Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have had my boa for five months now, he is still only big enough to eat hoppers/young mice, and have only gotten him to eat about 3 out of 20 some offered frozen/thawed mice. I've tried all the hold up to lamp for 30 seconds/soak in warm water/ wriggle a little with forceps tricks, and as I said have only gotten him to eat three of them. I have had to feed him live prey obviously, and really do not want to continue this practice because one, he is the only snake currently eating live in my collection, two, since brbs are such a delicate snake skin wise, I don't want him to be bitten by a live mouse, and three, I just don't like to send mice to their doom (live onces anyway). I have got him a really awesome setup, plenty of room, climbing branches, hides, heat gradients, etc, and he is in excellent health, and a very good appetite, but with live only. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Some snakes wont eat with an audience. Dont mess with him at all for a week, then put his thawed dinner in his enclosure with him overnight. If you can place it a few inches away from his head without bothering him at all, more the better. If you cant, just put it on the ground and close his container. I like to leave food at midnight. If they're going to eat it, they'll find it while hunting during the night. If he wont accept your first offering, try leaving one for him every few days.

I've got 2 poor feeders. Through trial and error I've discovered things that temp them. 1 insists on a rat fuzzy, he likes it warm and he likes it to "run" from him on the tongs. I get his attention with it in the tongs and then start guiding him along with it. He normally grabs it pretty quick. The other likes mouse fuzzies scented with quail blood and a chunk of liver on its face. Really. I have quail here anyhow so its no biggie, but you may find some luck with chicken liver or egg yolk. I also have a rat snake that didnt want to do thawed so I took scissors and cut the skull of the fuzzy open to expose the brain juices. Worked great.

Do your best to leave him be between feeds, dont take him out at all, no matter how much you think it doesnt stress him.

I container feed my snakes, but I'd leave a really fussy eater in his enclosure if I necessary. Each snake wants different things, try tweaking your enclosure a bit, more or less temperature, more or less humidity, different substrate, hides, etc. If the enclosure is too big, try something smaller or give him a very small hide box so he can feel secure. They're largely very good eaters, though a few hold out until we offer them what they consider to be appropriate food or housing. He sounds like he's eating enough to at least sustain himself while you figure out what makes him tick.

Have you tried fresh killed to wean him over to frozen/thawed? This has normally worked for me.

Sean.
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1.1 BRB
1.1 Triple Het TPRS's
0.1 Silver TPRS
1.1 Amel Bloodred Corns
0.1 Abbott Okeetee Corn
0.1 Blizzard Bloodred Corn
1.1 Thayeri Kingsnakes
0.1 Reeve's Turtle
0.2 Amstaff's
1.0 Pudytat

Try a very warm (thawed) mouse in a small enough container that the scent becomes overpowering (The container should also be opaque, so that the BRB isn't distracted or disturbed and can concentrate completely on the mouse).
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Renee

2.0 amel & anery corns (Foxfire & Daguerre)
1.0 BRB (Loki)

I have had a few that have been hard to get to eat frozen thawed. I only offer food once a week, so if they miss a meal that have to wait till next week.

I place the frozen feeders in zip-lock bags and thaw in room temp to 80 degree water until the feeder is 100% thawed. I then place it in 105 degree water. At this time I get my snakes into their feeding containers - approximaely 30 minutes. I then offer it on tongs. Most will eat off the tongs. For the tougher ones - I try to tease the snake with the feeder. It seems like if pulling the feeder (on tongs) back away from the snake really quick it will invoke a feeding response.

If the snake does not seem interested in the feeder I drop it into the feeding container and move on. I cover the feeding containers with a blanket to block light while I am cleaning cages. The feeding containers stay covered for at least one full hour. Most that did not seem interested in the food will eat.

Also, I would not hesitate to feed any of my smaller BRB's a live mouse. A live animal has always brought on great feeding responses in the reluctant feeders. Once you get to small to medium rats is when the feeder amimal can injure the snake - imo.

Also, a big reason for snakes to not eat is husbadry - temps & humidity are very critical.

