Reptile & Amphibian Forums

OK Gang,

Which ratsnakes are your favorites? Which are the best to keep, from either the point of being a challenge or just very easy?
Let's here some testimony..

Matthew
The forum was starting to slow a bit..

A pair of each of course.

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Randy Whittington

>>A pair of each of course.
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>>Randy Whittington

Black Rat Snakes for beginers. Taiwan Beauty Snakes for Intermediates. and 100 flower rat snakes for advanced

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My collection
1.0.0 Normal Taiwan Beauty Snake
1.1.0 Normal Black Rat Snake
1.0.0 White-sided Black Rat Snake
1.0.0 Anery Corn Snake
1.0.0 Amel Corn Snake
1.0.0 Normal Common Garter Snake
0.1.0 Hypo Northern Water Snake
0.0.8 red spotted newts

Yeah, I'm going to be looking for some taeniura next Reptile Expo!

Matthew

Just to clarify I meant a pair of each kind of ratsnake there is, not just the ones I posted pictures of above. lol
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Randy Whittington

Yowza! How come you ignored the Rare post?!! LOL
I gotta get me some of those. Maybe especially those silver subocs! Love everyone!

Matthew
You win, I'm TOTALLY corrupted now!

Sorry, I saw that post but I couldn't think of reasonably short awnsers and was pressed for time.

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Randy Whittington

Randy,

What is the yellow one in the first picture?
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1.0 Abino Striped Cali King
0.1 Amel Corn
0.1 Anery Corn
1.0.1 Black Rat
0.0.1 Eastern Garter
1.0 Normal Ball Python
2.1 Bettas

It's an albino taeniura mocquardi. Here is dad.

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Randy Whittington

wow. dad is quite the looker. very handsome snake.
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1.0 Abino Striped Cali King
0.1 Amel Corn
0.1 Anery Corn
1.0.1 Black Rat
0.0.1 Eastern Garter
1.0 Normal Ball Python
2.1 Bettas

Randy,

Uh huh.
Anyway, that is one cool looking amelanistic Stripe-Tail!

Matthew

Sorry that's the best excuse I could come up with. lol
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Randy Whittington

The meahllies down in south Texas are bulletproof, as well as T rats and now I am beginning to think the bairdi are as well! My favs are the subocs, the young are easy to establish and they hardly refuse a meal if you get them young. I like their inquisitiveness, if snakes can be inquisitive. The Glades have been tough for me.

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Todd Hughes

Maybe they need more humidity ( Re: Glades) than your part of the country can provide.
I got a bairdi & I love him already. two words best described: Curious, gluttonous!

Matthew
Can you tell I'm fishing for suggestions for my next snake?

I have been keeping snakes for 26 years now. I did pythons, vipers, Crotalids, Elapids, Corns, Pines, Milks, Kings (AO), and now I'm a Pantherophis obsoletus specialist. My favourites are the North Carolina Greenish Ratsnake, White Oak Grey Ratsnake, and true Everglades Ratsnake. Actually, I'm partial to all races of Pantherophis (Elaphe / Pituophis / Scotophis / whatever) obsoletus.

Don't ask me why, LOL. Maybe it's geographical variability, I've always been fascinated by that. All I can say is that these among the easiest and most forgiving colubrids out there. On top of that, truckloads of personality, great feeding response, great attitude... Oh, did I mention they're beautiful?

>>Bairdis grow up to be one of the most beautiful North American rat snakes (natural colors).
They are great eaters.
They tame easily and are easy to handle.
They are active so they make great display snakes.
They attain a good size, bigger then corns but not quite as large as black rats.
They are inexpensive.
Housing requirements are easy.
GREAT SNAKES

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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"Resistance is futile"
Jimmy Johnson
(Draybar)
Draybars Snakes

_____

For me its Bairds rats hands down. They are easy to care for almost ivariably great feeders, they are showy snakes given a display cage they don't spend all their time hiding, they handle well and in their own subtle way many examples can be quite unique.

