>I actually disagree with your interpretation/assessment of that passage in Genesis. As we all know, there are quite a few different interpretations of the Bible. Just thought I'd share my view. Genesis happens to be my favorite book of the Bible that I have done the most research in (primarily because of the creation vs evolution debate).
>>
>>When God said : "And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."
>>
>>I dont think he is necessarily saying people will dislike snakes. I believe the serpent is symbolic for Satan. Something interesting to note about this passage is the usage of the word "seed". The seed of the woman? Thats a violation of biology. Looks to me like a hint of the virgin birth. I believe the seed being referred to there is Jesus and that it (Jesus) shall bruise his (Satan's) heel. God's ultimate plan of redemption... written before time.
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TnK

because if you read the entire quote from The Lord you will see why that can't be.
And the Lord God said unto the serpent, "Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life; and I will put enmity betwqeen thee and the woman and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head and thou shalt bruise his heel."
Remember that man created chapters and verses. But if you take the entire quote He must be referring to the serpent, Eve and her offspring. He did NOT say each and every one of her offspring would bruise the head of snakes. But an awful lot of them do. Besides, Jesus is not going to bruise his head when He returns. He is going to banish him to Hades. Right now Satan rules this earth. But, that is just my opinion. I could definitely be wrong. I love the fact that you study the Bible though. It is the "bread of life"!
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Ty
Rat Race Solutions
www.ratracesolutions.com

He says that the serpent was more crafty than any of the other animals He created. It is odd to me though that He would punish snakes when it was Satan in its body.
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Ty
Rat Race Solutions
www.ratracesolutions.com

Ya'll are getting warmer ......
First one to UNDERSTAND its isnt about an ANIMAL (snake)the closer you'll be to TRUTH.

>>He says that the serpent was more crafty than any of the other animals He created. It is odd to me though that He would punish snakes when it was Satan in its body.
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>>Ty
>>Rat Race Solutions
>>www.ratracesolutions.com
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TnK

Here is a valid commentary,

Gen 3:14,15 God passes sentence; and he begins where the sin began, with the serpent. The devil's instruments must share in the devil's punishments. Under the cover of the serpent, the devil is sentenced to be degraded and accursed of God; detested and abhorred of all mankind: also to be destroyed and ruined at last by the great Redeemer, signified by the breaking of his head. War is proclaimed between the Seed of the woman and the seed of the serpent. It is the fruit of this enmity, that there is a continual warfare between grace and corruption, in the hearts of God's people. Satan, by their corruptions, buffets them, sifts them, and seeks to devour them. Heaven and hell can never be reconciled, nor light and darkness; no more can Satan and a sanctified soul. Also, there is a continual struggle between the wicked and the godly in this world. A gracious promise is here made of Christ, as the Deliverer of fallen man from the power of Satan. Here was the drawn of the gospel day: no sooner was the wound given, than the remedy was provided and revealed. This gracious revelation of a Saviour came unasked, and unlooked for. Without a revelation of mercy, giving some hope of forgiveness, the convinced sinner would sink into despair, and be hardened. By faith in this promise, our first parents, and the patriarchs before the flood, were justified and saved. Notice is given concerning Christ. 1. His incarnation, or coming in the flesh. It speaks great encouragement to sinners, that their Saviour is the Seed of the woman, bone of our bone, Heb 2:11,14. 2. His sufferings and death; pointed at in Satan's bruising his heel, that is, his human nature. And Christ's sufferings are continued in the sufferings of the saints for his name. The devil tempts them, persecutes and slays them; and so bruises the heel of Christ, who is afflicted in their afflictions. But while the heel is bruised on earth, the Head is in heaven. 3. His victory over Satan thereby. Christ baffled Satan's temptations, rescued souls out of his hands. By his death he gave a fatal blow to the devil's kingdom, a wound to the head of this serpent that cannot be healed. As the gospel gains ground, Satan falls.

