Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I just recieved my new male hognose last friday. He is an 18" male (06 hold over), that was labled as "eats like a pig". Now I don't doubt the seller, as I've only had him for a couple days. But I do have a couple questions/concerns. I offered him a fuzzy today (small fuzzy), and he showed a little interest in it, but not much. I removed him from his cage and placed in a smaller cage with no substrate for feeding.

He is also staying on the cold side of the cage. The warm side is in the 90's and gradually getting colder down to about 68ish on the cold side. It's a pretty decent size cage so there is room for such a gradient. I have PLENTY of hiding spots over the hot areas and cold ones. He just is always in the coldest spot. Is he trying to brumate? I was told he was recently taken out of his first brumation and started feeding again before he was shipped out.

I know these guys can go off feed so I shouldn't really worry. But is there anything I should do that the snake is telling me? Any suggestions? I will provide more information if needed.

It's been my experience that if they are exposed to temps under about 74 degrees they tend to go off feed for a while or not feed as well. Your cool side is too cool. Also, try to feed him inside his own cage, and push the prey item against his nose a little bit. For some reason it creates a great feeding response.

I think you are just being overly concerned is all. I frequently don't try feeding a new snake for at least a few weeks, it's just not worth the trouble. A large majority of "no feed" posts on here are from after getting a new snake.

Hogs don't typically (if ever) use hide boxes. In the wild they are not usually found under cover objects either.

If he is not feeding in 2 months, THEN come back here and start analyzing your setup. For now, you are fine.
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Virginia Herping
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VaHS
Virginia Herpetological Society online store
http://www.cafepress.com/vaherpsociety

"The irrational fear of snakes is the only excuse a grown man has... to act like a complete sissy" - Colchicine

I've dealt with problem feeders before, like ball pythons (one not eating for a year then suddenly starting!). But I have NO experience with hognose snakes at all. I didnt' want to feed in the tank because I have a sand/bed a beast mix (completely dry). I guess I can put a dish in there to feed off of if I must feed in the cage.

I'm not sure how to heat the other side of the cage up more. I have a big heat pad that goes halfway across the bottom. It keeps the warm side up to spec, but doesn't do much for the other side.

What should I do about the low heat side? Leave it be or try and figure something out? Cage dimensions are 36" X 18". It's kinda tall though so some heat will probably go through the top.

I'll also wait a little longer to try to feed again.

Hognoses are diurnal snakes that burrow to get away from high heat. Therefore, their tank should be heated with a light bulb. Put the light bulb on the hot side of the tank and perhaps slide your UTH to the middle of the tank to help warm up the cool side. My house is currently getting down to 65° at night and my full-grown Western is still eating with no supplemental night time heat. Another thing I have done to help keep heat inside tanks is to buy sheets of Styrofoam from Lowes and covered the tops of the cages. This also helps to increase the humidity.
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Virginia Herping
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VaHS
Virginia Herpetological Society online store
http://www.cafepress.com/vaherpsociety

"The irrational fear of snakes is the only excuse a grown man has... to act like a complete sissy" - Colchicine

I found an 8 watt uth that I had and put it on the cool side. Warmed it up to the mid 70's now. I also have a light on the hot side. Forgot to mention that. But like I said, he doesn't go on the hot side where the light is. I tried an experiment and turned off the light for a while and he went over there when it was off. With the cool side warmer now he is a LOT more active. Before he would just lay there all day and not move. Now he's active and moving about the cage throughout the day. I'm still going to wait another week till I try to feed him again. Any thoughts on removing him from the cage to feed (coconut/sand substrate), or feed him on a bowl in his cage?

The only explanation I have for the apparent dislike of the heat light is that it could be too hot, which usually isn't a prob for hogs. I don't recall if you have reported the temperature on that side or not.

I am concerned about the snake's activity. Laying there all day is what a snake is SUPPOSED to do. However, constant moving is an obvious sign of stress. I wonder if the combination of a too hot heat lamp and now the lack of a "cool" side is causing the snake to "flee" from the stress of heat.

