Reptile & Amphibian Forums

OK if you recall, I posted that a gal I know bred 2 snow Corns? But babies were all Amel

First 1 baby shot they are all Amel

Now some shots of the male that has a pink tone. It was cold out when I took pictures of the male, so the pictures were taken inside under poor lighting with a flash. The first picture in his tank probably represents the best example of his color. Probably due to the incandescent lighting

Male shots

Now a few of the female. Shes actually a bit yellow. I thought she was more pure white.

OK who is not the snow corn? The Male which is more pink, or the female more yellow. Or both? And who is what, if not a snow?

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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

i
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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

I thought it would be easy....just spot the one that's actually an opal........BUT they both look like just snows to me, and I have hatched hundreds of opals probably......

......wierd........

..I have 2 opals that grew up all yellow patterned....bred one to ultramel het lav and got lav,opal, ultramels and all ....the other "opal" was bred to a regular snow and I got all snows.....so I figure that my 2 yellow opals are snow opals (3 way homozygus amel/lav/anery ) but I have to switch them next year and see what happens.....

.........So....your snows......look snow.......breed them both to anery and see what happens?..........???
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Wont happen. She if selling the male at the shop. I just have a few bloodreds. I wish it was a female.

I am beginning to wonder if she had teh female with a different male briefly? I'll have to ask her.
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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

like I said....doesn't look opal (male)....

if one is anery A and one is anery B it should look like a blizzard.....

I forgot about the third anery stuff.....the ashy......
I actually had thoughts that ashy was just actually an anery A or B mixed with ultra gene.....but it would still be the same...either A or B and not a third C in the mix....so there might be a C and ashy is different...ask Rich (look at his site) or you already know ashy is not compatible with A and B?...I never studied C...

rambling....

.......so.......other option would be keep a few amel babies and breed them together and see ...but can you tell A B and C apart???....probably not...and would drive you crazy again...

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Opals, as that was my idea that the male was one. My pictures stunk. I should have taken him outside later, but I was to busy.

But I know what he looks like, so I can compare him to opals
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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

I don't think my opals have alot of yellow if any on them.....
I am down to one adult female and a year old ultramel opal....but I'll check for any yellow at all....
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if bred to a bloodred, I'd get out cross bloodred with recessive amel and lavender. Hoping my bloodred is not het for amel.

breed those het outcross double hets, i'd get a mix one that might catch my fancy is the bloodred with teh lavender. Although not a pure bloodred.

Might be easier just to buy a lavender female lol
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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

They both look snow to me. Something's definitly off though unless the guess about the female being introduced to a different male holds true.

There was some talk on this thread about a homozygous amel/anery/lavender (snopal).

I have one of those and this is a pic of her.

That looks like a possiblity, but wouldn't the babies still be homo for snow and het for lav?

I think she had 9 eggs that made it and all amel.

>>They both look snow to me. Something's definitly off though unless the guess about the female being introduced to a different male holds true.
>>
>>There was some talk on this thread about a homozygous amel/anery/lavender (snopal).
>>
>>I have one of those and this is a pic of her.
>>
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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

yes ...if he was snow opal then the kids would have been snows het lav....and you wouldn't even know it...

....my "what I think are " snow opals were born with no color actually then grew into really yellow colored snows......the snopal pictured is pink.....hmmm...

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it could be sperm retention from last year.... females are known for storing sperm and using it later... she could have been bred last year or before the snow male got ahold of her... but thats another idea...
~kin
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~Sober Serpents~
www.freewebs.com/soberserpents
Corns, Creamsicles, A Black Rat, A pair of Leucistic Black Rat X Leucistic Texas Rat Intergrades, Thayeri, Cal Kings, A Jungle Corn, Ball Pythons, Leopard Geckos, Green Anoles, 2 Snapping Turtles, a White Cheeked Mud Turtle, an Eastern Box Turtle, a Bearded Dragon, an Adult Rescue Iguana, and A Baby Iguana

Humm steps out of the box for a moment..

Is it possible one of those amels might be carrying the emoryi amel gene? I don't know of or ever heard of anyone producing snows using the emoryi amel gene.. Would we produce and animal that would be similair looking to a snow that has corn anery and emoryi amel?

The obvious breeding attempts would be easy for the male.. Test to an Anery B and a Lavender...

