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Did you do your part? Did YOU ?

boaphile Apr 30, 2008 12:47 PM

Note: Cross posted with the permission of Kingsnake:

Did you do your responsibility and respond to the inquiry sent
out on the federal register regarding the "Injurious Wildlife Species;
Review of Information Concerning Constrictor Snakes From Python, Boa, and
Eunectes genera," dated 31 January 2008?

Did you? Today is the final day. To date only about 1200 have responded.
This is a pathetic percentage of the people involved in our business. I know
this is a minimal percentage of the people involved, because I have more
than twice this many customers who have made purchases from me. I'm sure
TONS of people involved in this enterprise have never purchased anything
from me.

This particular first step at limiting our ability to keep, breed and sell
Boas and Pythons is almost certainly doomed to failure. At least this first
battle that is. But what many of you apparently do not get is this
IS a shot across the bow. This is a way for those intent on
bringing this hobby down to see what they are up against. And the fact that
most of you sat back and did absolutely nothing, gives them encouragement
and shows the government who is going to be harmed and or offended by making
any changes to our ability to keep, breed and sell our Boas and Pythons.

The animal rights nuts are not going away. They are only going to position
themselves so their attempts are as effective as possible. They do not have
a leg to stand on when it comes to the science. However, they have willing
accomplices to lie and deceive. They have come to ridiculous anti-scientific
conclusions as is evidenced by the maps that Gordon Rodda and his cartoonist
friends came up with. The Burmese Pythons now thriving in the Everglades,
have not and will not even make it out of the state of Florida. They are not
adapted to environments other than what they can find in the Everglades.
Northern Florida is just too cold in the winter time. They will not move
North without dying of respiratory problems. This is easy to scientifically
prove and thankfully we have legit scientist types working on this issue on
our behalf. A bit more than a week ago the Washington Post ran an article,
on the front page, that was devoid of scientific facts and
loaded with propaganda to scare the masses. This is a topic perfectly
tailored for prime time. It is incumbent on each and every one of us to do
what we can. However, this is essentially a political fight that will be
fought on many fronts. The Scientific battle is perhaps the easiest one in
my estimation and we will win. However, this is not going to come down to
calm heads looking at the facts and coming to a logical conclusion. This is
far more than that. The public relations tug of war is one heavily weighed
against us already. There is a giant on the other side with that robe tied
around his massive waist, and it's going to take not only our scientific
contributors, but a concerted effort to educate the public about the reality
of what we do. Ideally we need a much more visible presence of what we do in
a positive light. Plus we need each and every one of us to participate in
every specific part of this engagement. This is your responsibility.
Yours and mine!

The political portion of this fight is what DEMANDS YOUR
participation! We and YOU must be active in our efforts to prevent any
limitation of our ability to keep, breed and sell these animals. This will
not just take care of itself. This effort will be stronger WITH
YOUR
participation and support than it will without it. I personally
have already spent a great deal of effort and money getting geared up to
make a difference. Many have made far more of a specific contribution in
time and money to fighting this fight than I have. There is going to be a
greater effort, the specifics of which will be forthcoming very shortly. We
are ALL in this together. We need every singe individual to participate at
some level.

I personally would like to extend my gratitude to the following who have
made tremendous efforts above and far beyond the call of duty on our behalf.
Bob Ashley, David and Tracy Barker, Jeff Barringer, Bill Brandt, Brian
Potter, Louis Sangermano, Andrew Wyatt and PIJAC. I would also like to
thank each individual who had a part if the meeting in Chicago where the
start of a movement to help protect each of us occurred about a month ago. I
perceive those folks and each person who responds to the Inquiry as having
done me and my family a personal favor and as such, I am grateful. Thank
you. Most people are not aware of what is being done on the behalf of each
and every one of us. Your participation is not only needed, but in my view,
something each one should feel a compelling obligation to engage in.