Gen

>>Hey Jeff,
>>
>>I actually disagree with your interpretation/assesment of that passage in Genesis. As we all know, there are quite a few different interpretations of the Bible. Just thought I'd share my view. Genesis happens to be my favorite book of the Bible that I have done the most research in (primarily because of the creation vs evolution debate).
>>
>>When God said : "And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."
>>
>>I dont think he is necessarily saying people will dislike snakes. I believe the serpent is symbolic for satan. Something interesting to note about this passage is the usage of the word "seed". The seed of the woman? Thats a violation of biology. Looks to me like a hint of the virgin birth. I believe the seed being referred to there is Jesus and that it (Jesus) shall bruise his (Satans) heel. God's ultimate plan of redemption... written before time.
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TnK

I have more then 16 snakes hear and I still do have a phobia.

don't get me wrong I handle all my snakes regularly , but if ones hissing at me or coiled up to bite I leave them alone.

Also with other peoples snakes that I have not started to bond with yet I am always paranoid when holding them!!!

I do have a tarantula and a scorpian as well and must say the scorpian is the freakiest to Hold~
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www.BetterBoa.com

4.3 BCIs (Zeus, Athena, Xena, Jocasta, Menelaus, Aphodite, Hades)
4.4 Corn snakes

I still find the study to be severely lacking in convincing information. A grand total of 48 people were tested so the sample size was way too small to get anything other that a base hypothesis (one that will be refuted in no time I bet). One researcher had an admitted phobia of snakes which can be a bit of a hindrance when making unbiased conclusions as well. Her idea that "snakes would have posed a significant threat to our ancestors" is biologically ignorant and makes me question the validity of all her research on this study.

Having worked at a science museum here in NC for 5 years I can anecdotally say that fear of animals (esp snakes and insects) is often a learned behavior. I can't tell you how many times a group of interested kids walks up to an exhibit only to be dragged away by an adult who spews mouthfuls of uneducated fear about the given species.

I applaud anyone and everyone who takes some time to teach children the wonders of nature so that they may one day have some interest in conservation of animals and habitats.

I don't have any boa pictures to share but here is a wild NC N. Pinesnake.

Holds far more "truth" then the Biblical reference made earlier

Thanks,

>>I still find the study to be severely lacking in convincing information. A grand total of 48 people were tested so the sample size was way too small to get anything other that a base hypothesis (one that will be refuted in no time I bet). One researcher had an admitted phobia of snakes which can be a bit of a hindrance when making unbiased conclusions as well. Her idea that "snakes would have posed a significant threat to our ancestors" is biologically ignorant and makes me question the validity of all her research on this study.
>>
>>Having worked at a science museum here in NC for 5 years I can anecdotally say that fear of animals (esp snakes and insects) is often a learned behavior. I can't tell you how many times a group of interested kids walks up to an exhibit only to be dragged away by an adult who spews mouthfuls of uneducated fear about the given species.
>>
>>I applaud anyone and everyone who takes some time to teach children the wonders of nature so that they may one day have some interest in conservation of animals and habitats.
>>
>>I don't have any boa pictures to share but here is a wild NC N. Pinesnake.
>>
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TnK

parents and kids.... ha!

We regularly do educational shows and go to adoption events-- there are adults and loads of kids...

There are a lot of parents with interested kids that will shove thier kids in front of them towards the snake-- they always stay behind thier kids-- like the kid is a shield...

After several years of events-- this is one thing that I have been observing and noticing much more regularly.

Parents ask the right questions... and the stupid ones (is it poisonous... this state has a TON of venomous snakes-- and these people don't know what a venomous snake looks like?!)
anyway--

just reading that bit about parents dragging thier kids of babbling nonsense into thier brains made me think of those events... lol

people are so dumb sometimes!

Beth
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The rescue site: www.freewebs.com/okreptilerescue

I agree the study is dubious. Just the other day, I was holding my Indigo snake out on the front porch, and before I knew it there were 5 or 6 young kids and toddlers crowded around me asking questions and petting the snake. Heck, even some of the parents were interested and curious, not fearful.

The other thing is, how did the resarchers make the leap from
"adults and preschool children have an extraordinary ability to quickly pinpoint snakes amid harmless distractions" to they are "deathly afraid of snakes?" Did I miss something? Heck, if you did a similar experiment on a group of men using a picture of naked women instead of a snake, I bet the men would be able to "quickly pinpoint" the naked women pics. That doesn't mean that men are deathly afraid of naked women, does it?

What is it with snakes and junk science lately???