Pic is of a yearling female from Bakers Crossing in Val Verde County TX.

Well, I only have a couple of months experience, but I am coming to love my Bairds'. Great display Ratsnakes!

Matthew

For ease of keeping/breeding-emoryi.

Coolness-Good 'ol Bogertophis subocularis, of course!!

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Brad Chambers
WWW.HCU-TX.ORG

The Avalanche has already started-it is too late for the pebbles to vote....

That is a cool shot! Always wanted a suboc in the past. Still looking to get one. Or two..

Matthew

I like all of the rat snake species I am currently keeping, as well as all of the ones I have kept in the past.

My current favorite is the Chinese beauty Snake (Orthirophis taeniurus taeniurus), which is a smaller subspecies of the beauties, and docile as well. They are easy to keep, and breed under the right conditions.

I also like a couple of the smaller Asians (Elaphe dione, Elaphe bimaculata), which are easy to keep, and stay small so are conveniently sized for keeping in smaller cages or tubs.

My current favorite New World species is the Baird's Rat Snake (Patherophis bairdi). This is a very cool species to keep and study imho. Docile attitudes like Corns, but with a feeding response like Texas Rats!

I agree with Todd (antelope) that meahllies (Pantherophis emoryi "meahllmorum") are nearly indestructible, and get bigger than the average emoryi, and have more attitude than the average "Corn".

-Toby Brock

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Southwestern Center for Herpetological Research

Toby,

That is the second reference to those GPs, are they the "New" Corn subspecies postulated in NW Louisiana? Or a locality variant of emoyri?

Matthew

Matthew, they are the southernmost variant of G.P's, also known as thornscrub rats. We down here nicknamed them meahllies, or meahl wyrms, lol! They get bigger as Toby said and are tolerent to south Texas winters, meaning we see a lot of them a lot of the time. They also lay huge eggs and a lot of them, sometimes the most often encountered snake on warm summer nights.
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Todd Hughes

Ok, thanks. Sounds like an ideal breeding choice.
Does anybody know what is up with the putative 3d Corn subspecies?

Matthew

Matthew,

The "new" Corn subspecies or species, for western LA and eastern TX is the Slowinski's Corn Snake - Pantherophis guttatus slowinskii or P. slowinskii, depending on who you are reading.

P. emoryi is (currently) considered to be a separate species from guttatus or slowinskii, by most taxonomists. However, some of us still consider them to be closely related enough to be a form of Corn Snake. A couple of other "common" names for emoryi meahllmorum are Southwestern Rat Snake and Southern Plains Rat Snake.

-Toby

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Southwestern Center for Herpetological Research

... Second sentence of the second paragraph should read: Some of us "hobbyists"... I wasn't trying to say I am a taxonomist - very far from it!

-Toby
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Southwestern Center for Herpetological Research

Toby,

Frankly with all the revisions, re-naming, & splitting Genera to absurd degrees, I'm glad you ARE **NOT** a taxonimist!(sic)LOL

Matthew

Haha, don't lie Toby, you know you are a closet taxonomist! I know cuz you included the name Southern Plains rat! LOL! J/K!
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Todd Hughes

Dang man! Now that it's out, I'm going to have to change my name and leave the country! LOL

-Toby
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Southwestern Center for Herpetological Research

Ya know, he's right! Todd, I'll get the tar if you bring the feathers! LOL
At least I'm not the only one getting peeved at the heretics, oops, scientists who keep changing everything every 6 months!

Matthew

Is that the suspect or the southwestern GP? Still looks like a Cornsnake to me, minus the reds of course.
Thanks for the info!

Matthew

The snake in the photo is a Southwestern Rat Snake (emoryi meahllmorum), LTC from western Nueces County, TX.

-Toby
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Southwestern Center for Herpetological Research

Very handsome snake, I see why you guys distinguish between the populations..

