Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Beautiful Laguna babies.....enjoy!

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Jerry Kruse

"When the character of a man is not clear to you, look to his friends." -- Japanese Proverb

Mmmm Pulchra. I love the red "eyebrows on the first one. My
female Bass Lake Multicincta has them too, but not as much as yours. Multicincta eggs should be pipping any day now. I'll keep you posted. Nice Z's Jerry! Here's a pic of my Southern Kern Co.
mulicincta male.
-Phil

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Work is the curse
of the drinking class!

Hey Howie, ya heard that? Niiiice Philly baby, nice. We should get your Kern male with my Kern female together -- they look like carbon copies! I'll play chaperone the first time, lol. Hopefully the next eastern I catch for you will live long enough to do something for you...hah!!! I want Howie to show us a little more around Va Beach if you ask me.......
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Jerry Kruse

"When the character of a man is not clear to you, look to his friends." -- Japanese Proverb

All we gotta do is bribe him with a bottle of 18 y.o. Scotch, and I'm sure we can make that happen. LOL!!!!!
Here's an old crappy pic of the female from my S. Kern Co.
pair. I'll update them soon.
-Phil

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Work is the curse
of the drinking class!

Those are F-I-N-E.

Congrats!

Tim

Well you know what I think. Otherwise i would not have been on the phone with you trying to get these guys.

Simply beautiful RARE Z's never seen much in the hobby anymore.
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ÌÏËÙÍ ËÁÂE!
"You do not breed them, they breed themselves. That sorta takes you out of the picture. All you become is a poop scooper and cage cleaner"
Frank Retes

VERY nice animals Jerry!! I was hoping you would post up some pix of these guys..

Good Work!!

~ Mike Russo

NICE Jerry!! I like seeing some of the solid black headed sub species of mountain kings being bred. It seemed to be more pyros and knobs you see the last few years.
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Randy Whittington

A large part of that is probably the stupidity of California law makers. I've no doubt the species would be safer in the wild right now, with a much stronger captive breeding population, if they could be commercially bred in California.

We aren't even allowed to possess pulchra - which is probably the most beautiful zonata.

My understanding is that zonata are more difficult to breed, high occurrence of proven males having off seasons etc. - so many breeders now make sure their females get several males - and probably other issues - anyway established breeding colonies were few outside the state when CA made its laws.

Furthermore, CA went and raided people who had legally imported agalma and took their animals.

I don't believe pyromelana suffered the same stupidity from law makers. Hence pyromelana are now well established in the pet trade, and people who want one don't need to take them from the wild to acquire them.

Way to go California. Way to protect your species.
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I decided my old sig was too big.

The republic of Kalifornia has many stupid laws. Their gun laws are also an abomination.
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ÌÏËÙÍ ËÁÂE!
"You do not breed them, they breed themselves. That sorta takes you out of the picture. All you become is a poop scooper and cage cleaner"
Frank Retes

They're actually not hard to breed once you figure out how. They do need a lot of TLC though for the six months or so that they are active. The rest of the year they are not feeding/and or are in brumation. That six month break is great for a mental break of caring for them.
Juarez Wonders

And the agalma you produce are outstanding - I want some agalma at some point.

I don't however want any until I have a little more experience with a similar species, especially the breeding part, since I would eventually want to do so. I'm thinking either greeri or knoblochi.

In your experience are they difficult to switch to rodent prey?
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I decided my old sig was too big.

It depends on each individual baby. In general, they are pretty easy to switch over. IMO a plurality of babies take unscented pinks right off the bat.

Stop that!! Last thing I need is encouragment to get more small tricolors!
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Darwin Rocks!

Sweet! Really lucky to be in a place where you can enjoy those in captivity.

reako45

I've worked real hard at putting together a small but proud collection of the montane gems, and I appreciate the support and warmth from you guys. Best wishes for all of our successes, and I was hoping to get to Daytone to potentially meet some of y'all, but it looks like not until next year. (Expletives, expletives, expletives.....%!@*!&#%$!^&!)

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Jerry Kruse

"When the character of a man is not clear to you, look to his friends." -- Japanese Proverb

Yeah! Keep cursing! I'm pissed cause
I've gotta drool until you start the Ford factory
for Zonata!
-Phil
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Work is the curse
of the drinking class!

Found On Road Dead ?

There's enough DORs already ...
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I decided my old sig was too big.

You are certainly among the top Zonata breeders Jerry! Not that there are alot, but you get the point. Beautiful!

Tony
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You can never have only one snake!

Those look great. I remember as a boy, maybe 8-10, living in a new house on a small "mountain" range in San Diego, between Oceanside/Vista if you know the area, out in one of the many nearby undeveloped areas with some friends, happening across one of those out, still on the side of a ravine. I didn't at the time think we had snakes that brightly colored, so i thought it was a toy and touched it on the back, and when it moved its head around at me, me and my friends just ran, screaming. Interesting introduction to kingsnakes.
I don't know much about my laws (still in SD area), but you're telling me I can't buy or own one of those here, or they're protected in some other way? They're really pretty, and I own a CB albino banded already. When I wild caught the San Diego Gopher, I remember some vaguely similar story, but that was a long time ago now. If I can't buy one, I could always head out to the parks and start looking... or is that illegal too?
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cdohna.googlepages.com
1.0.0 WC SD Gopher Snake, Max
1.0.0 CB Albino Banded Cal King, Manny
0.1.0 CB BRB, Mucalinda

So after that post i decided to try and educate myself. CA laws regarding wild collection are that nothing may be collected in ecological reserves, state or national parks, or monuments. SD mountain kings cant be collected at all in CA, in SD county, I can't collect any CA mountain kingsnake, and I need a permit to collect a common kingsnake. The document regarding CB is totally unclear to me at this time of night. But that does seem like a lot of red tape, even if it is arguably well-intentioned...
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cdohna.googlepages.com
1.0.0 WC SD Gopher Snake, Max
1.0.0 CB Albino Banded Cal King, Manny
0.1.0 CB BRB, Mucalinda

The permit is relatively easy to get if you don't have illegal animals in your possession and are not above possession limit on legal animals.

Commercial animals (all native gophers, maybe except santa cruz island, cal kings, rosy boas) you indicate commercial. Non commercial you indicate non commercial.

There is a limit to 3 species - I'm not sure if it is 3 non commercial species, or 3 species total, that you can breed.

Breeding (non agalma) zonata in CA is tricky if you live alone - because you can only take one from the wild. So either you have to collect a gravid female to start your colony - or another breeder has to gift you a cb zonata bred under permit.

There also is a limit of 30 total non commercial specimens, so if your breeding brings you above 30 you have until the end of the year to offload some. I believe WC of commercial species count towards that limit of 30 but I'm not sure. CB of commercial do not, but CB of non commercial do.

It's a lot of red tape, which is why so few do it in CA (though I suspect some do it outside the regs and just keep quiet about it).

Personally I think if they are going to keep the zonata possession/bag limit at one, the possession limit for people with RA permits who declare an interest in breeding zonata should be two.

That way people who don't have wives/kids could collect a pair - avoiding the need to collect a gravid female or find an existing breeder willing to gift them one.
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I decided my old sig was too big.

Yes, no San Diego mtn kings allowed. A real pity for us in California.

I would hope the regs change whereby an individual with a CA Fishing license can collect one (1) like the other subspecies or locales of CA Mtn King. Perhaps some day. Certain folks have done some great work putting together data for CA Dept of Fish & Game supporting a limited take of these animals.

All you need is a CA Fishing license for your Cal King.
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Mark