Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I was curious if someone could inform me of the laws relating to keeping Easterns in Florida. I understand that the general venomous permit is required, but are there any specific rules that apply to Crotalus adamanteus.

Thank You in advance.

There are no specific rules regarding C. adamanteus other than a venomous permit. Of course there are numerous rules in caging, experience, etc. in order to obtain said permit in the first place....TC

depending on where you live there may be city ordinances against "dangerous animals".

>>There are no specific rules regarding C. adamanteus other than a venomous permit. Of course there are numerous rules in caging, experience, etc. in order to obtain said permit in the first place....TC
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Herp Conservation Unlimited
Mexicana Group Directory
Photography by Joseph E. Forks

Maybe not. Remember a few months ago when an individual when to court about this issue? He was permitted by the state and it was determined that the state over ruled the city ordinance. I wish Texas worked that way.
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Tim Cole
www.Designeratrox.com/
www.AustinReptileService.net
www.AustinReptileExpo.com/
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Conservation through Education

we need a test case here to establish precedence.
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Herp Conservation Unlimited
Mexicana Group Directory
Photography by Joseph E. Forks

Local city and county laws may be stricter than the State laws but not less than in regards to animal regulations.
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Tim Cole
www.Designeratrox.com/
www.AustinReptileService.net
www.AustinReptileExpo.com/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<
Conservation through Education

If you have a test case it DEPENDS entirely how Texas Parks and Wildlife was set up by the legislature[the wording of the document]. I know just enough about it to realize I don't know much but if someone wanted to check the case I believe it would be self-explainatory....TC

Fortunately in Fl. state law supercedes ALL local laws. This was recently tested in court. If you're liscened by the state it DOESN'T MATTER what the local statutes say.....TC

Didn't I already say that?
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Tim Cole
www.Designeratrox.com/
www.AustinReptileService.net
www.AustinReptileExpo.com/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<
Conservation through Education

Careful Tim!

Randal

I was explaining that it has to do with the way Texas Parks and Wildlife was created originally and NO you didn't say that. Howabout between now and the Expo I'll get the documentation on the case and meet with you. That way you'll have it in case someone in Texas wants to challenge the law as has been done in Fl. I'll see you there......TC

TP&W is helping as a matter of fact and I was copied the correspondence this morning. Florida is the model they are using and it seems the new TX HB 12 rules make it (seem) possible that we can do this in Texas too.

Best
Joe
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Herp Conservation Unlimited
Mexicana Group Directory
Photography by Joseph E. Forks

Glad to hear it Joe. I hope everything is worked out so that it's a fair and workable situation.....TC

That would be GREAT! But I'll believe it when I see it. I just don't see all of the large cities changing their laws to be less lenient or allowing animals that are now illegal.

On the other hand, if they did an inspection permit like Florida, it would make more sense to allow it. Easier to enforce that way also. That would still require someone with herp knowledge to do the inspecting. We know their track record on THAT subject.
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Tim Cole
www.Designeratrox.com/
www.AustinReptileService.net
www.AustinReptileExpo.com/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<
Conservation through Education

I hope so too Tim.
However, it would NOT require an inspector with herp knowledge.
All the inspector has to do is follow the guidelines set forth in the regs.
I had a Florida venomous and a Class I permit for 13 years, and the inspectors didn't know squat about herps, they just followed the rules set forth by Fl. Fish/Game when they came to my house for a yearly inspection. The same thing COULD happen in Texas.
I have talked to David Sinclair about this and he has the Florida regs.

Randal

My fingers are crossed.
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Tim Cole
www.Designeratrox.com/
www.AustinReptileService.net
www.AustinReptileExpo.com/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<
Conservation through Education

Randal, Fl fish and Game is NOT regulated by the legislature unless a specific law is passed as was attempted a while back. They promulgate their own laws and enforce them. This sounds bad but in fact works very well because they don't react to hysteria and the animal right nuts. The reason they can do this even though other enforcement agencies can not is because of how Fish and Game were created in the first place. It all has to do with the wording on the charter, act of legislature, or whatever name is placed on the creation document of the agency. Fortunately for us Fish and Game have omnipotency over exotic and native wildlife which supercedes ANY AND ALL local laws. If Texas Parks and Wildlife have the same "charter" it would work if you had a permit and inspection procedure in place. In fact the permit is a good idea because it would weed out idiots keeping venomous snakes under unsafe conditions. At the same time if there was an incident involving permitted or unpermitted people there would be LESS bad p.r. as the state could step in and take appropriate measures depending on circumstances and more importantly put the public and poloticians at ease because it is regulated. The fact is it works here! Our inspectors are fair, educated, and reasonable folks to work with. Our local inspector Mr. Skip Truby just retired and is breeding tortoises in his retirement. He was truely a knowlegable nice guy and he will be missed. Pat Reynolds an inspector often seen on Miami Animal Cops on Animal Planet is knowlegable and a great guy as well. Barry Cook was our first one and he had a rocky road being the first. He endured and is still well respected in the herp community even though he retired several years ago. The point being is I believe regulation is better than an all out ban. I think without regulations in place all out bans are likely. Sorry for the rant....TC

Tom,
What was the guy's name that did my inspection in Floral City? I can't remember, but I do remember he didn't know anything about reptiles. He did the Bushnell/Ocala/Inverness, etc. cities.

Randal

John Moran?....TC

Yes Sir!
That's him.

He told me once during his inspections, "tell Tom I would love to see him outside of the shop, and I'll take care of business with him" My wife Linda piped up and said, "Hold on Mr. Moran, I'll get him on the phone right now"
hahahahahahahhahahahhahahaha...........shut him up and shut him down!

Randal

You know Randal I had forgotten about that. He's the ONLY inspector Fl fish and Game ever had that I didn't like and respect. You know he got demoted because of me and my civil actions initiated toward him. I never even had a warning ticket except for him. When we went to court Judge T. Skidmore publicly admonished him and caused the action by his superiors....Thanks for the memories.....TC