Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I've been thinking alot lately about what to breed. Right now I've bee thinking abot rat snakes, BRBs, bearded dragons, and leopard geckos.

Trouble is, I love beardies and leos seem cool, but they're sooooo popular I don't want to be just like every other herp breeder out there.

I love rat snakes too, expecially black rats, but selling them wouldn't be easy.

BRBs are gorgeous, but the excitement I got from viewing them just isn't there anymore.

HELLLLLLLLP! I want to breed what I love, but make some good profit as well!
-----
Scott

Reptiles
--------
1 Colombian Rainbow Boa (Rocky)
1.0 Ball Python (Sultan)
0.1 California Kingsnake (Leota)
1.0 Eastern Painted Turtle (Yugi)
0.1 Red/Gold Bearded Dragon* (Irwin, R.I.P.)

Other
-----
1.0 Betta Fish (Tyrone)
1.0 Hooded Rat* (Clubber, R.I.P.)
0.1 Albino Rat (Isis)

Does it have to be about what you can profit from? If that's the main focus of your breeding program, I guess I'm kinda glad you've lost the spark for BRB. If you're trying to make a living off of your snakes, BRB probably arent your bag anyway, they take too long to reproduce.

There are some fascinating ratsnakes, I dig the Asian rats myself, but there are some neat things being done with the others. There are also some really pretty garters if you want to do something uncommon. Some of the larger geckos are pretty neat too, I've always liked the tokays and the gargoyles look neat too.

admit I have been keeping these Herptiles for decades before I even considered it.

But if one can make ANY profit of their hobby well that's a good thing in my opinion.

If it's the sole reason then so be it. But with that attitude the hobby usually BITES YOU ON THE A$$.

ALL these breeders say they the same crap...they are more then hoping to make a profit from their animals and consider it an investment in their monetary future (yes doing something they love)

Someone in college with little time is not going to be paying his bills selling rat snakes for sure.

But it will make his time in existence more fun IMO.

I used to love going to shows and selling my "wares".

I haven't done that since 2003. But it was fun to have people eye balling my stuff and telling me how nice they are and yep some even bought some from me (hehe)

More of an ego booster then a profit maker for me.

and it puts dinner on the table...not mine theirs..earn your keep [bleep]es...I put mine on the table working for Costco.

Currently I pay for both but hope to have the little buggers earning their keep again!!!!
-----
=========================================================
Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
=========================================================
Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

Breed what you'd like to keep, hold back the best of the best and raise those up to breed as well. Most of us (myself included)_ have not turned a profit doing this, only offset our costs and increased our collections.

The only way you're going to turn a profit is to either have something unique that everyone wants and is willing to pay a premium for - or produce volumes!! Each animal you own adds to your base line expenses and will have to add babies to your ultimate production to pay for itself. For example, for the rodent colony that feeds the snakes, I just ordered rodent food to the tune of $480 today! That is a lot of rodent food and geting a great price and will last me a long time. BUT, it's still $480 out of pocket that is one expense my collection is costing me. That's about 3 or 4 baby BRB's I need to produce and sell to make up that one single expense. Also about time to order another pallet of bedding ($400), another 3 or 4 baby BRB's gone to expenses.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

>>Breed what you'd like to keep, hold back the best of the best and raise those up to breed as well. Most of us (myself included)_ have not turned a profit doing this, only offset our costs and increased our collections.
>>
>>The only way you're going to turn a profit is to either have something unique that everyone wants and is willing to pay a premium for - or produce volumes!! Each animal you own adds to your base line expenses and will have to add babies to your ultimate production to pay for itself. For example, for the rodent colony that feeds the snakes, I just ordered rodent food to the tune of $480 today! That is a lot of rodent food and geting a great price and will last me a long time. BUT, it's still $480 out of pocket that is one expense my collection is costing me. That's about 3 or 4 baby BRB's I need to produce and sell to make up that one single expense. Also about time to order another pallet of bedding ($400), another 3 or 4 baby BRB's gone to expenses.
>>-----
>>Thanks,
>>
>>
>>Dave Colling
>>
>>www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com
>>
>>
>>
>>0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
>>0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)
>>
>>LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
>>26.49 BRB
>>20.21 BCI
>>And those are only the breeders
>>
>>lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats
-----
=========================================================
Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
=========================================================
Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

