Reptile & Amphibian Forums

hello everone, im new to this forum. a discussion on the rainbow boa forum sparked an interesting thought... but how about a little back story first (ill try to keep it short)

everyone say hi to Jake

ive had him for about ten years, and other than being very grumpy (doesnt like to be held) hes a great snake. always been fed mice or rats since i had him, and always willing to take a meal. however a few days later he gets really stinky lol. after talking to a couple other guys a sugestion was made to change his diet, that might help to clear this up a bit.

so other than rats, ive heard of trying chicks, anoles, and gold fish... does anyone have any thoughts about trying any of those for an adult corn?

then today i head something i never would have though of. try eggs!! i know corn snakes eat eggs in the wild. so why not in captivity. does anyone know of a reason why i should not try to feed Jake a grocery store egg??

so it seem like between lizards, chicks, fish, and eggs, i have a few options i would like to try something. but then again i dont know if he will take anything else because he hasnt had anything other than rats. either way i want to try any suggestion on which i might have luck with??
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-Stephen-

0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

hopeful for not to distant future:
--brazillian rainbow boas 1 female for sure
2 or 3? maybe a breeding pair?
-- bearded dragon for the wifey my list got to big...

more distant future hopefuls
1 or 2 of each maybe a breeding pair?
--anery boa (ooooh)
--jungle carpet python (love to have 1 or 2)
--dumeril boa (ahhhh)

slightly more wishful thinking
--hypo br rainbow boa (love em)
--anery br rainbow boa (oooh even better!!)
--motely boa (gorgeous!!)

I would stick with rodents and stay safe.
Foot Hill Reptiles

Corn snakes don't eat goldfish and an Anole would hardly be enough of a meal for a snake that large. In addition, the vast majority of Anoles are wild caught and carry parasites.

Eggs do not provide the complete nutrition that rodents do. In addition, if the snake has been eating the same type of food for a decade, the likelihood of it switching to something else is remote.

Most corn snake owners feed rodents to their snakes and nothing else. If the idea behind your post is that by switching food items your snake will be less stinky, the exact opposite is true - fish, lizards, eggs, etc. are smellier that whole rodents when deficated.

Have you considered taking your snake to a vet to see if it's healthy?

Tim

Third Eye

yes your right the idea behind is to lessen the stinky factor.

i do agree that there is little chance of actually being able to switch him over to something else

Eggs do not provide the complete nutrition that rodents do

so just out of curiosity do you know what nutritions are needed that are found in rats but not in eggs?

so from the sounds of it, its not worth the try, and thats fine,. i did like the potential of the idea, but i also wanted more information before i tried anything, so thanks all for the input!
-----
-Stephen-

0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

hopeful for not to distant future:
--brazillian rainbow boas 1 female for sure
2 or 3? maybe a breeding pair?
-- bearded dragon for the wifey my list got to big...

more distant future hopefuls
1 or 2 of each maybe a breeding pair?
--anery boa (ooooh)
--jungle carpet python (love to have 1 or 2)
--dumeril boa (ahhhh)

slightly more wishful thinking
--hypo br rainbow boa (love em)
--anery br rainbow boa (oooh even better!!)
--motely boa (gorgeous!!)

"so just out of curiosity do you know what nutritions are needed that are found in rats but not in eggs?"

Nope. But that's beside the point. Corns snakes eat mostly rodents in the wild. They are not adapted to eat a diet of eggs. It's unlikely that they'd eat one in the first place. There are rat snakes (like yellow rats and black rats) that will eat eggs, but corn snakes don't.

Some snakes, like egg-eating snakes, have evolved to get all the nutrition they need from eggs. Corn snakes have not. They get all the nutrition they need from rodents.

Tim

"so just out of curiosity do you know what nutritions are needed that are found in rats but not in eggs?"

Nope. But that's beside the point.

it actually is NOT besides the point and has alot to do with the conversation.

from you post this is how i understand what you said

"im right, but i dont know why so dont question it"

i think you are the one who missed the point. you seem so focused on the fact that "cornsnakes do not eat eggs" it seems like your pulling anything out of the air that seems logical enough to post. your kinda controdicting yourself too saying its not likely then the next statement saying outright the dont...

also correct me if i am wrong, but isnt a corn snake also know as a red rat snake?? and your telling me a yellow rat and a black rat will eat eggs but a red rat wont.. is that right?

i found a topic that sparked mt interest and figured i would look into it a bit and ask around for advice, and i did. so thank you for your replies and im sorry if i asked a question you couldnt answer
-----
-Stephen-

0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

hopeful for not to distant future:
--brazillian rainbow boas 1 female for sure
2 or 3? maybe a breeding pair?
-- bearded dragon for the wifey my list got to big...

more distant future hopefuls
1 or 2 of each maybe a breeding pair?
--anery boa (ooooh)
--jungle carpet python (love to have 1 or 2)
--dumeril boa (ahhhh)

slightly more wishful thinking
--hypo br rainbow boa (love em)
--anery br rainbow boa (oooh even better!!)
--motely boa (gorgeous!!)

