Reptile & Amphibian Forums

A bunch of folks are asking about no sub incubation and perlite in the various threads below. I just wanted to remind folks to be sure they find and use PLAIN perlite. The last few times I've looked at Lowes, HomeDepot, etc., all they had was the Miracle Grow brand perlite (it is loaded with various fertilizers). I would NOT use this stuff. Be careful what you get...

I have some Miracle Gro brand perlite. I just read the bag and it says sterile, non toxic and i cant find anywhere where it says it has fertilizers in it.

I'm not sure, but I don't think Miracle Grow makes a perlite without fertilzer. Check the ingrediants. Somewhere it should talk about phosphorus, nitrogen, etc (with percentages given). I'll do a little digging on the internet.

I found the label for MG perlite on line (I'll link it below). It very definitely has fertilzers. Look at the box on the lower right of the back of the packaging under "easy to use instructions". It lists the different components. Now, they are in relatively small amounts, but I wouldn't chance it.

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MG perlite label

enriched with Miracle Grow plant food...

I believe it also says NON-TOXIC and STERILE. If you can eat it I doubt it will hurt your snake eggs....if anything it will make them grow faster

Good heads up but I don't think it's something to get in a panic about or a reason not to use it.

My 2 cents.
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John Dague
M.W. Reptiles
www.mwreptiles.com

yeah...lots of things are non toxic, but you wouldn't want to exposed devloping embryos to them. Safe and non toxic to a human does not necessarily mean safe and non toxic to a python egg. It may very well be fine, but why chance it when you can simply get a "non" enhanced variety made by someone else.

I understand that things non-toxic to one species might be toxic to another. I guess I just think that there should be a bit more info gathered before a public service anouncement is issued.

Something listed as non-toxic and sterile on the package that will be used as a incubation medium that does not touch the eggs seems, at least at first glance, to be a non-issue.

Some questions should probably be asked or answered for people before they run out and buy new bags of perilite or swap out their already incubating clutches.

Are the ingredients toxic to reptiles?
Are their levels harmful to reptiles when mixed with water?
Are the ingredients dispersed into the air or do they stay within the medium mixture?

And others I'm probably missing.

While the safest approach would seemingly be to not use it I don't think at this point we have enough info to say it's a life or death situation for a clutch of BP eggs. If this is an older product maybe there are other breeders that have used it in previous years?

Any other facts or other info would be appreciated.
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John Dague
M.W. Reptiles
www.mwreptiles.com

The ingredients in fertilizer are very similar to what gets on the eggs in the wild....

Namely fecal matter, urates, soil, etc.

My guess would be the eggs can probably stand some of the same stuff in captivity.
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John Dague
M.W. Reptiles
www.mwreptiles.com

Hatched out 30 eggs. The 8 snakes I still have that I held back are doing just fine, and always have been. They're 10 months old now and not one is under 600 grams, with the biggest pushing 800. So I'd say it's totally harmless. Sorry.

see......the Miracle Grow formula in it made your snake grow to 800 grams while other people's 07's are around 400 grams....it does work....

make a commercial?...

......I would read the label......

and for all you all........go to a place that sells bricks and blocks and building supplies and ask for "block fill" .......you may get a huge bag that will last forever...but you will not run out fast.....

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You try to do a good thing and warn people and everyone jumps down your throat with examples of how they do it. I tell all of my customers to use Perlite for both Leopard Gecko eggs and Ball Python eggs but not to use the Miracle-Gro brand. I don’t worry about the fertilizers being toxic, I worry about the mold they can cause. Not to mention the fact it is five times as expensive as Horticultural grade.

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Albey Scholl
Albeys Too Cool Reptiles
Email Me

I personally would not take a chance it ,we don’t know if there are any long lasting effects that we are not aware of so why rock the boat . If it ant broke don’t fix it .David

"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open mouth and remove any doubt!"

Great input Albey. I hadn't considered the mold.

My appologies if I came across as "jumping down someone's throat" I just like to have a little more info about the reasoning behind why TO or NOT TO do something. Alot of misinformation is spread with little or no knowledge of the facts. (of all people herpers know this first hand)

Like I said the safest approach is obviously to not use miracle grow and avoid the risk. I don't know that we have a conclusive argument that it's a life or death situation for the eggs but better to err on the side of caution if it's an easy fix. If it ain't broke don't fix it.....mircle grow or not.

Best of luck,
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John Dague
M.W. Reptiles
www.mwreptiles.com