Good profit, ehh??
....None of the animals on your short list will give you a GOOD profit. You have already figured out that Black Ratsnakes are difficult to sell. (Actually they would be easy to sell wholesale if you priced them way below what they would cost to produce). Normal beardies and Leopard geckos are really neat and babies are in big demand (at very low prices) but producing them can be labor intensive and you would need a very big cost efficient operation to make money on them. BRBs will cost you more to get enough stock and will be tougher to reproduce and so they are not usually considered a profitable snake. If you really want to make a profit you need to get in on the ground floor of the newest hottest morph and get babies produced and to market as soon as possible. Plan on spending $30K to get in on the ground floor of the best morph. If you have never produced babies from the species you pick this is a VERY big risk to take. Lose animals along the way and your investment is lost. Produce babies a couple years after everybody else and prices will be too low to make up what you spent on the intitial breeding stock. There have been a bunch of people who did not have any experience breeding Ball Pythons but spent a lot of money only to find out that breeding snakes is tougher than they thought. Lots of money has been lost. Rather than thinking about making a profit think about advancing your knowledge base as much as possible. Breed all of the animals on your list solely for the experience of breeding them so that if and when you are ready to spend real money on a profitable snake breeding project you will not be taking such a big risk.
...I really do not breed these snakes for profit. I put a lot of time into my animals and get a pretty lousy return on my investment of time and money. I do breed them solely because I just love seeing a litter of new babies and raising them up. Most importantly I learn as I go along in this.
Jeff

>>I've been thinking alot lately about what to breed. Right now I've bee thinking abot rat snakes, BRBs, bearded dragons, and leopard geckos.
>>
>>Trouble is, I love beardies and leos seem cool, but they're sooooo popular I don't want to be just like every other herp breeder out there.
>>
>>I love rat snakes too, expecially black rats, but selling them wouldn't be easy.
>>
>>BRBs are gorgeous, but the excitement I got from viewing them just isn't there anymore.
>>
>>HELLLLLLLLP! I want to breed what I love, but make some good profit as well!
>>-----
>>Scott
>>
>>Reptiles
>>--------
>>1 Colombian Rainbow Boa (Rocky)
>>1.0 Ball Python (Sultan)
>>0.1 California Kingsnake (Leota)
>>1.0 Eastern Painted Turtle (Yugi)
>>0.1 Red/Gold Bearded Dragon* (Irwin, R.I.P.)
>>
>>Other
>>-----
>>1.0 Betta Fish (Tyrone)
>>1.0 Hooded Rat* (Clubber, R.I.P.)
>>0.1 Albino Rat (Isis)

...just part of it is. I'm a college student. I could use some money. Right now I'm waiting for my madagascar hissing cockroaches to drop their "litters" so I can sell some off.

I love reptiles so much....I really want to breed but have always had trouble deciding what. Right now I'm leaning towards black rats. Their impressive size and calm demeanor are appealing to me, and they have albinos and whitewalls out there too.
-----
Scott

Reptiles
--------
1 Colombian Rainbow Boa (Rocky)
1.0 Ball Python (Sultan)
0.1 California Kingsnake (Leota)
1.0 Eastern Painted Turtle (Yugi)
0.1 Red/Gold Bearded Dragon* (Irwin, R.I.P.)

Other
-----
1.0 Betta Fish (Tyrone)
1.0 Hooded Rat* (Clubber, R.I.P.)
0.1 Albino Rat (Isis)

Always breed what you love. I'm just starting out, but I can already see that it is a TON of work to make sure all of my kids are happy and healthy. Don't get me wrong, I'm happiest when my head is in a snake cage... even when it's just to clean up after them. If I did not have this affinity for them, I'd resent them by now. I don't know how many you plan to breed, a pair or a colony, but it's work. And don't discount the cost of the vet when one of your gals has some kind of birthing problem. I had a leopard gecko (I paid $20 for) go eggbound on me a couple weeks ago and had to pay $500 for her to have surgery. Yes, there's a potential to make money, but it's not that great of a potential. And I understand the desperate need to at least make your money back, I'm in grad school... and still paying that tuition! So I really do feel ya! Good Luck in whatever pursuit you choose! and give us an update when you get that first pair!

