Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Well, the clutch of five eggs just hatched from the Clovis black bellies.All five are aberant and all five are black bellies.The adults were collected from some empty lots in the middle of suburbia and now its all concrete.Out of all the kings found these are the only 3 that wre aberrant and black bellied.

Anyway, there was one full term dead in egg and four hatched out.

L8r Shannon

That's awesome!
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Arrrggg!
It's like Shalom, but for pirates.
- iCarly

Those are neat! I like the black bellies.
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1.1 Florida Kingsnake
1.0 Kisatchie Cornsnake

Very cool and super interesting how all the hatchlings are striped/aberrant yet the parents are pretty much banded... do all tha babies have black bellies (i have no clue how it works with cali kings)

the one in egg seems to be a looker

~Z

Dude… I am so glad I gave you those snakes Shannon!! There is no way I would have been able to breed them this year. I love the aberrant pattern on all the babies and it make me sooooo happy that you where able to prove them out. I wasn’t sure on the male at first. When I caught him I remember thinking…Oh just a normal Cal King. Then when I inspected him further he had subtle differences that separated him. Ether way he makes really cool looking babies.

Here is a picture of moma when I first found here two years ago.

Oh and I found four snakes at that spot all together. Hubbs has the other one and yes it’s a black belly too.

Thanks!!
Bobby MacGregor

There was a herpetology student I think at Fresno State, not too far from Clovis, who was investigating sexual dimorphic patterning in the valley black bellies.

Did you by chance let him look at your snakes?

I don't remember his name, but sometimes he is active over at a .com that is a field herp forum

Last I heard he saw a trend but didn't have enough data (specimens) to say one way or the other.
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Arrrggg!
It's like Shalom, but for pirates.
- iCarly

FunkyRes,

lol...your talking about me. I graduated in December.
My best friend David Tobler is the one who first noticed the sexual dimorphism that you’re talking about.

You may not remember you and I met at the Sac show last October in front of the table of the guy who owns that website you mentioning.

Thanks!!
Bobby MacGregor

Hey wow - I'm not great with names ... I guess then the right guy did see them
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Arrrggg!
It's like Shalom, but for pirates.
- iCarly

Hey Big Mac, you and Dave were spot on when you picked the males vs. females in the line up.Good stuff man.I think the other female is going to give me a small clutch any day now.

L8r

>>There was a herpetology student I think at Fresno State, not too far from Clovis, who was investigating sexual dimorphic patterning in the valley black bellies.
>>
>>Did you by chance let him look at your snakes?
>>
>>I don't remember his name, but sometimes he is active over at a .com that is a field herp forum
>>
>>Last I heard he saw a trend but didn't have enough data (specimens) to say one way or the other.
>>-----
>>Arrrggg!
>>It's like Shalom, but for pirates.
>>- iCarly

Judging from Shannon's results, it would appear to me that this trait may be recessive. He got all black belly babies by mating 2 black bellied adults. If both parents are homozygous recessive then all the babies would be black bellies. The low percentage of black belly morph among wild kingsnakes in the Fresno area would suggest that this trait is recessive also.

That is the generally accepted hypothesis with this particular morph. However, no formal “scientific study” has been done to prove this to be true that I know of. Maybe someone reading will be able to chime in that knows of something that I haven’t heard of.
Thanks!!
Bobby MacGregor

Yes, only 4 snakes were found in that "vacant lot" and all of them were black-bellied. Unfortunately, mine kicked the proverbial bucket a month ago. I was so sad, my shoes fell off...

>>Yes, only 4 snakes were found in that "vacant lot" and all of them were black-bellied. >>

That is a pretty unusual find. Normally these snakes are quite rare. Most snakes in one given area in which black bellied morphs are found are usually banded and "normal". One plausible explanation is that this trait is recessive. If the area in which these 4 snakes are found is a vacant lot, that implies the surrounding area is being urbanized, and the lot is a de facto island. By pure chance, the survivors of this island happened to be a family(?) of black bellied morph individuals.

I agree with you 100%. I can only assume these snakes share common relatives.

I have to drive by that spot nearly everytime I leave the house. I'm glad those snakes have produced in captivity. That spot will soon be homes...

The tail stripe on males is something I noticed a few years ago after seeing a number of these black-bellies. Though, I think Hubbs is leaving it out of the book because of the seemingly unpredictable nature of the aberrant markings within these kings.

There has been 2 wc females with tail stripes.... but 2 exceptions out of HOW MANY? The recent collected stripe-tailed female hasn't even bred yet.... She does have an extrodinarly long tail for a girl.

There aren't many pictures of Hubbs' stripe tail female from long ago, that went on to lay eggs. I wonder if she had big tail as well?

Here's some pictures of a few males that I've found...

Awesome man.They are so killer dude.I can't wait for my little guy to breed in a few years.

L8r

Thanks Mr. Brown.

Almost forgot this one:

Some jerk flipped it 2 feet from me, under a rail road tie of all places!!! Sheesh.... Not bad for his first one.