The female.. Well its going to take a few years longer to prove her for sure..

Regards.. Tim of T and J

Far more possiblities that I was thinking. But a great example of when many people give up their snakes, and they are not sure what they bought, and maybe did some "casual breeding" then quit and the snake is lable unknown, except for what it "looks like" I was calling it I dont know, but looked like a bubble gum PHASE snow. That still may be right or close if it is the female with no anery gene. IF it was not retention, or IF the female was cheating with another male.

I'm so glad this is all cleared up.

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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

also a good point.... i have seen young hatchling snow creams... but never an adult... but i do know that the "snowsicles" as i call them, looked just like a regular snow... but the Amel siblings looked VERY MUCH like a creamsicle....
~kin
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~Sober Serpents~
www.freewebs.com/soberserpents
Corns, Creamsicles, A Black Rat, A pair of Leucistic Black Rat X Leucistic Texas Rat Intergrades, Thayeri, Cal Kings, A Jungle Corn, Ball Pythons, Leopard Geckos, Green Anoles, 2 Snapping Turtles, a White Cheeked Mud Turtle, an Eastern Box Turtle, a Bearded Dragon, an Adult Rescue Iguana, and A Baby Iguana

From my understanding the emoryi's amel gene is at a different allele than the corns.. Of course I now take my shoe off and hit myself with it, because when I think of it, it would not make sense with the results that were had, I think I better rule that one out..

Regards.. Tim of T and J

>>it could be sperm retention from last year.... females are known for storing sperm and using it later... she could have been bred last year or before the snow male got ahold of her... but thats another idea...
>>~kin
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>>~Sober Serpents~
>>www.freewebs.com/soberserpents
>>Corns, Creamsicles, A Black Rat, A pair of Leucistic Black Rat X Leucistic Texas Rat Intergrades, Thayeri, Cal Kings, A Jungle Corn, Ball Pythons, Leopard Geckos, Green Anoles, 2 Snapping Turtles, a White Cheeked Mud Turtle, an Eastern Box Turtle, a Bearded Dragon, an Adult Rescue Iguana, and A Baby Iguana
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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

>
OK here's my take...
They both look like snows....BUT...I remember someone posting pics of what they swore was a blizzard. It looked just like the female snow pictured.
We all said no that looks like a snow, never seen a blizzard like that. Well, if I remember correctly the "snow" did indeed turn out to be a blizzard.
Breed the offspring to a blizzard or anery B (charcoal) and see what happens. Might be surprised.
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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"Resistance is futile"
Jimmy Johnson
(Draybar)
Draybars Snakes

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yeah- i have a blizzard that is not "high end" and has some color to it.... i can post pics of her if you wanna see her....
~kin
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~Sober Serpents~
www.freewebs.com/soberserpents
Corns, Creamsicles, A Black Rat, A pair of Leucistic Black Rat X Leucistic Texas Rat Intergrades, Thayeri, Cal Kings, A Jungle Corn, Ball Pythons, Leopard Geckos, Green Anoles, 2 Snapping Turtles, a White Cheeked Mud Turtle, an Eastern Box Turtle, a Bearded Dragon, an Adult Rescue Iguana, and A Baby Iguana

>>yeah- i have a blizzard that is not "high end" and has some color to it.... i can post pics of her if you wanna see her....
>>~kin

yes please
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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"Resistance is futile"
Jimmy Johnson
(Draybar)
Draybars Snakes

_____

This is my Blizzard Detta- she isnt "high end" but is currently in shed... so i posted 2 pics of her just a few mins ago and her just last week....


belly:

Last week during feeding.... she has a greenish tint to her belly:

~kin
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~Sober Serpents~
www.freewebs.com/soberserpents
Corns, Creamsicles, A Black Rat, A pair of Leucistic Black Rat X Leucistic Texas Rat Intergrades, Thayeri, Cal Kings, A Jungle Corn, Ball Pythons, Leopard Geckos, Green Anoles, 2 Snapping Turtles, a White Cheeked Mud Turtle, an Eastern Box Turtle, a Bearded Dragon, an Adult Rescue Iguana, and A Baby Iguana

>>This is my Blizzard Detta- she isnt "high end" but is currently in shed... so i posted 2 pics of her just a few mins ago and her just last week....
>>
>>

see, now doesn't the female above kind of remind you of your blizzard?
I think it was snow to blizzard

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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"Resistance is futile"
Jimmy Johnson
(Draybar)
Draybars Snakes

_____

i think the male is a hypo snow... but breeding trials would have to be done.. female could very easily be an amel anery A and anery B mix.... no one knows what it looks like... BUT since no snows... possibly anery B (charcoal) my opals are babies so i cant tell if they are opals...
but it'll be hard to tell 100% unless breeding trials are done... we're all just taking a stab but none of us know 100%.