Oh, and a suggestion, if you like rats, why not breed Lucy's. I love those!! SO PERTY! You could get a pair of black and a pair of whites... lol! Sorry, I can act about 5 years old sometimes

I can relate in so far as having the snake pay for it's own upkeep eventually but thats about it. I made the rule, when I got back into reptiles, that I would not get a pet that could not potentially pay for it's own upkeep down the road. The only exception I have made to that is the pacific gopher project I am starting.

That being said if net profit is your goal then you will eventually tire of, or come to hate, your reptiles. The best course really is to breed what you like most currently. If your interest changes down the road you can always sell established breeders to someone who is more interested in the species. Also as was suggested, if you have the cash, you could try to breed all of the species on your list for the experience.

Sean.
-----
1.1 BRB
1.1 Triple Het TPRS's
0.1 Silver TPRS
1.1 Amel Bloodred Corns
0.1 Abbott Okeetee Corn
0.1 Blizzard Bloodred Corn
1.1 Thayeri Kingsnakes
0.1 Reeve's Turtle
0.2 Amstaff's
1.0 Pudytat

We have a 5 footer at work. He's so calm I love him. My friend just had him out a few wees ago and he was all stretched out on a counter, resting his head on her lap. I thought to myslef "Man, that'd be a cool snake to keep and breed" and now I'm wanting to breed black rats.....AGAIN. They've been a common recurrence in my life lol. It started with getting bit by a 4 footer, then i was hooked.
-----
Scott

Reptiles
--------
1 Colombian Rainbow Boa (Rocky)
1.0 Ball Python (Sultan)
0.1 California Kingsnake (Leota)
1.0 Eastern Painted Turtle (Yugi)
0.1 Red/Gold Bearded Dragon* (Irwin, R.I.P.)

Other
-----
1.0 Betta Fish (Tyrone)
1.0 Hooded Rat* (Clubber, R.I.P.)
0.1 Albino Rat (Isis)

Then there's your answer... breed the black rat snakes!

They really are interesting snakes. I have caught and released several of them while hiking in the mountins the last few years. Each time I think they would be neat to keep. Thogu, I cannot keep them here in Georgia.

>>Then there's your answer... breed the black rat snakes!

...hmmmm....regulars? Albinos? Are there lucy black rats too?
-----
Scott

Reptiles
--------
1 Colombian Rainbow Boa (Rocky)
1.0 Ball Python (Sultan)
0.1 California Kingsnake (Leota)
1.0 Eastern Painted Turtle (Yugi)
0.1 Red/Gold Bearded Dragon* (Irwin, R.I.P.)

Other
-----
1.0 Betta Fish (Tyrone)
1.0 Hooded Rat* (Clubber, R.I.P.)
0.1 Albino Rat (Isis)

....
Leucy
Rusty
Grape
Whitesided
Brindle
Sunglow
Lavender(Hypo)
T plus Albino
T minus Albino
Striped
Patternless
Lemon
Calico
Anery(aparently as there are snow BR's)

Along with many combinations of the above

You might also find this posting of interest
http://forums.kingsnake.com/view.php?id=1465934,1465934

Sean.
-----
1.1 BRB
1.1 Triple Het TPRS's
0.1 Silver TPRS
1.1 Amel Bloodred Corns
0.1 Abbott Okeetee Corn
0.1 Blizzard Bloodred Corn
1.1 Thayeri Kingsnakes
0.1 Reeve's Turtle
0.2 Amstaff's
1.0 Pudytat

Rat snakes just happen to be my favorite animals. I have bred and kept MANY American rat snake species. All VERY easy to breed and some very TESTE in nature if you don't work with them. All my Texas rats have mellowed and the babies from them seem to carry their more pleasant disposition. For Lucy Black Rats try Don Soderberg

He seems to have VERY nice animals to choose from.

(I realy believe these snakes are more generic then people say and breed them that way but hey)

Here is some of my Rat snakes I work with or have worked with...

All posted pics are in my current bloodlines but actual snakes may no longer be...I have both pure texas bloodlines and also generic bloodlines as well.

