Reptile & Amphibian Forums

This is a newly aquired ATB from a seller here on KS..I have never seen this in any ATB and wanted some opinions from other long time keepers..I am guessing inclusion or possible vertebral injury. He arrived to me a week ago just before I left on business,my buddy who looks after all my snakes while I am away told me he hadent moved from the day he arrived..I removed him from the enclosure and found he can only right the 1st 1/4 of his body and the rest of him coils in knot like rounds..he will not grip with his tail and will not climb or move about...he will strike,but never will right himself more than the photos show...I inspected him along with two professionals and found what leads us to believe a previous injury or possibly inclusion onset. I have removed him from the snake room altogether as I dont need to lose thousands over a hatchling snake...the seller of course says there was no previous problems, but we know how that goes and those of us who have been at it long enough know that something like this doesnt progress overnight...so humor me as I am a bit upset that somebody would even try to move this snake in its condition onto a customer...and let me know what you think...I know mike,matt,ect could lend some insight.
thanks

I am really sorry to hear about your ATB he looks beautiful. So when he arrived did you unpack him and check him out before you left on business? And where you placed him in the cage he hadn't moved until you got back. Or did your buddy receive the shipment? The reason I am asking is like you said things like this don't happen over night unless it's an injury maybe a broken spine. What leads me in the direction of injury rather than IBD is the control the snake has with the first 1/4 of its body. I think if it were IBD you would see paralysis from head to tail and would not show such alertness. The strikes would look as if he were drunk since IBD affects the central nervous system. Actually maybe a little more info would help so I don't start making assumptions. I really hope he doesn't have IBD for your collections sake.
Good Luck,
Charles
-----
Charles

yes, I unpacked..and like most atbs I figured he was balled up defensively due to the shipping and stress so I placed him in the enclosure to settle in unmolested..outwardly he looked ok,but again I did not poke and prod him and check him from nose to tail as I didnt want to stress him anymore.

It breaks my heart to see those pics. That's a beautiful animal. It seems to me, to be doomed (that's sad) and I would hate ot think that someone would sell an animal in that condition. Maybe he/she didn't though, could it have been injured during shipping? Was the box packed and cushioned well?
-----
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Mike Heinrich,
Mike@amazontreeboa.org
www.amazontreeboa.org

no box damage at all, not even a crease in the box exterior.I was told by my friend Ben siegel that I should freeze the snake right away and get it away from any others I may have..which I have moved it already,but havent euthenized it.I trust his reccomendation and also have gotten an email from a vet for a major herp facility in florida that tells me to do the same. do you think I should do this or just ship the snake back to the seller?

That's a tough call, but Ben is probably right.
-----
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Mike Heinrich,
Mike@amazontreeboa.org
www.amazontreeboa.org

I.B.D - I HAD A VERY NICE HYPO MALE BOA DO THE SAME THING . 1/2-3/4 OF THE LOWER BODY ANIREXIC LOOKING WITH NO FUNCTIONS WHAT SO EVER . 1ST I NOTICED HE TURNED HIS BELLIE UP SIDE WAYS AND I NOTICED IT LOOKED LIKE HE HAD RUPTURED SOMETHING INSIDE I COULD SEE BLOOD WHERE HIS STOMACH WAS I THOUGHT HE MIGHT HAVE HAD BELLIE ROT OR SCALE ROT BUT THAT WASNT IT I LEARNED IT WAS I.B.D SOME CALL IT TWISTIE BECOUSE IN SOME INDIVIDUELS LIKE MY BOA 1ST I NOTICED A SMALL BONE LIKE LUMP IN HIS BACK I THOUGHT I MAY BE HUMP BACKED A LITTLE JUST KEPT GETTING WORSE THEN THE BELLIE TWISTED UP TO THE SIDE WITH BLOOD BETWEEN THE STOMACH AND SUB SCALES ,THEN HE TWISTED ALL UP KIND OF LOOKED LIKE HE WAS BENDING OVER BACKWARDS MY SUGESTION IS TO PROPERLY DISPOSE OF HIM AND CLEAN YOUR CAGES VERY WELL AND GET HIM FAR AWAY FROM YOUR OTHER PETS BEFORE THEY END UP IN THE SAME SHAPE-SORRY FOR YOUR LOSE I KNOW HOW IT FEELS

Well I had the chance to have an xray performed on the snake today by a very good friend and the result was no visual damage to the snakes spine...so this leads me to send him to my local herp vet for testing under the advice of many sellers and vets from online and the person who performed the xray today..just for my piece of mind since the seller has offered no compensation and is reluctant to even recieve the snake back after I offered to fed-ex it back to him...something most reputable and long time sellers would have done in the first place without question..but needless to say I will not name names here, most of you all know who it was already and those who dont-always remember to research and buy from reputable sellers who wont pass off below-par herps to you...all I can say is I should have known better and I should have listened to what others have told me.

That really sucks, I can't say much more than that or it'll get deleted
-----
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Mike Heinrich,
Mike@amazontreeboa.org
www.amazontreeboa.org

Yeah Mike, I hate to see any snake in a bad situation reguardless of the cause. The only good out of the whole ordeal is the seller has agreed to make amends on the deal and I have sent the snake back to him only to show I am not trying to scam him...although most of you guys know me and know I wouldnt pull anything on anyone..the seller never can know and there are alot of scammers out there so I felt it only right to return it for him to do as he will with it.As for my previous post I must say it sounds a bit harsh toward this seller but was not intended as so..he is a good guy and understand I am a bit PO'd over the snake being damaged/ill as I imagine anyone would be,but the seller in question has made every effort to right the situation and dispite this whole ordeal I would deal with him again.Thanks for the feedback everyone.

"That sucks" pretty much sums it up. Again I am really sorry about your situation. But I am glad that you resolved things with the seller. This is a reminder to all of us how important it is to quarantine new animals wild caught or captive born.
take care,
Charles
-----
Charles