Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I wanted to get an expert opinion on a condition my sav has with his skin.

Background-My sav got burnt about 6 months ago. I took him to the vet and got Silvadene to take care of the dark patch that formed. He healed successfully, but now he has white spots on his skin where the scales should be. Is this a result of the burn? He has been through 2 sheds and they still persist.

My setup-8x3x2 cage with topsoil/decomposed granite substrate. Basking spot- 130-140 via bank of 3 40W halogens. Hot side - 80-95. Cool side - 75-85. Wooden hide spot in middle of tank he uses quite often. USed to burrow when first introduced to new cage, doesnt burrow anymore. Humidity kept at 75-85%

See pics below. Pics taken on hot side. Sorry about the quality, taken with a camera phone. Any thoughts on the skin condition?

The white spots are scar tissue and may or may not go away depending on how deep the burns were.

The scars are really the least of your problems, Jeff. Your sav is severly obese. I would check my husbandry and cut down on feedings immediately if I were you. Obesity is a serious health issue.

Thats the first thing I thought when I saw that last picture.

what light caused the burn?
that is a HUGE lizard as in fat huge. take him for some laps around the block and get him on a diet!

The light I used to have before was a huge 250W heat UVB. he was allowed to get too close based on my old setup. It was a bad setup I admit.

For his size, he eats 4 mice twice a week. What do you suggest to slim him down? I posted before about feeding less more frequently. Is that the answer or can I go down to 3 or 2 mice twice a week?

For his size, he eats 4 mice twice a week. What do you suggest to slim him down?

I can't tell what his size is, but do you feed him anything he has to work for, like insects? That might kill two birds with one stone (get him moving more and less fat) plus, he could be fed every day, which might make him more active? Also, what about if you downsized the mice?
I don't know, but I'd rather see them looking a little on the lean side, than so overweight.

Susan.

I have a great diet for the Sav - buy 3 or 4 cups of hornworms from mulberryfarms.com and give 2 or more each day, they don't contribute fat, but they are like a little help with laxitave properties. Buy some large crickets and put 20 in the cage with him each day. Every morning when the monitor is most active mist the cage soil to avoid consumption of substrate. I have a 2 ft Sav. I feed it lean stew beef instead of rats, I also remove the yolk of the egg and mix in some lean stew meat (I forgot to mention that I have a meat grinder for the stew meat) I also throw in his daily vitamins and it takes him about an hour to eat each little piece of egg coated meat with vitamin dust. Then after my Sav has done his morning routine: Chase crickets and eat them, eat a 5 inch hornworm, and have his meat mixture, he is full. Once a week I give him one small mouse. He will always go straight to the bowl to soak after eating and then he heads out to the basking lamp for 5 or less hours, then he digs and works on his escape methods.
I lowered the temps and my Sav is doing better. I have a new book printed in 2007 that goes over the fact that they cannot tolerate temps over 120 degrees for over 2 hours or they get heat stroke - fattigue. Basking is no more then 120 degrees, surface soil is mostly dry all the time, When he sheds I give him a massage with olive oil to remove scales.
My monitor is very active now, lean and loving. I also custom cut leather to make a harness so I can have him outside on a leash with me when I'm gardening. He has his favorite hide spot under the tomato bushes.

wow your sav is spoiled rotten! i disagree with the 120 degree temp statement and i bet many people disagree with the leash. The only reason i have considered getting a leash is because when i take my sav outside (which i do everyday to exercise and go #2) she seems to get a 'big head', and rightfully so. i let her walk around until she is about to go somewhere she shouldn't then will go to pick her up and she hisses (sometimes) and even an occasional tail whip. I know exactly what she is saying " I WANT TO EXPLORE MORE, LEAVE ME ALONE!"... if i had a leash i could keep her closer and stop the big headedness. but the best way i have figured out to solve this problem is to build her a massive enclosure outside where she can free roam and explore and dig and not have to worry about me stopping her. This project is underway as we speak and is pretty cheap seeing that i only need to buy about 10 10ft long 2x4s or so and build a 'box' high enough to contain her. I am bored tonight, excuse the rambling.

Its amazing what you read here sometimes. Im not sure what your experience with monitors is but your husbandry methods contradict everything that any of us who successfully keep monitors do. Just a thought. I may be wrong. Ian

Well that is why i post on here; to make myself look like an ass and to learn from you experts! God!

...

i call bs. what book was this that you recently read on temps?

i think you are trolling for a reaction : )
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robyn@proexotics.com

Pro Exotics Reptiles

I am having a difficult time seeing how you get from "exposure to temps higher than 120f for more than two hours causes heat stroke" to "120f is too hot for a monitor to bask at." That is some pretty feeble logic that fails to account for the basic thermal ecology of a reptile. I would not be in the least bit surprised to find that forcing a monitor to stay at 120f for 2 hours is severely detrimental to its health. I don't however recall ever hearing anyone state that a properly appointed monitor (or any other reptile cage)should contain only one temp. A basic understanding of a reptile's needs should lead you to the conclusion that they require a range of temps that allows them to choose what temp they need at any given time. I do know, from personal experience, that monitors will seek out temps much higher than 120f when needed. The same lizard will also avoid the higher temps at other times.

