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i was reading a post below about how snow leos arent really snows and i came up with an ideal.
im not sure its correct or if i understand all this but here it is. the guy below said that snows are really just axanthic that means without yellow. so without yellow would leave a white gecko with black patterns right.
well he also said that to make a real snow you would have to cross axanthic with albino which is without melenin which makes the black patterns right.
so this is my ideal. someone could cross these axanthics with albinos and the hatchlings would look axanthic (with no yellow) and albino (with no black patterns) right.
so the babies would be all white with red eyes cause they would be albino right? so i dont know if you got anything i just said but i think it might work.

The problem is that we do not have axanthics...
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Well, you basically just repeating what they did below, just in more words..lol. But I doubt it would work anways. Everyone is thinking of axanthic as it is in snakes(genetic). In leos, there is no true axanthic. Snow babies are just popping out of nowhere and there is no way that they could possible be genetic if this is what is happening. So if you bred a snow to an albino, you would just be basically getting het. albinos, not dbl. het for albino and axanthic"snow". The "snow" that we have now isnt a recessive so there cant be a het. for it, therefore there is no way to get a genetic snow, until we get a recessive axanthic.
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Josh
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But, you say that snow just popping up. But isn't that a sort of proof that the gene axanthic lies hidden in the genes in many lines and when two reccessive genes meet, then a snow just "pop up". Has anyone try to do true genetic analyses whith those snow? Bredeeng them together, see the outcome when bred to normals...but it takes to long time, one generation a year, does anyone have the interest to take the time for that kind of breeding?

No, the snows would just be popping up out of nowhere. It doesnt mean the parents are both hets. Just like Monte's "snow" that popped out. It now has a color, but if the parents were both hets, then wouldnt there be more of them hatching??? The point is, there is NO true axanthic in leopard geckos. The "snows" that we have now are just line-bred traits, like Albey's. You cant get a het. from a line bred trait.
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Josh
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But how can a snow pop-up from high yellow parents? I have a lot of genetc knowledge and know the different beetween het and line bred, but please explane to me, in gentic terms, how a snow (line bred trait) can pop-up from high yellow parents from a high yellow trait?

I have no idea!!! But believe me, the snow isnt a recessive trait. If it was, by now we would see as many snow hets. and snows as we do albino hets. and albinos.
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Josh
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Yes, but don't we se a lot? But there is not many that use them in breeding, becouse they turn yellow as they grow. A true, but not "line bred" axanthic can be white to pale yellow, and it is up to the breeder to wash out the yellow (to line bred). But there is two kind of genes that "lacking yellow": axanthic (that lacks yellow) and anerythristic (that lack red) and they look very similar and can vary from pure white to pale yellow, but I think that people do not realise that is a mutation and breed them to others, not het or linebreed the and just think it is a line bred trait.

No, we dont see a lot. many people come on here asking where they could buy a snow, becuase they are so hard to find. And i agree, that most of the snows turn yellow. I think the problem everyone is having is that they are thinking that leo genetics are like bp genetics were everything is either recessive or co-dominant. It isnt like that in leos, so therefore leo morphs wont be the same thing that a bp morph would be.
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Josh
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I havent heard of normal leos having snow babies, ussually they look like snows when theyre babies and they turn out looking normal as they age. As for the concept as "snow", it is about as defined as the "giants" concept.
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Yes, and that is I want an explanation to my snow. He is now 8 month and has a very off white color with black spots, and his parents IS high yellow, and I bred him myself, and guess my surpise when it was a white/black baby in the eggbox!!! I was planning to bred som kind of stripe...

Posted by: wahberee
I havent heard of normal leos having snow babies, ussually they look like snows when theyre babies and they turn out looking normal as they age. As for the concept as "snow", it is about as defined as the "giants" concept.

It is is just as misleading to call a white looking baby from normal parents a snow before it is grow (as it probably isn't), as it is to call a dark baby not born of melanistics melanistic. You won't know til it grows bigger. Check out the color change progression I posted a few days ago. That baby was literally almost all black at birth, and now it's kind of a reduced spotting orangy leo with some lavender patches and lots of tiny spots and a dull greenish wash over it.

However just because people hatch out white looking babies from normal parents and misleadingly call them "snows" before they are big enough to prove that, DOES NOT MEAN THERE AREN'T REAL SNOWS. I have wseen nice adult snows, I just would discourage ANYONE from buying a juvvy leo labeled as a snow, unless you have extreme trust in the breeder and it comes from two snow parents.

I hatched this little girl (temp sexed) on 5-14 from a B- grade female bred to my patternless carrot tail male. This pic was taken after her first shed and although the pic is a little fuzzy, she has absolutely no signs of yellow in her yet. Her clutch mate, who was just sold, can be seen on my available page, but she was already showing very faint yellow as you can see in the pic on my site. Like everyone has said, it is a selectively bred trait, and even then the chances of getting a nice snow are slim. Two eggs that I incubated male from my other female snow came out looking normal. And on top of that the wild jungle pattern on the one that I sold compared to the one that I'm keeping...there are just too many wild genes in the snow lines to really produce "A" grade snows with any certainty.
I'm just starting to play with the snow line, but my plans include breeding with blizzards and carrot tails (the reason for using my patternless carrot tail this year) to produce a vibrant black on white contrast with a bright orange carrot tail. Call in crazy, call it a waste of time, but hey I have to have something off the wall to keep me busy here.

Uriah Walker

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