Jeff Barringer has put together a great detailed instructional page on how
to respond. Please, please please do this. Yes, it will take some time and
effort to digest and complete. But each one must do their part. This is the
earliest stages of a struggle that is not going to go away. We must be
conscience of this fact and do the right thing. This is exactly the same as
ignoring mites you find in one cage. Sure it's not a problem really, right?
But mark my words, if we do not mount an effort to protect ourselves, we
will not be protected. Sure it may take a long time for this to happen, but
we need to stop this in it's tracks in exactly the same way as you can't let
mites get out of hand. The sky is not falling today. I am not trying to be
an alarmist about this. However, each of us make sure it doesn't.

The following is a link to the detailed instructions that kingsnake.com has
posted which PIJAC has written for each one of us:

Kingsnake
Instructions for a reply to Fish and Wildlife

There is strength in numbers. If you have not completed the survey or sent
your information previously to PIJAC as I did, please please please do
this today.

Jeff Ronne Sr.

Edited on April 30, 2008 at 14:43:39 by PHGinger.

Replies (24)

Tracy Barker Apr 30, 2008 12:56 PM

I can only echo what Jeff has said that everyone needs to write these letters! Jeff B has announced this daily and there has been a good amount of effort put forth by a lot of people to get the information out there! Please click on the kingsnake links, or on the link below to get the info you need to get this done today! Thanks to all for getting the message out there. Tracy and Dave
NOI info

Tracy Barker Apr 30, 2008 08:40 PM

Please be aware THIS DOES NOT only AFFECT "Big" pythons and boas! Ball pythons are included in this NOI. Additional papers citing carpet pythons, green tree pythons, rainbow boas etc have been published proposing them as "potential" invasive species thus candidates for this type of listing. Even if you just work with Colubrids, native species, are prime targets for increased regulation. Thanks to all for getting the message out there. Tracy and Dave

rainbowsrus Apr 30, 2008 12:59 PM

done that and will continue to throw my measly two cents in wherever I can!!!!!!

My two cents by themselves will NOT have a significant impact. What can you get for two cents any ways. HOWEVER, when combinied with many other peoples two cents, we can make dollars!! MANY dollars and THAT can make a significant impact.

DO NOT think your two cents are worthless, they are what they are and our herping community NEEDS THEM to be combined with all the other cents to knock some sense into the people making the laws.

Please respond TODAY!!!!!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

kcpits Apr 30, 2008 01:04 PM

I did and always will!!
Joel Thomas

lateralis Apr 30, 2008 01:19 PM

I sure did, and I only breed Womas on occassion...

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Cheers
Lateralis
"I would rather be precisely wrong than approximately right"
Marion "Doc" Ford

SRX Apr 30, 2008 01:44 PM

Just thought you may find this a little enlightening. There are alot of others that are filling out this inquiry as well...
Mirror Image

SRX Apr 30, 2008 01:47 PM
DEldien Apr 30, 2008 02:13 PM

I submitted mine and I hope everyone takes this seriously and does the same.

Keep in mind that there are groups out there with thousands of members who are taking advantage of this opportunity and they are flooding the USFW with comments in support of adding the snakes listed on the NOI to the Injurious Wildlife List.

Dave
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PIJAC Member

DEldien Apr 30, 2008 02:18 PM

If you post in other categories in the forums spread the word. Every single comment counts!!

Dave
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PIJAC Member

BoidaeAddiction Apr 30, 2008 02:48 PM

.

LarM Apr 30, 2008 03:07 PM

Thanks for posting this Information Jeff. It appears
as though only a small fraction of those who own any or
all of genera "Python, Boa and Eunectes" care enough
to submit any information.Jeff,even if you would have made
this post two or three weeks ago.I don't think it would
have made a diference.Its my belief avidently most people
think "someone else will take care of this,I don't have to do anything".
Although when the time comes that our beloved
Python, Boa and Eunectes genera are taken or limited rights to them
are imposed.Then we'll hear all sorts of jumping up and down and yelling.
People need to do their part.I only hope I was able to do enough at this point,
by submitting my information.Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz

STUART Apr 30, 2008 03:08 PM

Today! Hope it helps. I'm not really sure they care about what we think, but have to do it any way right?!
Pythons.Net

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Pythons.Net

boaphile Apr 30, 2008 03:11 PM

We need everyone who hasn't to do so today! That's the reason for this thread!

