Reptile & Amphibian Forums

He's an '05 male produced by Chip Ozburn of Constricting Designs.

Don't know the exact lineage of this animal, though it was the only one (out of multiple amel clutches) to have this patterning.

A beautiful animal, though I have yet to prove him out. One of those back-burner projects...

Anyway, here he is such as he is.

Trevor

I bet you soup to nuts that it has Cal King in it's line
somewhere.
-Phil
-----
Work is the curse
of the drinking class!

You're not the first to make that suggestion, though he certainly presents as pure Splendida.

Anyone interested in helping me sort out this 'mystery', I'm wide open to any and all sage advice/wisdom.

Trevor

>>You're not the first to make that suggestion, though he certainly presents as pure Splendida.
>>
>>Anyone interested in helping me sort out this 'mystery', I'm wide open to any and all sage advice/wisdom.
>>
>>Trevor

Head and neck pattern are tell tail signs of cal king. I have never seen a splendida that didn't have a "sockhead". Banding is typical of crosses as well. Not saying that is what it is for sure, but it definately resembles the crosses I've seen in the past. Good looking snake regardless.
-----
www.brandonosbornereptiles.com

Cool, thanks Brandon.

Again, I have no real plans for this animal, and merely present him here as a curiosity.

Don't know if it'll be a project thats worth the time and trouble or not...

Trevor

>>Cool, thanks Brandon.
>>
>>Again, I have no real plans for this animal, and merely present him here as a curiosity.
>>
>>Don't know if it'll be a project thats worth the time and trouble or not...
>>
>>Trevor

Trevor, I wouldn't discount the project just yet. Some of my favorite kingsnakes are the Yuma kings, which are probably integrades of cal kings and spledida or nigrita. When you see a nice Yuma, you'll know it. Not too many people are working with them and if I found the right animals, I wouldn't hesitate to pick some up. They are natural occurring integrades and are absolute beauties. If it was in my hands, I'd find a nice splendida for a mate.

Good luck.
Brandon Osborne
-----
www.brandonosbornereptiles.com

I thought the same thing.
-----
I decided my old sig was too big.

Well,.....just as Phil mentioned, the fact alone that it's an amel(albino) has to STRONGLY raise suspecting eybrows as to it having albino Cal. King influence. Then factor in the partial striped pattern, and also the thin abstract "cross-band" type pattern along the upper portion of the body, as opposed to the more "circular" pattern typically seen in most splendida,....it has to leave a big question mark in regards to it's lineage.

I've seen "text book" perfectly patterned so-called albino splendida that even have the big "sockhead" on the head/neck region too,...but this look is easily produced with successive generations of back-breeding to the "targeted" subspecies(i.e. splendida) to make them virtually indistinguishable from pure lines of splendida. The two are VERY closely related anyway, so it doesn't take a whole lot of effort on someone's part for them to look that way.

Albino splendida have been looked at by most in the hobby with a very questinable view ever since they first seemed to appear out of nowhere some years ago.

In any case, they look great, but it's very doubtful they don't have amel Cal. King in the mix....just my two cents.

I would welcome anyone to prove otherwise to me.

best regards, ~Doug
-----
"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open mouth and remove any doubt!"

Interesting and thorough response, thanks Doug.

As mentioned in my prior reply to Brandon, I'm not certain what to do with him at this point. I purchased him a couple of years ago for the 'novelty' inherent in as animal such as this, though have never given any serious thoughts to breeding.

Time will tell I suppose, though for the moment he's just hangin' out.

Trevor

Doug, The amel splendida were started by Don Shores.He bought a w/c amel from a guy that collected it about 20 miles inside New Mexico from the AZ border.So yes, It for sure has cali in it but I am not sure it has the amel cal gene.Somebody just needs to breed one with a amel cal king and get it over with.
Christ,I will do it if I had one.Then freeze all the babies.LOL...

L8r Shannon

Shannon,....Yeah, I knew Don Shores bred them, and I saw some that he had last year. I didn't know about him getting the actual W/C amel from that guy though. I will say this, Don's DID "look" 100% genuine to me, and I've seen some of his that are owned by other's I know too, and they also looked extremely convincing to me as well, but I figured that was from the "back-breeding" thing I mentioned earlier, maybe not in his line's case then. I guess Don's line of amels are as close as they get then(which is pretty darn good), and I stand somewhat corrected regarding that particular line. But many others out there are still far shy of looking close to those, the ones without the "sockhead" hood, and rounded circular saddling, etc..

Thanks for the low-down on Don's animal's history, that's good to know.

later!, ~Doug
-----
"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open mouth and remove any doubt!"

Here is an albino splendida directly from Don Shores:

He has a cool touch of striping on his tail tip, but otherwise comes off as 100% splendida to me. Figured you guys could use an example for the discussion.
-----
God Bless Evolution.

Yes,......thanks for posting that photo, those are the ones I was referring to earlier, and seem to be the "genuine" article,...or as close as they come anyway from what I can gather, and from what Shannon also mentioned.

Nice looking animal!

~Doug
-----
"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open mouth and remove any doubt!"

Yep, And I know he tok that w/c years ago and bred it to a bunch of nice socks from the el-paso area.

Shannon

Shannon,.....That was a good move on his part to introduce it to stock FAR away from any other influence, and also to accentuate the "sock'head" characteristics.

Thanks for that additional info!

~Doug
-----
"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open mouth and remove any doubt!"

I thought I read somewhere that someone did the cross and found them to not be allelic.
-----
I decided my old sig was too big.

Back in the day.I had a w/c male from Sanderson Texas and a w/c Female from Hyw 9 in New Mexico.When bred together they produced some stripers.I sold the project off about (2001 or 2002) and havn't seen them surfase since....Some were more spotted than striped.

L8r Shannon

Wow, that first animal is amazing Shannon!

Beautiful stuff.

Trevor

Thanks Trevor, Hey lets trade for your amel scarlet?LOL....RIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!

Man!,....if that thing isn't just INSANE!, I don't know what is!.....I'd give my left tes!!@l# for that animal!..

~Doug
-----
"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open mouth and remove any doubt!"

"Hey lets trade for your amel scarlet?"

Well, it's a far more useful offer than Doug's.

Ewww...

Trevor

LMAO!
-----
Todd Hughes

Wow! Shannon, those're sweet!

reako45