~kin
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~Sober Serpents~
www.freewebs.com/soberserpents
Corns, Creamsicles, A Black Rat, A pair of Leucistic Black Rat X Leucistic Texas Rat Intergrades, Thayeri, Cal Kings, A Jungle Corn, Ball Pythons, Leopard Geckos, Green Anoles, 2 Snapping Turtles, a White Cheeked Mud Turtle, an Eastern Box Turtle, a Bearded Dragon, an Adult Rescue Iguana, and A Baby Iguana

I am supposed to be getting a high yellow blizzard over this next week.. I will be working some whacked hours, so it might be some time before I can get soem pictures done to post.. Of course I hate bothering animals when they are in qaurenteen as well, but I will try to make an effort to get some done to post..

Regards.. Tim of T and J

tim,
that would just be plain cool to see i know mine has "alot" of yellow compared to some... but it would be cool to see

~kin
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~Sober Serpents~
www.freewebs.com/soberserpents
Corns, Creamsicles, A Black Rat, A pair of Leucistic Black Rat X Leucistic Texas Rat Intergrades, Thayeri, Cal Kings, A Jungle Corn, Ball Pythons, Leopard Geckos, Green Anoles, 2 Snapping Turtles, a White Cheeked Mud Turtle, an Eastern Box Turtle, a Bearded Dragon, an Adult Rescue Iguana, and A Baby Iguana

I guess the most likey is the female is a blizzard. I know there are other options, but I think that is most likely unless I find out she had the female with a different male.

But I think we need a name for these unknown genetic snakes. Since there can be so many possiblies, as in a mystery amel, sunglow, a snow like this one and especially a hybrid. A name that does not represent anything would be best. But then I thought a suffix to add to the likey morph. IN this case it would be a snow-(suffix). HHMMM what would be a good suffix?

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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

Hey Tom, I have not read any of the other posts, so this might be a repeat. Is there a chance that the female is just low quality blizzrd (low quality only meaning not all white, can see saddles). Just a thought.
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****Misty****

www.sneakyserpents.com

"The more things change, the more they remain Insane"

I wish you spoke up earlier lol. That's where we kind of ended up.
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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

lol. I still haven't read the other posts.
I have been working quite a bit the last few days. Sorry I couldn't have helped earlier!
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****Misty****

www.sneakyserpents.com

"The more things change, the more they remain Insane"

I mean about working so much!

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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

gotta pay for all my snakes somehow!
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****Misty****

www.sneakyserpents.com

"The more things change, the more they remain Insane"

could try to say something humoprous like better you than me. But in all honestly, I would LOVE to be able to work 40 hours a week. That said, I did not say i would work hard!

Take care
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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

lol. Now see, thats where we are different. I would rather work real hard, get 8 hours worth of work done in 3 and go home. I'd rather spend my time doing other things than working long boring (not hard work) hours. I need to find a job where I can go home when I am done, but still get paid for the whole day. Hmmm... pay for job done, not hours spent. What a concept!
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****Misty****

www.sneakyserpents.com

"The more things change, the more they remain Insane"

Generally customer service type jobs. You remote access to a server. Or you take calls. They do a switch on a long distance account so you do not get fees. There are some VERY good at home jobs, but they are hard to find. And I would thing very hard now.

I did remote tech work for a tele marketing company. It was sweet. Sit watch MASH and work on accounts, or server issues from my house. And nearly any time I wanted. When the national do not call laws passed the work slowed to teh point I had no work. I was going to need a fill job for a few weeks til they had things straightened out. I needed a job to get my wage loss from workers comp. That was in 2001. The benefit expired in 2002. But that is how I started helping my friend again at his shop. I worked for him as a kid from 1972-1980. He also my sons god father lol.

