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Some kind of record black milk clutch

RobHaneisen Aug 14, 2008 08:39 PM

This clutch has got to be some kind of record because I've never heard of anything similar, at least from a milk snake.

My 2000 black milk had what I thought was her pre-egg lay shed on July 8. After 10 days and no going into her egg box I offered her food and she ate -- usually a sure sign that she was not going to lay during this cycle. I could feel the eggs inside her but they were not real close to the vent so I let her be. She wasn't cruising her cage or acting abnormally. She refused her next meal a week later, again nothing I was too concerned about because I could see she was pretty swollen with eggs. The following week she ate no problems. My black milks have been notoriously late the past two years so this would appear to be normal behaviour.

Then on the morning of Aug. 11 I noticed her curled up in a circle on the far side of her cage next to a piece of cork bark. And there was one normal appearing egg in the center of her coil. I freaked out and it took every bit of willpower to not shove her into her nesting box (rubbermaid box filled with moist sphagnum moss). But I left her alone and by the next morning she finished passing the last of 10 perfect appearing eggs - a full 32 days after her pre-egg lay shed (see photo - she's getting ready to pass the last one). It's been a couple days since she laid and the eggs appear fine. I candled a couple and they appear to have healthy veins. The female has also eaten with no problems.

My other female, the very next day laid 13 perfect eggs in her nesting box 16 days after her pre-egg lay shed.

Aside from my black milks being late again this year, I don't know what to make of this. For a female to hold eggs for 32 days post shed and have them all appear fine seems crazy. Anyone have any possible explanations or similar tales?

The weather here in New England has been on the warm and wet side this year, but I would think tat would cause them to go early, not late.

I'm curious to see if the eggs from one female will hatch much earlier but both appear to be about the same developmentally wise judging from the veins I could see while candling.

Rob Haneisen

Replies (5)

Dniles Aug 14, 2008 08:59 PM

Wow Rob, that is bizzare. I have never heard of anything like that happening. The most my gaigeae (or any milk for that matter) have gone is 14 days for me. 32 is crazy. Glad they all appear healthy. It will be very interesting to see how long they take to hatch now. Keep us posted.

Dave

DNS Reptiles

robhaneisen Aug 15, 2008 11:17 AM

Dave:

Yeah, it's really weird.

That's a nice big clutch you got there.

Rob

Tony D Aug 15, 2008 08:55 AM

Interesting story. I'm tempted to say that she just wasn't finding the conditions she wanted but perhaps they just weren't ready to lay. It'll be interesting to see if the extra tiem she carried them counts towards incubation. If it did, her eggs should hatch about two week prior to the more timely clutch. keep us posted.
-----
Darwin Rocks!

nategodin Aug 15, 2008 09:07 AM

Wow, two more huge clutches! I felt pretty lucky to get nine this year. It seems unlikely that such a prolific proven breeder would get eggbound, especially on fertile eggs. Maybe she retained the eggs because she didn't like her nest box for some reason? It will be interesting to see when those 10 hatch... keep us posted!

Nate

robhaneisen Aug 15, 2008 11:27 AM

Nate:

Thanks. This female actually was eggbound her first year breeding four years ago. She passed 7 infertile eggs and had to have surgery to remove the last one that was just above the vent. Looking back, I probably should have tried harder to push it out myself or deflate it with a needle.
The following two seasons she bred with no problems and laid clutches of 11 and 13 eggs in 2006 and 2007. The cage setup is exactly the same.

This time of year wen the females have eggs I will turn on their spotlamp for a basking area for half a day if they need it. I did notice that this female basked a little more frequently. It's a very low wattage (50) infrared lamp. Directly below the lamp does not get any warmer than 82 or 84 degrees and the rest of the cage stays in the low 70s.

I know most people don't use heat with black milks but I occassinally give them some spotlamp basking options. I figure if they go to it, they must want it.

I'll post when there's progress on this clutch.

Rob

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