Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have Miss. Maps and Eastern Painteds.
Why do all of the care pages stress water temps of 78F and air temps over 80F when the native water temps here never get that warm. And the air temp has yet to reach the high 70's here in eastern PA. yet the turtles are out basking everyday. RES, Painteds, Snappers, Muds. I've seen them all. Most days so far, it's only been in the 50's and 60's. If the turtles obviously tolerate and thrive in these lower temperatures, why do we keep them so unnaturally warm, day and night?
Wouldn't they survive just fine in room temperature air and water, or am I missing something here?
Bob.

In the wild turtles often die of sicknesses and illness they recieve from the wild due to cold and other things. In captivity these warmer conditions keep it like summer to them all year long, which helps there immune system stay in tip top shape, and keeps them from becoming ill.

Like Stunt said, the warmer the water and air temp is the stonger the immune system is. Also if the air temp was cooler than the water, the turtle could have respitory problems and become ill and die. So try to keep the air temp about 3-5 degrees warmer byt putting a cover on the tank or something.
Chris D.

I have a great set-up temperature wise. The water is always 76/78F. The air temp is little over 80F. And the basking area is in the mid 90'sF. I have 4 very healthy turtles>
O.K., so the warmer the better.
Now then:
What brings a turtle out of hibernation when the water temps are barely above freezing (ice on the surface) and the air temps are in the 40's? Doesn't instinct tell them it's still to cold, keep sleeping? Or is it some other biological factor that brings them out regardless of the conditions? Conditions that could kill them. Which would be an "anti" survival instinct.
Hey Darwin, can you explain this one?
Bob.

OK, here you are asking a question, and people are nice enough to answer it. But yet you come back with some smart ass remark?
So what are you tring to say? That its good to keep captive turtles in 40 degree water? Try that out for us and tell us out it works out for you.

>>OK, here you are asking a question, and people are nice enough to answer it. But yet you come back with some smart ass remark?
>>So what are you tring to say? That its good to keep captive turtles in 40 degree water? Try that out for us and tell us out it works out for you.

It was a question not a smart ass remark. You need to chill out.
There are several reasons a turtle will come out in cooler then optimum temps. They might need water to hydrate themselves they might need sunlight to regulate their D3 production.
Remember, when these turtles are basking in cool temperatures, the sunlight will warm them to tempereatures higher then the air temps. Go out and feel a dark rock or a road that has been in the sun for several hours. The air temps could be in the 60's but the rock or road will be considerably warmer.
I have seen box turtles come out get water and maybe a few bites of food and dig back in. Usually on sunny warmer days. A few degrees can make a big difference to a turtle.
But as already stated....in captivity it is better to provide the most optimum temps and conditions to give your turtles the best chance at long, healthy lives. I personaly believe low 90's is a little high for the basking area but your turtles will let you know. If they only use the basking area for a few minutes at a time it may be too warm.
My personal preference is 76 to 80 water temps and 82 to 86 basking temps. This is for North American aquatic species.
The temps should be comparable to the turtles home range.
just my thoughts on the subject

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Jimmy (draybar)

Hello Jim,
Actually, I've laid a thermometer on the wood under the basking light. The temp went to 105F, that's 12" from the 100W bulb. I have driftwood built up in such a way that my guys can get within 8" of the light and they push each other off that high spot. My Miss.Maps actually fight over that high spot. If one guy is already up there and the other wants it, he's backs up to the other one using his rear shell like a wedge, sliding it under the higher turtle then twisting sharply to one side or the other. The higher turtle gets unceremoniously dumped to the lower level. Pretty cool to see.
I know these temps sound high, but my guys seem to like them. Even my painteds go high when the Maps aren't around dominating the hotspot.
Bob.

>>Hello Jim,
>>Actually, I've laid a thermometer on the wood under the basking light. The temp went to 105F, that's 12" from the 100W bulb. I have driftwood built up in such a way that my guys can get within 8" of the light and they push each other off that high spot. My Miss.Maps actually fight over that high spot. If one guy is already up there and the other wants it, he's backs up to the other one using his rear shell like a wedge, sliding it under the higher turtle then twisting sharply to one side or the other. The higher turtle gets unceremoniously dumped to the lower level. Pretty cool to see.
>>I know these temps sound high, but my guys seem to like them. Even my painteds go high when the Maps aren't around dominating the hotspot.
>>Bob.

Hey Bob,
It is pretty cool watching them position for the best spots. There are times when mine will be stacked 3 or 4 high.
That also goes back to what I had mentioned earlier. Let your turtles "tell" you if the temps are OK.
Sounds to me like your turtles are telling you all is FINE.
good luck
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Jimmy (draybar)

Do not misunderstand the difference between optimin temperature and activity temperature.

Yes the higher temperatures are better for overall health, digestion and normal behavior - in captivity. There is a world of difference between temperatures in an aquarium and in a pond.

The reason that turtles become active in the early spring when water temperatures are still very low is that the water temperatures are not low enough to allow them to continue hibernating.

At very low temperatures turtles slow down, stop feeding and hibernate. BUT as the temperature rises their metabolic rate rises as well, while it still is too cold for normal activity it is too warm to hibernate, they need to breathe. Add this in with the increased duration of light and they develop an urge to bask and further raise their body temperatures.

The water temperature could be 60, the air 70, but by basking the turtle can get his temperatutre up into the range where normal digestion occurs.

Darrell
World Chelonian Trust

Thank you Darrell! Checker, im sorry if you did not mean that last post of yours to be a smartalic remark, but to me it sounded like one. So sorry if i took your reply wrong.

Thanks Darrell,
It just didn't make sense to me seeing these turtles coming out of hibernation into an enviroment that their biological systems aren't supposed to be able to deal with. Cold air and even colder water temps.
So if just a few degrees difference in temperature triggers the wake up call, basically taking the decision out of the turtles control, then in theory: it once again comes down to who can outlast the elements until the conditions become more optimal.
"Survival of the fittest"-Darwin.
Bob.
P.S. Chrysemys, apology accepted. Hibernation in turtles fascinates me, especially aquatics that hibernate under water. I was trying to get a grasp on something that seemed self-destructive to the wild turtles that I watch at a park near where I work. Subjecting my own turtles to the cold, never happen, my babies are seriously pampered.

Yeh, sry when i saw the title "Hey Darwin answer this one", I took it as an insult... Sorry about the misunderstanding.
Chris

Actually it does get a bit more complex even than just a few degrees, the temperature will force an animal into or out of hibernation but there are also internal clocks that help animals prepare for things like hibernation, migration and so on.

In an experiment at a midwestern University they raised two species of birds for 8 years in a controlled environment. Both species went through their summer and winter molts - right on schedule - even though they were given 10 hours of light and 14 hours of dark for the entire 8 years.

Darrell

World Chelonian Trust