Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have a calif king who laid a clutch of 9 eggs 52 days ago. She has laid 7 more this week. Has anyone ever heard of this happpening????

Yep, it's happening quite often.. usualy 2nd is not so good (qty, qlty(fert, eggs size)) as 1st one..

For campbelli sometimes even 3rd clutch is not so unusual...
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Radim Soukup
www.kingsnake.cz
Czech Republic, EU

Are any of them ever fertile?

Yep, however fert ratio is usualy quite lower. This year I had 3x 2nd clutch (2x Ltca, 1x Pastel King) - Ltca1 (7,7;4,2) = 1st clutch (7 eggs, 7fertile), 2nd (4eggs, 2 fert), Ltca2 (4,3;4,0), PK (11,11; 7, 6).
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Radim Soukup
www.kingsnake.cz
Czech Republic, EU

Plus one thing. Regarding 2nd clutch you can expect a little bit earlier hatching than is usual for the 1st clutch.
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Radim Soukup
www.kingsnake.cz
Czech Republic, EU

It's a fairly common occurance and the 2nd clutch eggs are usually good, but in my experiance the clutch size is usually smaller and the eggs tend to go bad more often..

If your new eggs look good then incubate them like your first clutch and you should get some viable offspring..

Good Luck!

~ Mike Russo

Last year I had two females double clutch w/o second mating.

One of them was clearly infertile, the second - a few looked good but died quickly.

This year one female double clutched without second mating, same one that had a few that looked good the previous year.

This year, five looked good in second clutch - two made it past first week - one died after the halfway point, the other hatched and the neonate looks quite healthy.
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Arrrggg!
It's like Shalom, but for pirates.
- iCarly

Thank you. Only 3 looked ok. They are smaller than her first clutch which is hatching today. Thanks again.

To double or triple clutch is common with most colubrids and that includes all kings that I have worked with, and that is most of them.

The success of any clutch is based on support. Which means, first, second, and third clutch success level is based on our support. Its not based on the snakes abilities.

I have had no actual problem with the second or third clutches being weak or less then the first. In fact in many cases the second or third clutches are much stronger. But then, that depends on ME and my husbandry level(support).

When a second clutch is smaller or weaker, it simply means, my(our) husbandry is weak. If you want stronger second clutches, all you have to do in increase your level of husbandry.

The question of multiclutching has been addressed since the early seventies. To see folks still not understanding the hows and whys, is very saddening.

In simple biology, the strenght of recruitment is a sign of support, natural or otherwise. To read that many here expect successive clutches to be weak, is depressing. Particularly since highly successful multiclutching has been practiced in captivity for decades.

So if you want your animals efforts to be successful, then all you have to do is increase your level of husbandry, offer better choices, offer more food, offer better nesting, these and more really effect the strenght and success of your females efforts.

A simple thought, your snake does not intend to fail, they make this effort with the intend to succeed. What is failing is your support to allow the female success.

And please, this post is not about you in particular, but about this thread and the common thought that failure is the snakes fault. Its not the snakes fault, its ours for not properly supporting these individual snakes. Cheers

Interesting info. I took it as a rule that following clutches are less qlty ones..
My personal thought was that Female is quite exhousted after first one and not having a lot of time to recover before following clutch(es). I did not see there a lot of thing I can do with it, I have tried to offer as many and diff food in diff sizes as possible between clutches, but females usualy ate not so many as normaly..
But may be it's just not good timming.. may be a little secret is not what and how.. but more important when.. may be all that actions should start already when female is starting to carry/produce eggs of first clutch inside.. It's not my original idea.. but it came in my mind when I have read some article from Bob Applegate..
FR, can I ask for you thought and hints? Thank in advance for your reply.
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Radim Soukup
www.kingsnake.cz
Czech Republic, EU

The second clutch is only less healthy if the female does not re-breed the male after the first clutch. If she breeds again there is no reason why the second clutch should be any different at all from the first clutch.

Feed her tons after she lays the first one and then introduce the male again after about a week.

Its an interesting problem with keeping female snakes that I think people look at all wrong. If you take even marginal care of your animal, they will try to double clutch. Its in their nature. But with marginal care you get marginal results. So if you don't want that second clutch then you have to intentionally not feed her enough... see where I am going? Most people for some strange reason believe that it is stressfull to double clutch, but I think poor care and one clutch is worse than two or even three clutches and a well cared for animal.

And definetely rebreed if she ovulates (learn how to palpate). There is no point in wasting good eggs by not fertilizing them.

Cheers

Can you pls be a little bit more specific about "care well" ? My vivs are usually approx 70x40x40cm, have 1-3lt of clear water, colder area with moisture, dry warmer area, 2-3 floors.. for female I usually offer to choose between mice, rats and mastomys, each in diff sizes at least once a week. But still 2nd clutches are not so good as first ones. Based on your and FR XPs there should be something I do wrong.. any ideas?
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Radim Soukup
www.kingsnake.cz
Czech Republic, EU