Reptile & Amphibian Forums

my buddy wanted me to post this thread. he will be in west texas in big bend national park. he will be hiking isolated areas. he wants to know what snake bite treatment he should keep in mind if bit by a rattlesnake miles from his car or medical attention, thank you.

Don't go out alone. Best piece of advice. Also, bring some form of communication (cell phone and backup like a radio, but neither of these may reach help). A GPS unit wouldn't hurt either.

Sawyer extractors are about the only field "treatment" devices I would use for a viper bite. Others can do what they want, but I won't be using a compression bandage on a viper bite either.

Extractors have been proven to be useless.
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Tim Cole
www.Designeratrox.com/
www.AustinReptileService.net
www.AustinReptileExpo.com/
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Conservation through Education

Not only useless, but detrimental

The same principle applies to snakebite as to any other potential medical emergency when hiking backcounry (be it a broken ankle, heat exhaustion, bear attack or whatever) . . . don't go alone and always have a plan for getting to medical care and/or being rescued via some form of communication. It's a lot more likely that he'll sustain a fall or some other disabling injury than that he will be tagged by a rattler.

As others mentioned, a Sawyer extractor is not only useless against cytotoxic snakebites, but carries the potential to increase the damage as well. The only modicum of success they would have would be if it was applied within a few seconds of the bite, which in the heat of the moment probably isn't going to happen.

Best bet: wear tough, loose clothing (such as denim jeans), protective boots, carry a cell phone (may be useless as mentioned), and be wary of where he is sticking his hands and feet. The chances of actually being bitten by a rattlesnake while simply hiking are remarkably low. As long as he doesn't harass or corner an animal he encounters, he should be fine.
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Abhishek Prasad

all of the advice is great and will be passed on to my buddy. i apprecitate the prevention and safety tips, still waiting for someone to answer the question though (treatment options IF bit and medcial care not available) thank you.

If you're in the field, get bit, and there is no medical care available period, the only thing I can think of is hope for the best. Getting prompt medical attention is your best bet. Other than removing tight fitting clothing (rings, watches, etc) and getting ready to get to the medical center there isn't a lot you can do as an individual other than stay calm.

Part of the alure of going into the wilderness by yourself is that if you mess up and an accident happens then you may not make it out. Although I am sure that there will be some denials coming...some of this is in most individuals that keep deadly venomous snakes. Although the earlier comments about the extractor are not too far off the mark, there were some good experiments done on dogs that showed a considerable amount of venom could be removed, if the suction device was applied quickly. In the backpackers situation, it might remove enough venom to save his life and the kits really should not add much to his pack.

Part of the alure of going into the wilderness by yourself is that if you mess up and an accident happens then you may not make it out. Although I am sure that there will be some denials coming...some of this is in most individuals that keep deadly venomous snakes. Although the earlier comments about the extractor are not too far off the mark, there were some good experiments done on dogs that showed a considerable amount of venom could be removed, if the suction device was applied quickly. In the backpackers situation, it might remove enough venom to save his life and the kits really should not add much to his pack.

Bob,
You obviously did not read the tests and studies performed by Sean Bush using pigs and extractors. It was shown to be ineffective and actually cause damage in more than one test performed.
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Tim Cole
www.Designeratrox.com/
www.AustinReptileService.net
www.AustinReptileExpo.com/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<
Conservation through Education

If all I had was an extractor out in the field, then I would use it. Pigs are different than humans, maybe not in your case Tim! LOL!
Randal

I bet it was hard for the pigs to hold the extractor properly,
having only hooves and all.
I keep an extractor in my snake room and would use it while in route to the hospital, if for no other reason than to give me something to do.
Ryan,

Bob you couldn't be more correct.

If you're out in the boonies, say 5's day hike, be smart. Don't play with snakes that can kill you, hell don't twist you're ankle. I hope I know better 30 miles deep in the high uintas.
Nate

Best bet: wear tough, loose clothing (such as denim jeans), protective boots, carry a cell phone (may be useless as mentioned), and be wary of where he is sticking his hands and feet.