>>"so just out of curiosity do you know what nutritions are needed that are found in rats but not in eggs?"
>>
>>Nope. But that's beside the point.
>>
>>
>>it actually is NOT besides the point and has alot to do with the conversation.
>>
>>from you post this is how i understand what you said
>>
>>"im right, but i dont know why so dont question it"
>>
>>i think you are the one who missed the point. you seem so focused on the fact that "cornsnakes do not eat eggs" it seems like your pulling anything out of the air that seems logical enough to post. your kinda controdicting yourself too saying its not likely then the next statement saying outright the dont...
>>
>>also correct me if i am wrong, but isnt a corn snake also know as a red rat snake?? and your telling me a yellow rat and a black rat will eat eggs but a red rat wont.. is that right?
>>
>>i found a topic that sparked mt interest and figured i would look into it a bit and ask around for advice, and i did. so thank you for your replies and im sorry if i asked a question you couldnt answer
>>-----
>>-Stephen-
>>

Tim is right...and he is not just pulling it "from the air"
He probably just didn't feel like spending thirty or forty minutes explaining every minute detail.
Corns can and do eat eggs on occaision but eggs do not form the entire diet of corn snakes.
With rodents there's protein, fat, calcium from the bones, ash, and there's the ingredients in the mouse's stomach. Even the hair is digested.
There is simply more nutrition in a whole mouse then in an egg.
And he was also right in the smell factor.
If the odor from your snake is THAT strong then you might just need to get it to the vet.
When it comes to waste from a snake eating rodents as opposed to fish, fowl or eggs the rodent "poo" is not nearly as offensive smelling as the others.
Like I mentioned above corns may take the occaisional egg but they aren't as prolific egg eaters as black or yellow rats tend to be.
You would do well to heed the advise Tim gives, even if he didn't explain things to a level you expected he is highly experienced and knowledgable and will not give advise that could in any way harm your snakes.
Tim was trying to help and was giving sound advise.
He didn't have to take the time you know.

-----
Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"Resistance is futile"
Jimmy Johnson
(Draybar)
Draybars Snakes

_____

right he didnt have to take the time i know, but he did, and you did also so think you both for your posts. i know its not an excuse but i had a very bad day on friday and was very grumpy to begin with, therefore i apoligize if any thing i said was offending. also its impossible to tell a tone of voice when reading someones words instead of hearing them, weather it was intended or not i felt tim was being very condecending... but then again i might have felt that only because i was in a bad mood, if that is the case then again im sorrry if i crossed any lines...

With rodents there's protein, fat, calcium from the bones, ash, and there's the ingredients in the mouse's stomach. Even the hair is digested.

okay thats better now i think we are getting somewhere... even though both protein and fat are found in eggs. i dont know what the protein value of a rat is but eggs are very high in protein. the same will apply with fat, although eggs are lower in fat i still dont know the fat content for a rat. so i disagree with you there however you also mentions calcium and what ever else is found in the rats GI track. this is PART what i was looking for. i am wondering if anyone knows the break down of needed nutrients in a snakes diet? lets use calcium as an example... we now know a snake can get it from a rat (dont know how much) but not an egg. so how much calcium IS needed in a snake diet? does that makes sense do you understand my questioning or am im just blahbing?

You would do well to heed the advise Tim gives, even if he didn't explain things to a level you expected he is highly experienced and knowledgable and will not give advise that could in any way harm your snakes.
Tim was trying to help and was giving sound advise.

this i do not doubt, after all i came here looking for advise right... but at the same time if you cant answer a question (or even dont want to) dont just brush it off and say thats not the point then say something else in (what seem to me) a condesending tone.
-----
-Stephen-

0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

hopeful for not to distant future:
--brazillian rainbow boas 1 female for sure
2 or 3? maybe a breeding pair?
-- bearded dragon for the wifey my list got to big...

more distant future hopefuls
1 or 2 of each maybe a breeding pair?
--anery boa (ooooh)
--jungle carpet python (love to have 1 or 2)
--dumeril boa (ahhhh)

slightly more wishful thinking
--hypo br rainbow boa (love em)
--anery br rainbow boa (oooh even better!!)
--motely boa (gorgeous!!)