While they may not sell for much rat snakes are very fun to work with but all are MIXED as far as I am concerned. Plus all the anomalies are mixed within the American Rat Snake Clade. I call them ALL "generic" no matter what claims people are making.

I do keep separate bloodlines. But my personal opinion is that all obsoleta in this hobby are color pattern variants of the same snake. Which would be the Black Rat Snake.

-----
=========================================================
Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
=========================================================
Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

Good lines of Black Pines & Northen Pines sell very well as neonates.

I have Lemke Black Pines and a diverse Northern Pine Bloodline as well. People love my snakes and are eager/waiting for babies.

>>Rat snakes just happen to be my favorite animals. I have bred and kept MANY American rat snake species. All VERY easy to breed and some very TESTE in nature if you don't work with them. All my Texas rats have mellowed and the babies from them seem to carry their more pleasant disposition. For Lucy Black Rats try Don Soderberg
>>
>>He seems to have VERY nice animals to choose from.
>>
>>
>>(I realy believe these snakes are more generic then people say and breed them that way but hey)
>>
>>Here is some of my Rat snakes I work with or have worked with...
>>
>>All posted pics are in my current bloodlines but actual snakes may no longer be...I have both pure texas bloodlines and also generic bloodlines as well.
>>
>>While they may not sell for much rat snakes are very fun to work with but all are MIXED as far as I am concerned. Plus all the anomalies are mixed within the American Rat Snake Clade. I call them ALL "generic" no matter what claims people are making.
>>
>>I do keep separate bloodlines. But my personal opinion is that all obsoleta in this hobby are color pattern variants of the same snake. Which would be the Black Rat Snake.
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>>-----
>>=========================================================
>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>=========================================================
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Frank Roberts
>>
>>
>>
>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.
-----
=========================================================
Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
=========================================================
Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

Not to be a stick-in-the-mud, but since the discussion is about making money, keep in mind Frank has been doing this for many years and probably has a reputation and a following of eager customers. Someone just starting out has to compete with people like Frank, as well as pay for marketing, advertising, shmoozing on forums, etc. One thing many people seem to forget that time is money.

Okay, enough preaching. Rat snakes are awesome. One of my favorite snakes ever was a big, ole yellow rat snake I caught down in Florida. Tried to take my head off when I first caught him, but tamed down within an hour. Don't think he ever tried to bite after that.

Thanks,
Ed

>>Good lines of Black Pines & Northen Pines sell very well as neonates.
>>
>>I have Lemke Black Pines and a diverse Northern Pine Bloodline as well. People love my snakes and are eager/waiting for babies.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>>Rat snakes just happen to be my favorite animals. I have bred and kept MANY American rat snake species. All VERY easy to breed and some very TESTE in nature if you don't work with them. All my Texas rats have mellowed and the babies from them seem to carry their more pleasant disposition. For Lucy Black Rats try Don Soderberg
>>>>
>>>>He seems to have VERY nice animals to choose from.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>(I realy believe these snakes are more generic then people say and breed them that way but hey)
>>>>
>>>>Here is some of my Rat snakes I work with or have worked with...
>>>>
>>>>All posted pics are in my current bloodlines but actual snakes may no longer be...I have both pure texas bloodlines and also generic bloodlines as well.
>>>>
>>>>While they may not sell for much rat snakes are very fun to work with but all are MIXED as far as I am concerned. Plus all the anomalies are mixed within the American Rat Snake Clade. I call them ALL "generic" no matter what claims people are making.
>>>>
>>>>I do keep separate bloodlines. But my personal opinion is that all obsoleta in this hobby are color pattern variants of the same snake. Which would be the Black Rat Snake.
>>>>
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>>>>-----
>>>>=========================================================
>>>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>>>=========================================================
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>
>>>>Frank Roberts
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.
>>-----
>>=========================================================
>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>=========================================================
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Frank Roberts
>>
>>
>>
>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

I have not been a business for many years and tech still am not.