Cheers,
Steve

Air and surface temps before you make that statement, the air temps above a surface temp of 195f is about 90% or less (depends on the surface involved and how far away the heat source is, also depends on the size and wattage of that heat source).
I dont use anything bigger than 45-65 watt halogen bulbs.
My monsterous albig (almost 7ft as a female) uses 2 bulbs, one is a 45 watt bulb, and one is a 65 watt bulb, depends on the time of year there may be one other bulb or 2 in that cage. My flaviargus uses 2 bulbs at 45 watts each. My ackies and beardies have always used 45 watt bulbs, and at one time a 25 watt bulb, keep in mind these are big cages.
The basking spots range from 145f to 195f in all cages.
Beware of what you read and by whom it was written most authors are not keepers, and rarely a one is sucessful at keeping them alive for long.

it sounds like you have quite the collection... I wonder how you people have room for so many monster size monitors and enclosures, One day, I will have many monster lizards as well, after i make my first million ( I am still a college student, mind you). 'cool'

Over years.
I had (not too many years ago)...
2 BT/WT crosses..
1 cape banded WT..
4 red ackies...
1 storrs...
1 flaviargus...
and multiple beardies that I bred...
also a few snakes..

I reduced my collection to make better use of time with 2 huskies, alot of hiking, and outdoor activities, a full time career, a wife, a cat, etc.
Now I have a giant BT/WT cross..
a flaviargus..
2 ackies...
1 beardie..

Hello Jeff

Theirs a few things I don’t like about your set-up, first the dirt type! Then the hide.
Dirt should be dry on the surface, monitors walking on it should not be in contact with moisture, this could result in foot or belly abscess (bacterial infection)
Secondly your hide should be removed until your lizard is fully healed, any friction on his scares could aggravate or complicate healing.

Monitors have amazing healing potential, they don’t need any ointments, in fact they often act as retardants. I use methelyn-blue as a bacteria barrier, one application only is all that’s needed, the lizards do the healing on there own.

4 mice a week is enough to sustain your monitor, offer one every second day and he should slowly burn excessive weight.

Not the best advice but that’s how it works for me.

you can remove a hard hide, but the animal should still have a hide. try cork bark flats, or even sheets of newspaper. he should still have a safe retreat that visually cuts off from the outside world : )
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robyn@proexotics.com

Pro Exotics Reptiles

What about a "pre-dug" burrow? I think he would investigate if I dig one for him. Plus he gets the humidity

i feed my sav 4 adult mice every other day. and she looks thin compared to yours. this is an old pic-

i take her outside and she walks around for a few hours each day, but besides that she doesn't run marathons or anything. 'weird'

here's another one:

Get that Sav a tree already
That has to be one of the cutest monitor pics I've seen yet.

Susan.

Ha thanks! For awhile she thought that she could escape by jumping from her log to the lamp cover, but instead she would just swing on it like tarzan, then fall off.

*side note- since this pic I have repositioned the lamp to prevent burn- related injuries or escape... she is a smart lizard!

Actually the cage should supply all needed exercise and activities. My 2 large monitors eat guinea pigs the size of your monitor, but as adults they dont need to eat so much now.
Try feeding daily, even the number of meals out you do feed in that way. After say 6 months try every other day, maybe less food. Try it for a while then adjust as needed, play it by ear, monitors are great teachers on theiir own husbandry. You may just need an interperter here to read what it is saying sometimes.
Good luck.

Do monitors normally avoid burrows they don't dig themselves? I dug a nice one for him to see if he would use it, but no dice. it might be the dirt, he dug a couple when I first put him in the new cage, but he hasnt in a while. They inquisitive animals, shouldn't he be investigating?

Just wondering if anybody has ever seen a lizard this obese return to a normal size?
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Mampam Conservation

RE: Posted by: mampam at Fri Jul 25 12:34:37 2008
Just wondering if anybody has ever seen a lizard this obese return to a normal size?

We had a large Sav come to us from the SPCA taken on a drug bust. It was supposed to be the new "guard dog". It was grossly obese and could barely lift itself to walk.

We put it on a diet of crickets to try to get it moving more within its enclosure. We also built a large outdoor enclosure with climbing branches, resting on the ground... basically low hurdles so that if the lizard walked forward, it had to climb up and over a small log or rock. This seemed to create the extra exercise needed, as well as allowed it to strengthen its legs.

In addition to the bugs, the sav was fed small mice twice a week, small amounts of ground turkey with supplements twice a week, mid-day after cricket hunting. We also substituted in other meats including snails and crayfish.

It took 9 months or more for the lizard to drop from severe obesity to close to normal size. The lizard had other problems because we do believe it was exposed to dope both inhaled and ingested. The lizard was never quite right.

The lizard did well with the added movement and changed diet. It was adopted by another hobbyist and to my knowledge, it was still alive when I lost contact with that owner nearly 7 yeas later.

Cool! That's a happy ending! Thanks!
Daniel
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Mampam Conservation