Do it now!
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Boaphile Home
All Original/Boaphile Plastics
The Boa Network

madisonrecords Apr 30, 2008 03:17 PM

I have allot of friends and aquatances in this Hobby and I will tell you what I am hearing from some and I have often felt the same way. Without going into a long and rediculous spill, I am the first one in line to feel angry when I wake up every day and see that the government has once again " chipped something else as far as my rights away from me. " However, it seems that even though we may convince our little sheep minds that we have a voice and can stop them, we still usually stand as too little too late and they usually already have their minds made up from the beginning and nothing we say as a minority is going to change it, even though they try to make us feel like we indeed have a voice and stand a chance. So, why are more not contributing to the cause? Is it because they do not care? Is it because they love the vaseline sensation, brought to us by our government? Is it because they are too busy going through the Fast Food Drive Thru and trying to get home in time to not miss the next episode of their favorite Reality T.V. Show and sit in front of the box of oblivion with drool running out of the corner of their mouths, while their pineal gland closes off even more to the point of not just being a sheep, but a Robot Sheep? Well, maybe a combination of all of those wonderful things and also the fact that many that I have talked too have wondered if all of these wonderful and heart felt responses that are being sent in to them, are just a way for them to refer to a list once the Law is put into order and know were to find us? If this goes through; " The Big Time Breeder " that is all over the internet and has websites and a huge facility in his back yard, " is up the creek from the beginning and they KNOW WHO YOU ARE. " However, they have no idea how to find all of the guys that have a dozen snakes that live here and there, but if they all send in their info, it will not be hard at that point to find them. This means every bit as much too the small time guy and gal as it does to the big timers. The big timers have more to loose, but they are already overexposed. The small time guy " wich represents the bigger part of this Hobby, WAY BIGGER " just wants to keep things under his hat and does not want any police raids at the trailer park, that is not of typical nature. This is a terrible thing,but in the end " the above mentioned things and FEAR FEAR FEAR and DIVISION DIVISION DIVISION, will seemingly always keep this country and the world from doing the right thing for our freedoms! " This may make some of you upset " that is not my intention and I have played nice around here for a long time now, " but if you search your hearts, you will find truth in this post. So, what is the answer? If we all search our hearts and educate ourselves too what is really going on, we know what the answer is, but it is one that I probably not post here, without it being erased. God, if I would have known as a young person the things I know now. That however, does not matter, but what we do NOW, matters more than ever...........John J

natsamjosh Apr 30, 2008 03:47 PM

.. it will do any good. I also contacted several TV shows and politicians, asking them to address this USGS corruption and violation of public trust. No one seemed interested.

While I greatly appreciate all the effort and research folks have done, and their intentions are noble, I also don't quite understand why anyone expects the same government agency (ie, Dept. of Interior) that allowed for the publishing of the insanely ridiculous range map in the first place would be interested in logic, reason and science (ie, our responses.)

This is a losing battle unless we get some politicians and/or big name media coverage to expose this movement for what it is. This USGS map thing is an egregious violation of public trust from those who work for us, and it should be punished.

Thanks,
Ed

Warren_Booth Apr 30, 2008 03:57 PM

Done.
-----
Dr Warren Booth
North Carolina State University
Department of Entomology
3309 Gardner Hall
Raleigh, NC 27695-7613

bobclark Apr 30, 2008 04:21 PM

Please give some thought to your comment. Many of our people have said things along the lines of "please don't take my snake, he's a good snake". Its important to mention question the ability of pythons and boas to live in temperate climates. The natural range of Boa constrictor comes to within 100 miles of the southern US border. Why didn't they go all the way to Colorado? They've certainly had enough time to make the move. Why haven't Burmese pythons moved into the subtropical and temperate areas adjacent to their current range? Why don't they already live in half of China? Many factors determine where animals live not just temperature.