>>right he didnt have to take the time i know, but he did, and you did also so think you both for your posts. i know its not an excuse but i had a very bad day on friday and was very grumpy to begin with, therefore i apoligize if any thing i said was offending. also its impossible to tell a tone of voice when reading someones words instead of hearing them, weather it was intended or not i felt tim was being very condecending... but then again i might have felt that only because i was in a bad mood, if that is the case then again im sorrry if i crossed any lines...
>>
>>
>>With rodents there's protein, fat, calcium from the bones, ash, and there's the ingredients in the mouse's stomach. Even the hair is digested.
>>
>>
>>okay thats better now i think we are getting somewhere... even though both protein and fat are found in eggs. i dont know what the protein value of a rat is but eggs are very high in protein. the same will apply with fat, although eggs are lower in fat i still dont know the fat content for a rat. so i disagree with you there however you also mentions calcium and what ever else is found in the rats GI track. this is PART what i was looking for. i am wondering if anyone knows the break down of needed nutrients in a snakes diet? lets use calcium as an example... we now know a snake can get it from a rat (dont know how much) but not an egg. so how much calcium IS needed in a snake diet? does that makes sense do you understand my questioning or am im just blahbing?
>>
>>
>>You would do well to heed the advise Tim gives, even if he didn't explain things to a level you expected he is highly experienced and knowledgable and will not give advise that could in any way harm your snakes.
>>Tim was trying to help and was giving sound advise.
>>
>>
>>this i do not doubt, after all i came here looking for advise right... but at the same time if you cant answer a question (or even dont want to) dont just brush it off and say thats not the point then say something else in (what seem to me) a condesending tone.
>>-----
>>-Stephen-
>>

I'm not going to touch on the post from Tim or your problem with it.
I said what I had to say.

I do not know the exact amount of protein, fat, vitamins, minerals, etc that a corn snake requires as a balanced diet.
What I do know is the main diet of corn snakes is rodents.
I also know that eggs are not.
So, in my opinion, I do not see the importance in the exact comparisons between the two because I will continue to feed my corn snakes rodents.
I don't mean this to sound condescending or rude. I just do not see a need to deviate from what we know to be a proper/healthy diet for corn snakes.
Now, I can direct you to a site that has some information on whole prey items but it does not touch on eggs and it does not give a daily requirement for corn snakes.

http://rodentpro.com/qpage_articles_03.asp
-----
Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"Resistance is futile"
Jimmy Johnson
(Draybar)
Draybars Snakes

_____

As stated above, they won't eat goldfish, and anoles carry parasites.

If you're goal is "less stinky", I can tell you from experience that chicks or birds will take you in the wrong direction on that one. And eggs even more so-both lead to loose smelly stools in comparison to a rodent diet.
-----
Brad Chambers
WWW.HCU-TX.ORG

The Avalanche has already started-it is too late for the pebbles to vote....

okay thank you, so in your experence you have fed corn snakes chicks. and the result of that you found it to become both more runny and stinky is that right?

and you also said eggs would be worse... do you also know this from experence or is that part speculation? just curious

thanks for the post
-----
-Stephen-

0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
0.1 col redtail boa (Dixie-my baby girl)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)

hopeful for not to distant future:
--brazillian rainbow boas 1 female for sure
2 or 3? maybe a breeding pair?
-- bearded dragon for the wifey my list got to big...

more distant future hopefuls
1 or 2 of each maybe a breeding pair?
--anery boa (ooooh)
--jungle carpet python (love to have 1 or 2)
--dumeril boa (ahhhh)

slightly more wishful thinking
--hypo br rainbow boa (love em)
--anery br rainbow boa (oooh even better!!)
--motely boa (gorgeous!!)

chicks would work fine and thier cheaper

lizards are expensive and could pass parasites

goldfish are too well taken care of and some of the things used on them can be harmful to snakes, if you go with try feeders

a chicken egg could be too big (no harm in trying) maybe quail eqqs if you can find them

maybe you should try some comercial stuff that t-rex makes like the sausages or garter grub.

if you figure out what part of the mouse is making him smell maybe you could make your own sausage without that part.

maybe its the snake not the food?
-----
jake barney
1.1 ball pythons
0.2 corns
1.0 cal king
0.0.1 wc garter
1.o cb son