It worked out well.

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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

My third job is an "at home job". So is my 4th, if you count it as such.
My third being my snake business. At this point, it is more than a hobby. Especially since I have a business license now. My collection is up to 175-180 now, I think

My fourth, well..... I am a mom and head of the household! lol.
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****Misty****

www.sneakyserpents.com

"The more things change, the more they remain Insane"

the male looks like a coral snow (hypo)
and the female just a normale
they are hetero for amel and anery so
its normale that you get some amels

>>the male looks like a coral snow (hypo)

My understanding is a coral is a snow HET for hypo.
And when I looked at pics of corals they were a bit more orange. NOW I see this
[IMG]http://www.iansvivarium.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/morphguide/coral.html[.img]
and BING, he looks a lot like that. But I still read that it is HET for hypo, or can it be either het or homo for hypo?

>>and the female just a normale
I presume you mean normal snow?

>>they are hetero for amel and anery so
They? Ya lost me here unless you think the feamle is normal normal? Shes clearly not that

>>its normale that you get some amels
8 babyes I think all amel

Thanks, and if HOMO Hypo, I have a minor interest in him. If hes het hypo, prolly not.

Some info:
In the past, these animals were said to be just STRAWBERRY SNOWs. Today, CORAL SNOW describes a SNOW that also carries HYPOMELANISTIC. That may sound strange because AMELANISTIC results in the lack of the black pigment. The HYPOMELANISTIC itself seems to be on the other hand able to reactivate the production of red in the SNOWs so that it was, with some selective breeding, possibly to create SNOWs with lots of pink on them.

From:
http://www.kornnatterlexikon.de/index.php?action=2§ion=222#CORAL SNOW

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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

The more images I find look to have more orange and pink not just pink.

I also linked the image wrong. Just copy and paste the url of course.

This also brings up a need for a cornsnake image database. Many morphs vary. It would be nice to have a single place to see a pile of each type. IMHO
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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

>>>>the male looks like a coral snow (hypo)
>>
>>
A coral is homo for hypo, anery and amel (a hypo snow)
a coral snow bred to a snow still only gives you snows het for hypo

that scenerio doesn't give you amels
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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"Resistance is futile"
Jimmy Johnson
(Draybar)
Draybars Snakes

_____

Thank you,, I missed that all together.
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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

>>I sent you a link
It's got some good morph photos
I didn't look to see if it had any good shots of opals or snowpals or the others but it's worth looking at everything just to find out.

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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"Resistance is futile"
Jimmy Johnson
(Draybar)
Draybars Snakes

_____

Yes I did. I have way to many emails, so i did not see it right away. I also replied.
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Thanks for reading.
Big Tom

www.HerpZillA.com

There might be hypo involved in some coral snows, I don't believe this is a hypo snow..

Probably requires a different thread..

Regards.. Tim of T and J

>>There might be hypo involved in some coral snows, I don't believe this is a hypo snow..
>>
>>
>>Probably requires a different thread..
>>
>>Regards.. Tim of T and J
>>

what do you mean, some?
I was under the impression that Don S. coined the name for his line of hypo snows that had "that" look.
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Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"Resistance is futile"
Jimmy Johnson
(Draybar)
Draybars Snakes

_____

From what I understand Jimmy, some of the corals snows out there might not be hypo snows. We might have some snows that are dilute rather than hypo.. Its something to look into I figure ..

Regards.. Tim of T and J

>>From what I understand Jimmy, some of the corals snows out there might not be hypo snows. We might have some snows that are dilute rather than hypo.. Its something to look into I figure ..
>>
>>Regards.. Tim of T and J

Hmmm, so there could be several different gentic lines called corals?!
That's not good
-----
Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"Resistance is futile"
Jimmy Johnson
(Draybar)
Draybars Snakes

_____

>>the male looks like a coral snow (hypo)
>>and the female just a normale
>>they are hetero for amel and anery so
>>its normale that you get some amels

No
Corals are homo amel anery hypo
snows aree homo anery and amel
breed together you get snows (homo amel anery) het hypo
no amels
-----
Corn snakes and rat snakes..No one can have just one.
"Resistance is futile"
Jimmy Johnson
(Draybar)
Draybars Snakes

_____