Matthew

Thanks Matthew! This is my favorite "variant" of the guttatus/emoryi group, and extremely underrated imho, as well as being very little known in the hobby. I like their patterns better than the average northern variety of emoryi, and their large size also makes them interesting. I have a pair of old LTC adults which both weigh well over a kilogram each, and are not fat at all. The male is around 5 ft long and the female is over 4.5 feet long. I have also seen larger specimens in the field, which were at least a little over 5 ft.

Photos are different views of my big, old female from Nueces County, TX.

-Toby

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Southwestern Center for Herpetological Research

Absolutely better than northern emoryi, the contrast is superb!

And you are most welcome!
Matthew

Throw in a wild caught striped meahll worm and it's normal mate and you really get to have some fun! I was fortunate to catch these two under the same board last year and anxiously await some possible hets for this trait, if it is one.

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Todd Hughes

Todd,

Its wild how many Ratsnakes have that stiped pattern in their genes. All the linderheimi I have seen have had at least partial striping as well.

Matthew

It goes without saying that Gonyosoma oxycephala is my favorite ratsnake. Now that true CBB specimens are being produced I believe they will be very popular in the near future. I also have to say I'm quite surprised at how tame my CBB specimens are despite no effort on my part to tame them down. Honestly I like them a bit feisty, but I digress.

Two other "ratsnakes" that I really like are the Seleyar G. janseni (i.e. Black Jansen's Ratsnake) and the Rhynchophis boulengeri. The latter I truely think will be extremely popular. They are easy to keep and make for a smallish arboreal display animal. Not the easiest snakes to get started as hatchlings but that's the only negative I can think of. I think they are a great project for the breeder who does not mind hanging onto hatchlines for a while and getting them started.
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Currently keeping:

6.10 Gonyosoma oxycephala (Javan, mixed colors)

1.1 Philodryas baroni

1.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback

Chris,

I get the feeling you are trying to make me a Gonysoma convert! LOL. Since I kep a WC one, I'd love to try a CB baby, though I might actually miss the feisty attitude too. Funny what you get used to.
The Rhynos are cool looking, but are they still pretty expensive?

Sincerely,
Matthew

I do think the Rhinos are still pretty expensive. CBB G. oxycephala are also on the expensive side but I expect they will come down in a couple of years.
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Currently keeping:

6.10 Gonyosoma oxycephala (Javan, mixed colors)

1.1 Philodryas baroni

1.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback

Chris,

Define Expensive. I bought my WC Gony in the '90s at about 70 dollars US. Of course, here even Cornsnakes seem expensive at the local stores. Must be because I'm out of range of those awesome Okeetee ones. But even Texas snakes are not cheap.

Matthew

I'm not really sure what Rhino Rats are worth. I think there was a yearling pair for sale recently for $1500?

True CBB G. oxycephala (not the captive hatched stuff that is most of what you see) are worth about $250 each right now. I could see them coming down to $100 each in a few years or so. I don't think they'll ever be $50 snakes.
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Currently keeping:

6.10 Gonyosoma oxycephala (Javan, mixed colors)

1.1 Philodryas baroni

1.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback

Chris,

What!? You mean people don't want to be bitten And musked & pooed on? Imagine that! LOL. Back then 50-70 bucks bought you those pleasures. Of course, I was also in an area of importation so prices weren't as bad as inland.

Matthew
I'd bay 125-190 for a true CB one..

I love emoryi rats. Very hardy. Even more so then corns. They can vary in ground & saddle color. My female has a silverish ground color with greenish saddles. My male is an albino. Here's a few pics below.
I'm also a huge fan of bairds ratsnakes. I do plan to pickup some soon.

Yeah, emoyri with good contrast make very handsome snakes, like white-oak phase Grey rats.
My current fave is Elaphe (Pantheropsis or whatever..) bairdi too. Very alert creatures.

Matthew