I just bred my stuff got a table and sold my "wares". I usually hook up with a friend who is breeding. One friend Charles Juiliano used to sell Carnivorous Plants at the Hamburg Pennsylvania and Staten Island NY show. He made 100 times more cash doing that. Then people started trying to sell them. Difference being they where buying them and reselling. He propagates his own as a hobby along with reptiles and also excels at fish, he used to breed red bellied piranhas too.

Never spend a dime on advertising.

I used to always make my cash spent back though. Now I haven't done much in years. But will probably do so in future.

I have sold retics,brb's, and rat snakes at a few shows in the tri state area that's it. But it was easy to stand out at those shows because most people had wild caught (hamburg) or underfed snakes for sale with stuck sheds or made it obvious they where feeding them less with the thin but it has a lump so it's eating look I seem to run into at these shows.

>>Not to be a stick-in-the-mud, but since the discussion is about making money, keep in mind Frank has been doing this for many years and probably has a reputation and a following of eager customers. Someone just starting out has to compete with people like Frank, as well as pay for marketing, advertising, shmoozing on forums, etc. One thing many people seem to forget that time is money.
>>
>>Okay, enough preaching. Rat snakes are awesome. One of my favorite snakes ever was a big, ole yellow rat snake I caught down in Florida. Tried to take my head off when I first caught him, but tamed down within an hour. Don't think he ever tried to bite after that.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>Ed
>>
>>
>>>>Good lines of Black Pines & Northen Pines sell very well as neonates.
>>>>
>>>>I have Lemke Black Pines and a diverse Northern Pine Bloodline as well. People love my snakes and are eager/waiting for babies.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>Rat snakes just happen to be my favorite animals. I have bred and kept MANY American rat snake species. All VERY easy to breed and some very TESTE in nature if you don't work with them. All my Texas rats have mellowed and the babies from them seem to carry their more pleasant disposition. For Lucy Black Rats try Don Soderberg
>>>>>>
>>>>>>He seems to have VERY nice animals to choose from.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>(I realy believe these snakes are more generic then people say and breed them that way but hey)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Here is some of my Rat snakes I work with or have worked with...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>All posted pics are in my current bloodlines but actual snakes may no longer be...I have both pure texas bloodlines and also generic bloodlines as well.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>While they may not sell for much rat snakes are very fun to work with but all are MIXED as far as I am concerned. Plus all the anomalies are mixed within the American Rat Snake Clade. I call them ALL "generic" no matter what claims people are making.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I do keep separate bloodlines. But my personal opinion is that all obsoleta in this hobby are color pattern variants of the same snake. Which would be the Black Rat Snake.
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>-----
>>>>>>=========================================================
>>>>>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>>>>>=========================================================
>>>>>>Thanks,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Frank Roberts
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.
>>>>-----
>>>>=========================================================
>>>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>>>=========================================================
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>
>>>>Frank Roberts
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

-----
=========================================================
Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
=========================================================
Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

I thought about propagation of plants actually being more suitable for mass selling......always wanted a greenhouse. Recently bought my first carnivorous plants. Thy would go well with all the reptiles in the greenhouse! LOL