Also (yes another also!) snakes are cold booded and can go a long time without food. It is great your are trying to get tips here, and hopefully someone says something that helps!
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Mike

7.13 BRB
1.2 Spotted Python
1.0 Cal. King

Thanks for all your help, I'll try some of these out next week. As I said, he is a great live eater, and I'm completely on top of the husbandry aspect, I've discovered that tropical snakes are the most difficult to convert to frozen it seems. Plus another reason I'm getting tips is the nearest pet store is about an hour away from my house. I know I could just breed mice myself, but I would be doing it just for the benefit of one snake. Thanks again

Mitch,
....Quite a few of my 2007 BRBs will not regularly eat frozen and thawed mice but will eat frozen and thawed hatchling quail whenever offered. There are a couple of the big rodent sellers who advertise here on kingsnake who also sell quail. If your frozen mice have been in the freezer for very long they may have odors that are not attractive to BRBs. Rainbow Boas are generally more picky about their frozen rodents smelling right than other species.
Jeff

>>Thanks for all your help, I'll try some of these out next week. As I said, he is a great live eater, and I'm completely on top of the husbandry aspect, I've discovered that tropical snakes are the most difficult to convert to frozen it seems. Plus another reason I'm getting tips is the nearest pet store is about an hour away from my house. I know I could just breed mice myself, but I would be doing it just for the benefit of one snake. Thanks again

I have found that most Boids that refuse food will eat avian prey.

Reason I say most...

I once had an adult imported Candoia Ground Boa about 3.5 feet that would only eat Bullfrogs. If you slimed a rodent. She would grab it and then release. She could tell somehow once she grabbed it, guess I missed a tiny spot because I would saturate the darned thing in the slime. This (fact she ate Anuran prey item) took 18 months to figure out. She was still heavy after all that time, so I imagine their metabolisms are quite slow. Took me 6 months to figure as someone else had her a year and since they couldn't get her to eat handed her off to me. She died when I was on vacation for 18 days in California under the care of someone else (I do not vacation for more then 7 days no more). I have heard of neonate boa (not BCC or BCI types) eating anuran prey but not full grown adults. I would have never figured it out, it was in that big red book. It said frogs and bats, so I went to the local pond and got me a big ole bullfrog and that damn frog didn't even hit the paper and I was like I'll be dammed LOL.

I have gotten stubborn feeder wild caught BRB's/Anacondas/bloods and adult colubrids to eat using quail/chicks and frogs as well.

It is a specialty of mine getting wild caught Herptiles (not just snakes) eating. Wasted Talent now that most snakes are captive bred. Many ball pythons in the 80's past through my hands for that reason, prob a few pattern morphs as well, who woulda knew LOL.

If anyone has that big red book, look up Candoia.

Bats and frogs of the genus Rana hehe.

I actualy have read that entire book and found many mistakes and have a documents from Jerry G. Walls when I wrote them hehe.
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Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
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Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

in last comment.
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Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
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Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

Hey, Frank, what's the "big red book?" A secret serpent society source of sly snake solutions?
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Renee

2.0 amel & anery corns (Foxfire & Daguerre)
1.0 BRB (Loki)

Renee,

Well not exactly, but it is a GREAT reference book for all Reptiles and Amphibians.

It may be slightly outdated with a few inaccuracies, so are most books as time passes.

The book is from TFH Publications.

Completely Illustrated Atlas of Reptiles and Amphibians for the Terrarium

(Hardcover) by Fritz Jurgen Obst (Author), Klaus Richter (Author), Udo Jacob (Author)

Must have book for your Herpetoculture Library (IMO)

(link)
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Completely Illustrated Atlas of Reptiles and Amphi

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Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
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Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

I'll have to look for that red book, then. I just cataloged all my snake/reptile books so I wouldn't accidentally pick up duplicates (with misleadingly different cover art), and discovered I have about 35 tomes already. I like to read up to excess on anything that interests me; I've also been checking snake books out of the local libraries, as if I don't have enough to wade through already...
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Renee

2.0 amel & anery corns (Foxfire & Daguerre)
1.0 BRB (Loki)

I posted a link to it if you want to buy it. Lots cheaper them most places.
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Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
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Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.

Thanks! I went back and used the link. It sounds like a terrific book. I especially liked one reviewer's comment:
"...it's *HUGE*. Were someone to break into my home, I would have little difficulty blugeoning them to death with this massive tome."

Books that can also function as weapons are twice as useful--making them an especially efficient use of monetary resources!
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Renee

2.0 amel & anery corns (Foxfire & Daguerre)
1.0 BRB (Loki)

>>Thanks! I went back and used the link. It sounds like a terrific book. I especially liked one reviewer's comment:
>>"...it's *HUGE*. Were someone to break into my home, I would have little difficulty blugeoning them to death with this massive tome."
>>
>>Books that can also function as weapons are twice as useful--making them an especially efficient use of monetary resources!
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>>Renee
>>
>>2.0 amel & anery corns (Foxfire & Daguerre)
>>1.0 BRB (Loki)
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=========================================================
Roberts Realm Of Reptile Research
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Thanks,

I opened my mouth and out flowed a melody black.