Most of the data Rodda used when determining temperature tolerances of Burmese pythons was actually taken from the Indian Python in southern Pakistan. The Indian python is an endangered species and is not represented at all in the pet trade. Burmese pythons don't live in areas that freeze.

Rodda told me that Burmese pythons will hibernate in cold climates. He has no data to support this position. In temperate climates would the warm season be long enough for the snakes to complete their breeding cycle? Rodda claims the snakes could establish populations in places like Oklahoma and Virgina. If they survived the winter I doubt they could reproduce. He says they are "highly adaptable". What's the basis for this statement?

Read the comments. There are many people against us. There is a link from the front page of the Humane Society's website to the comment page. These people have flooded the system with their comments. Most of them think no one should keep a snake for a pet. They say captive snakes are mistreated and snakes deserve to be free! This has nothing to do with the information that USFWS is seeking but that didn't keep hundreds of their people from commenting.

Anyway, do what you can do. Do it today.

kareo Apr 30, 2008 04:41 PM

Did it!
-----
Kare

"keep smiling; it makes people wonder what you're up to!" :D

geckomill Apr 30, 2008 05:47 PM

man i type slow but there it went

KevMadden Apr 30, 2008 05:56 PM

np

ABCC Apr 30, 2008 08:23 PM

Bcc

wstreps Apr 30, 2008 08:59 PM

Up until now wildlife regulations at the Federal level have been pretty lenient. As
I've said in the past this not their doing. Florida along with California have been ground zero for anti ownership groups. This situation with the burms and the Glades was the chance they have been waiting for.

Number one it cost them no money to come after us. It's also very easy to get political backing something the animal industry is very much lacking. Does anyone know of any senators that have submitted letters on our behalf ? How about other political figures ? How many of these guys are on our side ? Is there a single reptile business or society that receives major corporation funding ? How about the media ? News papers , TV etc. Comedy Central alone donates hundreds of thousands of dollars every year to Peta , not to mention the hundreds of other media outlets animal right groups have formed tight bonds with. They do not have this type of support by accident.

I often hear people refer to Peta for example as animal rights nuts. The reality is the person who throws goat blood on somebody's mink coat is a nut. The people that pull the strings are intelligent extremely well organized individuals that are very goal oriented. Motivated . At this point do we have much more then our passion to fight with ? In the past the reptile field has been attacked pretty hard on a few occasions and has come out alright but at some point maybe very soon push just might come to shove.

Guys like Skip Snow and Gordon Rodda already made their minds up the moment they got the call. Does anyone really believe the Rodda map was the product of not understanding, a mistake ? Does anyone really believe Rodda even gives a crap about Burmese pythons at all ? This clown has a long standing affiliation with the Sierra Club one of Petas closest allies. What he got out of this was a chance to kill two birds with one stone. Overall what he accomplished was making a fool out of himself by trying to use a giant snake invasion to get the Sierra Clubs Global warming message some free press. Skip Snow was called in as the everglades specialist. I'll just say this was not an accidental choice and Kingsnake TOS will not allow me to express my opinion of this guy. While Rodda failed miserably on a scientific level he may have succeeded somewhat at the street level. Snows contribution based on his wanting to milk this for everything he can has been very detrimental.

Like I said right now it appears passion for what we do is about all we have going for us. It might be enough , this time. Who knows what will happen behind closed doors. When it comes to long range goals we will defiantly need more then that. I just hope people understand the full scope of what's going on. This go's way past just Burmese pythons.

Ernie Eison
Westwoodreptiles.com

ajfreptiles Apr 30, 2008 11:57 PM

I posted my letter as well. I had to at least do what I could!

I really hope this gets squashed....somehow.

Andy
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AbsoluteApril May 01, 2008 10:16 AM

>>>>
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'There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."' -Rainshadow

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