Reptile & Amphibian Forums

i went to a store that i use to work at and they had an argus, i always wanted one and there is the best timing, so me and my mom helped them pack up(bc they were moving)and i got one..
here is some info for him

he is 3 ft some missing tail, a scar on his back from owner before store had in in a dog cage. and im gunna be building him a cage that is 6 by 4 with 2 ft

thanks for your help
im so exicted
-----
Zero to 4 legs
1.0 Black rough neck monitor
0.1 bearded dargon
1.0 ball python

soon to be getting either
0.1 Black throat monitor
1.0 Dwarf tiger retic
0.1 Ball python
1.0 Red tegu

That cage size is WAY to small for a full grown argus...

No it isn't.
-----
To me, it's a good idea to always carry two sacks of something when you walk around. That way, if anybody asks, "Hey, can you give me a hand?" you can say, "Sorry, got these sacks." -JH

I agree that the 6x4x2 cage size is extremely small for an animal as active as an argus,they are known to walk/forage for 3.5 hours or more per day,when conditions are favorable, which they should be in captivity.
Most argus In captivity that I have seen have rostral damage and are constantly "walking the glass".
I have seen them kept in 16x4x4 with lots of substrate to dig in
18" or so and they looked awsome.
Just my take on it.
Cheers
Ben

This is just my opinion, but if an argus is "walking the glass," there may be something wrong with the husbandry. Either that, or my three arguses are out of the ordinary, because I don't think I've ever seen them walk the glass. They just dig, eat, drink, and bask. My cages are 6.5' x 4'.

I mean, if we want to get technical, no monitor should be kept in a cage, or a room, period. They should be given acres and acres of land. But, where do we draw the line? For some people, having a 16' long cage just isn't feasible.
-----
To me, it's a good idea to always carry two sacks of something when you walk around. That way, if anybody asks, "Hey, can you give me a hand?" you can say, "Sorry, got these sacks." -JH

We draw the line when the cage no longer can sustain the animal and it's well being.

Such as say your argus outgrow the 6x4 or it is only 2 foot high and needs to hold more substrate, etc. etc. Then a new larger cage is needed. if one cannot adapt or change to the animals needs whatever that may be then they should rethink purchasing said animal.

Thats just my take on it, take it or leave it.

You're simply refining the question, not providing an answer. So, with your post in mind, when is the "well being" of a monitor not being met? Gary Quirk has bred many, many arguses, and has kept adults in cages as small as 4'x4'. Same thing with Patrick Nabors.

So, it's obvious the "well being" of a monitor certainly cannot be defined as reproduction based on your standards...but isn't reproduction in large part transpire once good conditions have been provided? Do you know of monitors who reproduce in poor conditions? My point is: if reproduction is not a signal of "well being" in a monitor (which happens in small cages)--what in the world is?!

"Well being" is subjective at best. I sure hope you're not implying that, if you cannot supply a 16' cage, you shouldn't own an argus. I mean, I know you love to start arguments with me, but come on...
-----
To me, it's a good idea to always carry two sacks of something when you walk around. That way, if anybody asks, "Hey, can you give me a hand?" you can say, "Sorry, got these sacks." -JH

>>You're simply refining the question, not providing an answer. So, with your post in mind, when is the "well being" of a monitor not being met? Gary Quirk has bred many, many arguses, and has kept adults in cages as small as 4'x4'. Same thing with Patrick Nabors.
>>

Your simply arguing to argue so whats new?

I am not saying you need a 16 foot long cage to have them be healthy or reproduce. My reply was only to your question of where to draw the line. Which is a generalization replying in a generalized way I mentioned "well being" for lack of a better word. Commen sense comes into play here. When the conditions comprimise or hinder your monitor then you may want to think of changing things.

You said your cage is 6.5' x 4' and so and so uses 4' x 4', uh by what? Do you have no sides on your cage? or is this length and hieght?

We could simply leave it with the old rule of thumb(twice as long as the monitor and as wide as the monitor is long) and save all the arguing.

6.5'x4'x3' - LxWxH

Your post implied that you agreed with Shawdow that a 6' by 4' cage was "way too small" for an argus, and that an argus' "well being" was in danger in a cage that size. That is what I disagree with, as the experiences of others suggests otherwise--is there something wrong with engaging you on that? I'm not trying to argue.
-----
To me, it's a good idea to always carry two sacks of something when you walk around. That way, if anybody asks, "Hey, can you give me a hand?" you can say, "Sorry, got these sacks." -JH

I don't have a problem with you as you call it "engaging" with me. I threw in the argument post in reply to you adding it to yours "I mean, I know you love to start arguments with me, but come on...".

Hows that saying go? Don't start nothing there won't be nothing.

If I wanted to say a 6x4 cage was to small I would of. Again my reply was to your phrase "where do we draw the line?" I realize this may not of been a real question at hand but that is what I addressed.

How old are your argus?What size are they?
Are they Panoptes or crosses?
I agree that husbandry may be the issue as I have never seen a healthy argus that didnt act like they were on speed.

I also think that recomending minimum cage sizes is cruel and unusual,if you can not properly house your animals,you have no business owning them.(by you I mean the royal you,editorial you ect.)
B

How large are your dum cages? I'd be willing to bet they are not very large, because you must keep them indoors the majority of the year, if not all year. You also have quite a few of them--do they each have at least 16'x4' to roam? We both know the answer to that--a definitive "no." So get off your high horse. If you truly believe what you are typing, you should just put your monitors out of their misery, because any cage you provide is going to be infinitesimally smaller than what they would have in the wild, and none of them are ideal.

So, why don't you tell us all how to "properly house" our monitors, as you put it.
-----
To me, it's a good idea to always carry two sacks of something when you walk around. That way, if anybody asks, "Hey, can you give me a hand?" you can say, "Sorry, got these sacks." -JH

Easy tough guy,
This is a monitor forum,we discus monitors here,which is what I was attempting to do.
A little testy are we?
I asked you a simple question.why dont you answer?
I keep my Dums in 4x8x8 enclosures.
I also have 4x8x2 laying/recoup cages for my females,and a large outdoor enclosure4x8x10.
Dums are considerably smaller than argus,and less active.
gotta run,will post again today
Ben Aller

He didn't answer because he was busy snapping at me.
But he did put his cage dimensions in a post directed to me
6.5'x4'x3' - LxWxH

Yes,what a pleasant guy he is!
Iknow,I know,takes one to know one.

I was just curious what size his monitors were.
I guess he just wants to bicker.
Jp, you never told me if your dum was captive bred,and of so by who? thanks.
Ben

when did you ask me?

He was a little import that I raised. He is no longer little though haha

I asked the last time we"talked".
That is very cool you have done a fine job.
Almost every WC I see is so skinny and stunted,they seem to have a really hard time comming back after the "middle passage"
dehydration really screws dums up quick.
good thing you got him as a juvi.
Get that guy a female and breed! I will take 3-4 of em off your hands.
Cheers
Ben

Samsun, I dont see how you think a 6x4 cage will comfortably house a 5' argus monitor. They are among one of the most active monitors. As Jody stated, theres a rule when housing monitors in minimal size cages. "Cage length should be twice your monitors length and cage width should be your monitors length." Now I just really dont see how you think a 6x4 cage is big enough for a full grown Argus. If you have to think as minimal as possible in housing monitors, you shouldnt own them. The bigger the better. Its as simple as that. But on a lighter note...

How are those Dum eggs coming along Ben?

Adrian