I realize I am throwing confusing scenarios at you. But at the least I hope that you will experiment more with your set up. Also, change your perception of what is good/bad ectothermic behavior, i.e. moving may not be good.

Feeding container
The hog should be acclimated to being in a feeding container. Start now. Every other day, put him in the container for 10-20 min. Once he feeds in there, he'll associate that with food and get hungry just by sitting in there!

Good luck!

>>I found an 8 watt uth that I had and put it on the cool side. Warmed it up to the mid 70's now. I also have a light on the hot side. Forgot to mention that. But like I said, he doesn't go on the hot side where the light is. I tried an experiment and turned off the light for a while and he went over there when it was off. With the cool side warmer now he is a LOT more active. Before he would just lay there all day and not move. Now he's active and moving about the cage throughout the day. I'm still going to wait another week till I try to feed him again. Any thoughts on removing him from the cage to feed (coconut/sand substrate), or feed him on a bowl in his cage?
-----
Virginia Herping
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VaHS
Virginia Herpetological Society online store
http://www.cafepress.com/vaherpsociety

"The irrational fear of snakes is the only excuse a grown man has... to act like a complete sissy" - Colchicine

I found your message informing about using styrofoam pads to keep in humidity. I find my hog drinking a lot. She burrows herself under her water bowl for days and then comes out and drinks almost for a day straight. When she's not under her bowl she drinks almost every day. Is this normal? Seems like maybe it's too dry in the tank for her. I have aspen in there which also makes it dry?

I have found my hog (and past hogs) love a nice humid hide.

Sorry, I guess when I say "moving all around" I mean more along the lines of every couple hours it'll possibly move, or even change positions but stay in the same spot. And before when I said it would be in the same spot all day, it wouldn't even MOVE an inch. When I would pick it up, it was VERY lethargic and cold to the touch. I think he was just exploring his container anyway, as today with the temps warm (mid 80's high side, and low 70's cool side), he seemed to find a spot he likes and just hang there now. Another thing is that I have flat bark pieces that are more than large enough for him to elevate himself off of the hotter floor and cool off. The temps on those are in the 60's. PLENTY of room for him to thermal regulate (36"/18" floor).

On the hot side of the tank with the light on it was in the mid 90's. Now with only the UTH it is about 86-88* on top of the substrate, and a little hotter underneath (about 90*).

I thought I would share my story in hopes it would make you feel better. I bought my Western Hognose snake in July of '07 (he was only 2 months old). He would not eat pinkies (even though the breeder said he would). Almost every advice I got online said to feed him toads or scent pinkies with tuna (the latter did not work). I did feed him toads and he ate (thank goodness). Keep in mind some breeders will not suggest this because live toads/frogs can carry diseases and make your snake sick. I felt it was feed him toads/frogs or let this expensive snake die.

October 31st - March 28th= he stopped eating completely. Keep in mind he was a baby. I was really worried, but after November, I couldn't find frogs/toads anyway because they were hibernating. I decided to leave "Baby hog" alone. I wouldn't pick him up, but watch to make sure he was still alive and keep his water bowl filled. He had a heat pad with a red heat lamp on one side of the cage, but chose to stay on the colder side of the cage instead. He wanted to brumate/hibernate. I left him alone.

March 29th (today)- he finslly ate a toad (after 5 months).

My advise is to do all the reseach you can and really listen to what people have to say. I would have force fed him a pinkie (which would have been a major mistake) if I wouldn't have researched first. Don't worry if he doesn't eat when you first get him. he's getting use to his new enviornment and forcing him to eat will make him mad...in turn, he won't want to eat. If he looks healthy and isn't loosing weight or looking like he's gasping for air, let him be. DON'T PANIC..like I almost did. Get all the advise you can and please don't force feed him/her. It's really hard on the snake and a really, really cruel thing to do.

I wanted to update. He's been eating like a PIG! I let him go, and a couple days after my last post his eyes went milky. He shed a couple days later and I waited another couple days and tried to feed him. He took the fuzzy and has been eating ravenous ever since! I'll get some pics of him up in a couple days. I don't want to bother him as he just ate again today. Thanks guys!