>>I have not been a business for many years and tech still am not.
>>
>>I just bred my stuff got a table and sold my "wares". I usually hook up with a friend who is breeding. One friend Charles Juiliano used to sell Carnivorous Plants at the Hamburg Pennsylvania and Staten Island NY show. He made 100 times more cash doing that. Then people started trying to sell them. Difference being they where buying them and reselling. He propagates his own as a hobby along with reptiles and also excels at fish, he used to breed red bellied piranhas too.
>>
>>Never spend a dime on advertising.
>>
>>I used to always make my cash spent back though. Now I haven't done much in years. But will probably do so in future.
>>
>>I have sold retics,brb's, and rat snakes at a few shows in the tri state area that's it. But it was easy to stand out at those shows because most people had wild caught (hamburg) or underfed snakes for sale with stuck sheds or made it obvious they where feeding them less with the thin but it has a lump so it's eating look I seem to run into at these shows.
>>
>>
>>
>>>>Not to be a stick-in-the-mud, but since the discussion is about making money, keep in mind Frank has been doing this for many years and probably has a reputation and a following of eager customers. Someone just starting out has to compete with people like Frank, as well as pay for marketing, advertising, shmoozing on forums, etc. One thing many people seem to forget that time is money.
>>>>
>>>>Okay, enough preaching. Rat snakes are awesome. One of my favorite snakes ever was a big, ole yellow rat snake I caught down in Florida. Tried to take my head off when I first caught him, but tamed down within an hour. Don't think he ever tried to bite after that.
>>>>
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>Ed
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>Good lines of Black Pines & Northen Pines sell very well as neonates.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I have Lemke Black Pines and a diverse Northern Pine Bloodline as well. People love my snakes and are eager/waiting for babies.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Rat snakes just happen to be my favorite animals. I have bred and kept MANY American rat snake species. All VERY easy to breed and some very TESTE in nature if you don't work with them. All my Texas rats have mellowed and the babies from them seem to carry their more pleasant disposition. For Lucy Black Rats try Don Soderberg
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>He seems to have VERY nice animals to choose from.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>(I realy believe these snakes are more generic then people say and breed them that way but hey)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Here is some of my Rat snakes I work with or have worked with...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>All posted pics are in my current bloodlines but actual snakes may no longer be...I have both pure texas bloodlines and also generic bloodlines as well.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>While they may not sell for much rat snakes are very fun to work with but all are MIXED as far as I am concerned. Plus all the anomalies are mixed within the American Rat Snake Clade. I call them ALL "generic" no matter what claims people are making.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I do keep separate bloodlines. But my personal opinion is that all obsoleta in this hobby are color pattern variants of the same snake. Which would be the Black Rat Snake.
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>-----
>>>>>>>>=========================================================
>>>>>>>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>>>>>>>=========================================================
>>>>>>>>Thanks,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Frank Roberts
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.
>>>>>>-----
>>>>>>=========================================================
>>>>>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>>>>>=========================================================
>>>>>>Thanks,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Frank Roberts
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.
>>
>>
>>-----
>>=========================================================
>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>=========================================================
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Frank Roberts
>>
>>
>>
>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

>>I thought about propagation of plants actually being more suitable for mass selling......always wanted a greenhouse. Recently bought my first carnivorous plants. Thy would go well with all the reptiles in the greenhouse! LOL
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>>I have not been a business for many years and tech still am not.
>>>>
>>>>I just bred my stuff got a table and sold my "wares". I usually hook up with a friend who is breeding. One friend Charles Juiliano used to sell Carnivorous Plants at the Hamburg Pennsylvania and Staten Island NY show. He made 100 times more cash doing that. Then people started trying to sell them. Difference being they where buying them and reselling. He propagates his own as a hobby along with reptiles and also excels at fish, he used to breed red bellied piranhas too.
>>>>
>>>>Never spend a dime on advertising.
>>>>
>>>>I used to always make my cash spent back though. Now I haven't done much in years. But will probably do so in future.
>>>>
>>>>I have sold retics,brb's, and rat snakes at a few shows in the tri state area that's it. But it was easy to stand out at those shows because most people had wild caught (hamburg) or underfed snakes for sale with stuck sheds or made it obvious they where feeding them less with the thin but it has a lump so it's eating look I seem to run into at these shows.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>Not to be a stick-in-the-mud, but since the discussion is about making money, keep in mind Frank has been doing this for many years and probably has a reputation and a following of eager customers. Someone just starting out has to compete with people like Frank, as well as pay for marketing, advertising, shmoozing on forums, etc. One thing many people seem to forget that time is money.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Okay, enough preaching. Rat snakes are awesome. One of my favorite snakes ever was a big, ole yellow rat snake I caught down in Florida. Tried to take my head off when I first caught him, but tamed down within an hour. Don't think he ever tried to bite after that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Thanks,
>>>>>>Ed
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Good lines of Black Pines & Northen Pines sell very well as neonates.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I have Lemke Black Pines and a diverse Northern Pine Bloodline as well. People love my snakes and are eager/waiting for babies.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Rat snakes just happen to be my favorite animals. I have bred and kept MANY American rat snake species. All VERY easy to breed and some very TESTE in nature if you don't work with them. All my Texas rats have mellowed and the babies from them seem to carry their more pleasant disposition. For Lucy Black Rats try Don Soderberg
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>He seems to have VERY nice animals to choose from.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>(I realy believe these snakes are more generic then people say and breed them that way but hey)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Here is some of my Rat snakes I work with or have worked with...
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>All posted pics are in my current bloodlines but actual snakes may no longer be...I have both pure texas bloodlines and also generic bloodlines as well.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>While they may not sell for much rat snakes are very fun to work with but all are MIXED as far as I am concerned. Plus all the anomalies are mixed within the American Rat Snake Clade. I call them ALL "generic" no matter what claims people are making.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>I do keep separate bloodlines. But my personal opinion is that all obsoleta in this hobby are color pattern variants of the same snake. Which would be the Black Rat Snake.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>-----
>>>>>>>>>>=========================================================
>>>>>>>>>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>>>>>>>>>=========================================================
>>>>>>>>>>Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Frank Roberts
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.
>>>>>>>>-----
>>>>>>>>=========================================================
>>>>>>>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>>>>>>>=========================================================
>>>>>>>>Thanks,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Frank Roberts
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>-----
>>>>=========================================================
>>>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>>>=========================================================
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>
>>>>Frank Roberts
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.
-----
=========================================================
Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
=========================================================
Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