Also, on a recent outing for copperheads I took an old thick wool sweater and cut it into 10 inch strips, then I wrapped it around my feet starting just above the sole of my boots. Then I wrapped around my leg up about 10 inches. I then taped a couple strips of masking tape. I then had a solid 3 inches of padding then put on my loose fit jeans and was amazed at how it didn't feel hot at all. I'm glad I did this because I stepped right over one and when he started buzzing in the leaves, he was no more than 10 inches from my heal. He didn't bite but man that was close. I was driving for about an hour on my way home and realized that I still had them on,no discomfort at all and it was 90 degrees that day.

The Big bend area is one of the most remote places in the US. Though I have never been to the park specifically I have herped to the east of there, between big bend and Del Rio. On that stretch of land cell phones were useless. No service what so ever. I cant imagine Big bend being any better but I cant say for cretin. That being said a satellite phone would probably be the best bet instead of a cell phone.

As for treating snake bite, the reason no one has said how to is because you can not treat snake envenomations outside of a hospital. Anti venom is the only cure, period. If there were highly neurotoxic snakes in TX then I would could recommend the pressure bandage method but this is not advised for venoms that destroy tissue as their primary function or so I was always been led to believe.

What he can do is get an epipen in case he were to have an allergic reaction. That is probably the only first aid worth performing and the only thing that would kill him quickly if bitten.

The best thing your friend can do is notify a park ranger as to where he will be hiking so if he doesn't report back in after a specified time they can send somone out looking for him. If he were bitten by a rattlesnake the best advice would be to sit down, remain calm and wait till somone rescued him. Generally speaking rattlesnakes bites wont kill you, well period and definately not very fast. If one were to die it is usually a result of massive eternal bleeding, renal failure etc. Of course there are so many variables which can dictate the severity of a bite that are impossible to predict before hand.

Im sorry we could not give you magical cure all for snake bite but unfortunately none exist. Just tell him to watch his hand and feet placement and there shouldn't be a problem. Rattlesnake wont be hunting him down. They will try everything in their power to avoid interaction. I dont know how far off the beaten trail he plans on going but my advice would be to stya on a path if at all possible.

thank you Atrox788 and everyone else for your time and input

I've always heard the best snake bite kit is a cell phone and a set of car keys. The cell phone to call the emergency room so they can set up for you and look up how to treat you if they aren't familiar and the car keys to get you to the hospital.

I've camped Big Bend the last two years in a row and plan on returning in 3 weeks. I've never been able to get a cell phone signal while in the park.

It's also illegal to hike off the trails. The trails are remote enough to get yourself in trouble if by yourself.

In the last two years I have seen only one rattlesnake there, but I've seen a lot of mountain lion tracks. That's actually the more realistic danger if hiking remote areas alone, and the bears would probably be a distant second after that.

I've also been warned that those old fashion type of snake bite kits with the razor are very dangerous and can and probably will do more harm than good.
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1.1 Jungle Carpet Python (both gorgeous)
1.1 Ball Python (normals, he said proudly)
3.3 hatchling ball pythons (normals)
1.1 Ball Python (het for albino)(gonna make my own albino)
1.1 Corn Snake (Okeetee, Sunglow x Snow)
0.1 Gray band Kingsnake (Blairs)
1.1 Desert Kingsnake
1.0 Andean Milksnake (het Inca phase)
1.0 Bullsnake (normal)(my garbage disposal snake)
1.1 Bullsnake (red bulls)
1.1 Black Pine Snake
1.1 Southern Snow Pine (snow)(red phase snow)
1.1 Mexican Pine snake
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1.0 Western Hognose (possible het albino)
1.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback (Hondo)
0.1 Spouse (WC)(hates the herps,and not real crazy about the dog)

One thing that might be considered is an EPIRB. Probably less expensive than a sat phone. Check marine supply places.

~~Greg~~