Thanks,
Ed

>>I still find the study to be severely lacking in convincing information. A grand total of 48 people were tested so the sample size was way too small to get anything other that a base hypothesis (one that will be refuted in no time I bet). One researcher had an admitted phobia of snakes which can be a bit of a hindrance when making unbiased conclusions as well. Her idea that "snakes would have posed a significant threat to our ancestors" is biologically ignorant and makes me question the validity of all her research on this study.
>>
>>Having worked at a science museum here in NC for 5 years I can anecdotally say that fear of animals (esp snakes and insects) is often a learned behavior. I can't tell you how many times a group of interested kids walks up to an exhibit only to be dragged away by an adult who spews mouthfuls of uneducated fear about the given species.
>>
>>I applaud anyone and everyone who takes some time to teach children the wonders of nature so that they may one day have some interest in conservation of animals and habitats.
>>
>>I don't have any boa pictures to share but here is a wild NC N. Pinesnake.
>>

RIGHT!!!!
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Ty
Rat Race Solutions
www.ratracesolutions.com

I agree whole-heartedly! I can't tell you how many times I've seen the parents exclaiming "Ewwwwwwww a snake!" and the kids come over, see the snake, look at the parent, and then go "ewwwwwwww a snake!"

Watch the kids that exhibit very strong 'fear' responses to snakes - it is often a very exaggerated motion of what they've seen adults do, especially if those adults are present. Genuine fear in children is easy to spot, and usually those kids have a good reason to be afraid and shouldn't be pushed... But a lot of kids are just afraid of snakes because everyone else is. Children like to belong to groups, and being afraid of snakes, unfortunately, is a pretty big group.

When I used to do presentations at a spring/summer camp, it was funny to see the kids 'afraid' of snakes changing their minds when they saw the counselors being calm and interested in the snakes. The counselor that ran the camps I talked at was actually extremely scared of snakes, and the kids knew it, but she'd still pet them...and by the end of the day all of the kids had held the snakes!

This little girl is FIVE, and that ball python stretches out longer than she is tall. Innate fear of snakes, my butt!

~jenny
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"Polysyllabism in no way insures that what you're saying is actually worth being heard." - Blake (an e-friend of mine)

"I have never made but one prayer to god, a very short one: "O lord, make my enemies ridiculous." And he granted it." - Voltaire

Having not watched the thing on Yahoo, just by the conversation -anything snakes prey on in nature are innately fearful of snakes as adults. Neonates and juveniles may not have the cognitive faculties yet developed to be aware. Some examples -- lizards, rodents, birds, primates.
jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

people as a whole having a fear of snakes. That basically, adults can learn fear, but because of research and how young children react similarly to adults without learned responses, that they believe it is a genetic/inherited reaction from when 'man was young' kind of stuff. That is my bad summary.
From there they went on to say that they are doing research on a similar fear of spiders that is not done. Someone also brought up how people who don't have a fear of snakes, sometimes still have that deathly fear of spiders.
That is about it in a nutshell. A bit of religious input and the usual banter and debate also included! ;p
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Steph S.
Boas...
1.1 Albino boas (Loki & Hope)
1.4 07 Het. albino boas (Petty & Lady,Sierra,Madeline,Lola)
0.1 Reverse stripe poss. het albino (Cookie)
0.1 Salmon/hypo (Scarlet)
0.1 Anery poss. het snow (Missy)
1.0 Anery (Reno)
0.1 DH Sunglow (Bonnie)
0.0.1 Hypo het anery
1.0.0 Het. Anery (Guy & ?)
0.3 Normals (Ophelia, Sasha, & Lulu)
1.1 Surinames (Solomon & Surreal)
1.2 Hog Isles (Mr.Orange & Peaches, Tang.)
0.0.1 Central American (Sassy)
0.1 Emerald Tree boa (Jade)
1.0 ATB (Satan... seriously!)
Pythons...
2.1 GTPs (B., Monty & Jewel)
0.0.3 BPs (MJ, Precious, Houdini)
1.1 Carpet Pythons (Jackson & Charlotte)
0.1 Blood python (Akaia)
Misc.
1.1 Mandarin Ratsnakes (Jack & Jill)
1.0 Boxer/Pitt Mutt (Tyson)