...black pines are more expensive to acquire, and northern pines are threatened in NJ.
-----
Scott

Reptiles
--------
1 Colombian Rainbow Boa (Rocky)
1.0 Ball Python (Sultan)
0.1 California Kingsnake (Leota)
1.0 Eastern Painted Turtle (Yugi)
0.1 Red/Gold Bearded Dragon* (Irwin, R.I.P.)

Other
-----
1.0 Betta Fish (Tyrone)
1.0 Hooded Rat* (Clubber, R.I.P.)
0.1 Albino Rat (Isis)

I have Northern Pine snakes on my permit. (I live in NJ)

As long as you get from a breeder with a reciept they are currently allowable by law.

You better be able to prove it if they ask!!!

Only engangered species are illegal regardless of origin.

No they don't tell anyone that unless you ask lol.

>>...black pines are more expensive to acquire, and northern pines are threatened in NJ.
>>-----
>>Scott
>>
>>Reptiles
>>--------
>>1 Colombian Rainbow Boa (Rocky)
>>1.0 Ball Python (Sultan)
>>0.1 California Kingsnake (Leota)
>>1.0 Eastern Painted Turtle (Yugi)
>>0.1 Red/Gold Bearded Dragon* (Irwin, R.I.P.)
>>
>>Other
>>-----
>>1.0 Betta Fish (Tyrone)
>>1.0 Hooded Rat* (Clubber, R.I.P.)
>>0.1 Albino Rat (Isis)
-----
=========================================================
Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
=========================================================
Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

...the black rats? NJ laws are sooo confusing. Are black rats allowed? Collecting?

>>I have Northern Pine snakes on my permit. (I live in NJ)
>>
>>As long as you get from a breeder with a reciept they are currently allowable by law.
>>
>>You better be able to prove it if they ask!!!
>>
>>Only engangered species are illegal regardless of origin.
>>
>>No they don't tell anyone that unless you ask lol.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>>...black pines are more expensive to acquire, and northern pines are threatened in NJ.
>>>>-----
>>>>Scott
>>>>
>>>>Reptiles
>>>>--------
>>>>1 Colombian Rainbow Boa (Rocky)
>>>>1.0 Ball Python (Sultan)
>>>>0.1 California Kingsnake (Leota)
>>>>1.0 Eastern Painted Turtle (Yugi)
>>>>0.1 Red/Gold Bearded Dragon* (Irwin, R.I.P.)
>>>>
>>>>Other
>>>>-----
>>>>1.0 Betta Fish (Tyrone)
>>>>1.0 Hooded Rat* (Clubber, R.I.P.)
>>>>0.1 Albino Rat (Isis)
>>-----
>>=========================================================
>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>=========================================================
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Frank Roberts
>>
>>
>>
>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.
-----
Scott

Reptiles
--------
1 Colombian Rainbow Boa (Rocky)
1.0 Ball Python (Sultan)
0.1 California Kingsnake (Leota)
1.0 Eastern Painted Turtle (Yugi)
0.1 Red/Gold Bearded Dragon* (Irwin, R.I.P.)

Other
-----
1.0 Betta Fish* (Tyrone, R.I.P.)
1.0 Hooded Rat* (Clubber, R.I.P.)
0.1 Albino Rat (Isis)
2.0 Emperor Scorpions (Al Sharpton, Leonidas)
2.2.4 Madagascar Hissing Cockroaches

As long as they are from a legal source with receipts to prove it they are allowed.

No endangered or Potentially Dangerous species are allowed without special permits that are not so easy to obtain.

Threatened species are allowed as long as you can prove they where obtained legally and you have receipts to prove it.

No collecting is permitted.

>>...the black rats? NJ laws are sooo confusing. Are black rats allowed? Collecting?
>>
>>>>I have Northern Pine snakes on my permit. (I live in NJ)
>>>>
>>>>As long as you get from a breeder with a reciept they are currently allowable by law.
>>>>
>>>>You better be able to prove it if they ask!!!
>>>>
>>>>Only engangered species are illegal regardless of origin.
>>>>
>>>>No they don't tell anyone that unless you ask lol.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>...black pines are more expensive to acquire, and northern pines are threatened in NJ.
>>>>>>-----
>>>>>>Scott
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Reptiles
>>>>>>--------
>>>>>>1 Colombian Rainbow Boa (Rocky)
>>>>>>1.0 Ball Python (Sultan)
>>>>>>0.1 California Kingsnake (Leota)
>>>>>>1.0 Eastern Painted Turtle (Yugi)
>>>>>>0.1 Red/Gold Bearded Dragon* (Irwin, R.I.P.)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Other
>>>>>>-----
>>>>>>1.0 Betta Fish (Tyrone)
>>>>>>1.0 Hooded Rat* (Clubber, R.I.P.)
>>>>>>0.1 Albino Rat (Isis)
>>>>-----
>>>>=========================================================
>>>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>>>=========================================================
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>
>>>>Frank Roberts
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.
>>-----
>>Scott
>>
>>Reptiles
>>--------
>>1 Colombian Rainbow Boa (Rocky)
>>1.0 Ball Python (Sultan)
>>0.1 California Kingsnake (Leota)
>>1.0 Eastern Painted Turtle (Yugi)
>>0.1 Red/Gold Bearded Dragon* (Irwin, R.I.P.)
>>
>>Other
>>-----
>>1.0 Betta Fish* (Tyrone, R.I.P.)
>>1.0 Hooded Rat* (Clubber, R.I.P.)
>>0.1 Albino Rat (Isis)
>>2.0 Emperor Scorpions (Al Sharpton, Leonidas)
>>2.2.4 Madagascar Hissing Cockroaches
-----
=========================================================
Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
=========================================================
Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

I do not consider fox snakes and trans=pecos rats a part of same group.

Only the Black,Yellow,Everglades,Texas, and Grey ratsnakes.

I noticed most of the anomalies in Black Rats are in Everglades as well. Lent anomalies from one another as well as from the Texas rat snakes

All same snake to me.

Rat snakes just happen to be my favorite animals. I have bred and kept MANY American rat snake species. All VERY easy to breed and some very TESTE in nature if you don't work with them. All my Texas rats have mellowed and the babies from them seem to carry their more pleasant disposition. For Lucy Black Rats try Don Soderberg
>>
>>He seems to have VERY nice animals to choose from.
>>
>>
>>(I realy believe these snakes are more generic then people say and breed them that way but hey)
>>
>>Here is some of my Rat snakes I work with or have worked with...
>>
>>All posted pics are in my current bloodlines but actual snakes may no longer be...I have both pure texas bloodlines and also generic bloodlines as well.
>>
>>While they may not sell for much rat snakes are very fun to work with but all are MIXED as far as I am concerned. Plus all the anomalies are mixed within the American Rat Snake Clade. I call them ALL "generic" no matter what claims people are making.
>>
>>I do keep separate bloodlines. But my personal opinion is that all obsoleta in this hobby are color pattern variants of the same snake. Which would be the Black Rat Snake.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>-----
>>=========================================================
>> Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
>>=========================================================
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Frank Roberts
>>
>>
>>
>>I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.
-----
=========================================================
Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
=========================================================
Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.